I don't think P3d is in any way lost. The commercial form of FSX, ESP is used by many organisations. Even the Royal Air Force. They decommisioned two full motion VC10 simulators using ESP last year in line with the withdrawal from service of the old lady.

Flight is and will always remain an arcade game having to be in effect hacked to get any kind of improvement.

What do you get "out of the box"? Well, FSX fails there but can be improved. FS9 again can be enhanced to be at the level of an improved FSX and as a bonus run super smooth.

We'll all have to wait and see what DT comes up with. But I'm sure they're looking to do with FSX what they did to train sim.

Flight is and will always remain an arcade game having to be in effect hacked to get any kind of improvement.

 

I wish I could see the future that clearly. Unfortunately, I can only speculate (hopefully intelligently) and then wait to see what actually happens.

The one with the 3 in the title.

 

Spot on Rod.

 

 

Has LM really done anything more with ESP (BTW a 7+ year old MSFS engine) than to add eyecandy?  Does not MS Flight actually have the most recent MSFS engine?  Given this situation would not one want the latest and greatest?  AFAIK, LM has even stated they will do nothing to improve the FS engine; their stance is that it is up to 3PDs to provide such enhancements, such as A2A's accusim (which FSX is able to exploit as well...nothing new here).  All DTG has to do is to turn Flight into the sim its dev team originally envisioned and P3D will be the one left behind.  If DTG were to pull this off and add volumetric fog and enhanced ground shadowing, P3D will be completely left in the dust.  But will this happen