You FAIL at reading comprehension. You attack the credibility of the developer and in the same sentence AVSIM.I pointed out that Ariane was the one that attack that developer first. FACT!My opinion, is my opinion alone i really don't care you agree with them or not, but to me they have clearly demonstrated how Product & Support goes hand in hand.Does that make me a a really excited user, NO! Does it make me a happy customer YES.

'If there weren't complaints about gauge refresh rate, a low resolution VC, and missing navdata, the 738 would be in my hangar. Guaranteed'Hi Kiwikat, I asked this question earlier in the thread as I noticed refresh rate issues on user videos. However, this is an FS9 only problem as answered by bob, and the refresh rates on FSX are actually fine. By the way, may I add that there are a probably a lot of 'neutrals' like me viewing the thread whereas many of the users posting are 'pro' or 'anti' Ariane, it would be a shame if it was closed because it got too confrontational. Regards, Anthony H.

Okay, here's an update on things. The final piece of stuff I need for my review arrived today, in the shape of the lovely and impressive 'Boeing 737 Technical Guide' by Chris Brady (www.b737.org.uk if you are interested in it - costs 25 quid). At 334 pages - and that's with very small type too - I've got a fair bit of reading to do. Nevertheless, it's a comprehensive guide to the 737's technical bits and bobs and is right up to the minute in what it covers, including all the latest gizmos to be found on the 737-900ER, such as the VSD, NPS and IAN. So for those who crave a review that covers absolutely everything regarding how realistic and close to the real deal the Ariane 737 is, that's what you are going to get from me.Incidentally, as mentioned by somebody in an earlier post, I can confirm the advantage of LULU for on demand printing of manuals, because that's how that 737 Technical Guide was done, and if you don't believe how fast that can get to you, here is my email order for it from less than a week ago:Thanks for your order from Lulu! Here's a copy of your receipt. Print out a copy to keep for your records.You can check your order status online: http://www.lulu.com/commerce/orders.php?fCRID=3088980Order Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009Order Number: 3088980Order Total:

Hello Chock,Im am looking forward to your review. Id love to know how this plane stacks up. I have been thinking about getting this plane for a while, but since now I know I review will be done, Ill wait for that first. Thanks for taking the time to do it. Im sure it will help those like me who are sitting on the fence with this one. Rob

Hello kiwikat,Here are the screenshots of the 737-800 x2 VC that you requested:Main PanelMain Panel Indicator Light TestOverhead PanelOverhead Panel Indicator Light TestOverhead PanelOverhead Panel Indicator Light TestA few more notes that I would like to add thus far:1) There is absolutely no problem with the refresh rate of the guages in the VC they are extremely smooth.2) There is no "arcane art of inputing Gross Weight into the FMC. It maybe different that what one is accustomed to however, it works perfectly as described in the manual. Evidently the way this system is modeled the FMC is monitoring the fuel sensors in realtime so if the aircraft is using fuel it will affect the gross weight. If the gross weight entered into the FMC does not equal the exact gross weight of the aircraft you will receive an "INVALID ENTRY". With the FMC open, I pause FSX, open the fuel and payload window, adjust fuel and payload as necessary, note the GRVW and enter into the FMC. The FMC only displays 4 digits for entry of the gross weight, however due to modeling you need to enter in the weight to three decimal places. So, for instance if the Gross Weight is 172343 lbs, one would enter 172.343 to input the correct Gross Weight into the FMC. Different Yes....Arcane not in the least.

Hello Chock,A worthwhile book to get your hands on is: Cockpit Companion-600/-700/-800/-900BBJ / BBJ 2Author:Bill BufferWebsite: www.fmcguide.comIf there is a pilot supplies shop in your area they may have it.Very good book for understanding this aircraft.Might be handy for use during your review.dbw

Actually there is a link to that very book from 737.org.uk and I was indeed looking at getting hold of that too, although my credit card is still crying at the moment from the recent battering it has taken (Air Hauler, DC-3 add-on, DC-2 add-on, 737-900ER add-on, the book I mentioned and one or two others, some stuff for my cockpit I'm making etc), so it might be a week or so before I indulge.Al

Here is the very bad Mod again :-))I'd like to thank you guys for this very interesting thread.We almost reached the 10.000 views and the controversy was actually constructive and mature.However I've read here and there few attacks against Avsim.That's not very fair for the volunteers that give their time to offer the best forums plateform for simmers and the free and efficient number1 library.For those who think a Mod is just a robot that can't give his opinion, here are some screens I've just posted about the CS 757-200.Yes I love this aircraft and I say it! (waaaow, this is another "hot" thread I am opening !!)Anyhow there will always be some individuals that are moaning but we are a wonderful community from all over the world and personnaly I am proud to be part of it.Best regards,David

The FMC only displays 4 digits for entry of the gross weight, however due to modeling you need to enter in the weight to three decimal places. So, for instance if the Gross Weight is 172343 lbs, one would enter 172.343 to input the correct Gross Weight into the FMC. Different Yes....Arcane not in the least.

The input is in "thousands of lbs." hence the decimal. Odd that they aren't display the sensor's weight data though. Many FMS' do, and one merely need copy the sensor data to the scratchpad, then press the LSK to load it in...

Incidentally, as mentioned by somebody in an earlier post, I can confirm the advantage of LULU for on demand printing of manuals, because that's how that 737 Technical Guide was done, and if you don't believe how fast that can get to you, here is my email order for it from less than a week ago:

That would have been me, Al. I know of LULU because I have a half-dozen books for sale through them (although none of them even remotely of interest to anyone here!) :(

There are plethoa "on-demand" publishers these days, possibly the best of which is Lulu: http://www.lulu.com/Anyone can have (nearly) anything printed, bound, and shipped at no upfront cost to the vendor. Ariane (or anyone else) simply sets up an account with them, supplies a link to the .pdf file(s), and Lulu does the rest. Since the vendor has full control over the files, updates are as simple as replacing the source file with the updated version. There's no wastage of pre-printed but now obsolete/outdated manuals! :( The "customer" purchases via Lulu at whatever "price" the vendor wishes. Lulu handles the entire transaction, then transmits the full amount to the vendor, less the "costs" that Lulu charges to print, bind and ship the product.The point being, that even after the "publishing costs" are deducted, the vendor winds up with MORE PROFIT from the transaction in the long run, since there are ZERO "inhouse" OVERHEAD COSTS to them! No support staff, no envelopes/boxes, no trips to the post office, no warehousing of pre-printed/bound manuals, et cetera.Best of all, there is extremely fast service for the customer! Lulu will typically process the order the same day (it's pretty much automated anyway), and ship the next day... :( In summary, on-demand publishing is a win-win for both the vendor and the customer! :(

please please finish the cx for fsx!! :)

Here is the very bad Mod again :-))I'd like to thank you guys for this very interesting thread.We almost reached the 10.000 views and the controversy was actually constructive and mature.However I've read here and there few attacks against Avsim.That's not very fair for the volunteers that give their time to offer the best forums plateform for simmers and the free and efficient number1 library.For those who think a Mod is just a robot that can't give his opinion, here are some screens I've just posted about the CS 757-200.Yes I love this aircraft and I say it! (waaaow, this is another "hot" thread I am opening !!)Anyhow there will always be some individuals that are moaning but we are a wonderful community from all over the world and personnaly I am proud to be part of it.Best regards,David

Great screen shots, not an owner of the 757 )Waiting for levelD on that as their hardware support amazing, however interesting to compare the shots with some of those of the Ariane, and the 757 cockpit detail blows away that of the Ariane one, just look at those throttle/flap/speed brake levers compared to the rather square ones on the Ariane.It seems that the Airane is a work in progress, and that hardware support(In some form) will come, along with a better FMC and Navdata, however I get the distinct feeling all of those will be at a price. Which is making the Ariane look even more over priced for the 70pounds it should contain all of that , for less I have all of it in the LevelD 767 already. One external review of the 737 already said that the product fits in the middle of beginner and advanced sims when comparing it to other options on the market. unlike the comment that someone said above that it was aimed above the "Simmer" hence the price.Its good to see Ariane are continuing to develop this product, and with the options they are suggesting they are working on then it will definantly push the aircraft into the more proffesional market, but it seems at present it lacks what some other sims already have, Navdata, a functioning FMC that doesnt require the pause button, and support for external hardware. Ariane need to be offering this and more to claim that it is above the level of other sims and not a SIMTOY, as I consider the PMDG MD11 and 747 still Simtoys due to their lack of support for hardware, althought they are top end simtoys.I hope Ariane do get this all done, I agree competition in the market is good for both the hobby and the purchaser, we dont want PMDG sitting on their lorels. Ariane need to actively show that their customer support is improved to quell the views of those that have received problems in the past, they need to communicate better to the customers the limitations of the software, and most definantly they need to change and improve the activation system, it doesnt prevent piracy, it in fact is more likely to encourage it, its quicker to rip off the net than it is to activate it at present. No system should take days to do. They need a system that protects their software from general piracy, but accept that they wont (and havent) prevent all piracy, but allows the genuine purchasers not to be persecuted for actually paying for it.Their web site although pretty, is confusing, as people have already pointed out their are entries in their shop for one-to-one support tickets, for re-activation etc. This sends the opposite message out to what some posters here have suggested that One-to_one support is free and in fact preferred, and that re-activation is free unless its your 10th request that week! The web site needs more technical details of the limitations of any systems on there, as it quite obvious their claims of some systems being fully functional is not quite the case, we accept there are limitations in any software/sim we buy, but other Developers point these out on their sites, or have the manuals to download before hand which then point out the limitations. Why prevent people from printing their manuals? If people want to buy the Bound ones they still will even if they can print them out, this is shown by the success of the LevelD manuals that you can purchase bound. and in fact again it takes nothing to get past the Adobe "No Print" function anyhow.We dont need this forum to become an attack on each other, and we dont need the Pro lobby just being pro becasue they are being attacked, or the anti lobby being anti because they are being attacked back, both sides need to deal with the facts, agree where items about the Ariane is good, and agree on the areas that could be improved. Both from the product and the customer support, Its a fact even the Mighty PMDG are not always without fault, there is definanlty areas that they could improve on in both the Software, and in supporting the customers wants, Ariane if trully honest cant believe they are totally perfect or their product, any company worth its salts, will always want customer feedback, being told by the pro lobby they are God and their product is without fault doesnt help them to improve at all, they'd give up patching it there and then based on that!Back in the Fs98 and Fs9 days, we had a massive choice of aircraft, sceneries etc, often the same aircraft/scenery from different developers, PSS/PIC/PMDG/DreamFleet/etc... it be good to get back to that again, and I'd welcome Ariane to be one of those companies, but that is only going to be achieved with our Constructve help and most importantly them listening. Because at present they have the monopoly on the 737 but come the PMDG they will have competion and from someone that the community already trust. They need to have in place a product and customer relationship to ensure that people feel they actually have a choice, otherwise they might aswell give in now.RegardsJames(who had the joy of flying a real 737-800 LevelD sim the other week.....and didnt hit the pause button in that either!)

Great post James and a very good summary of this long thread!

So whats this

I read a forum discussion a good while back, that if you reduce the loadout in the cargo baysby half, or just reduce the loadout overall you will be able to input the gross weight no problem. Seems that the bird comes fully loaded and is over it's cg tolerence therefore you will get the invalid message on the fmc everytime. I'll see if I can dig that discussion up, although it's been a couple of years.John B

The FMC only displays 4 digits for entry of the gross weight, however due to modeling you need to enter in the weight to three decimal places. So, for instance if the Gross Weight is 172343 lbs, one would enter 172.343 to input the correct Gross Weight into the FMC. Different Yes....Arcane not in the least.

I wanted to point out also that this is very realistic. I have Bill Bulfer's 737 FMC manual and on page 63 it says that the FMC will round off the GW, but will accept the full dismal weight just like Dave is describing here.Something that I am noticing from this book is that there are many variations of software being used in these FMCs and each version accepts inputs in a different way. When Cpt. Bulfer discribes FMC inputs, he will go over several software versions of getting the same figures put into the FMC.Different carriers use different software versions. When you see an FMC on a simulation that looks a little different from another, more than likely the developer has chosen one software version of FMC over another to simulate.Bob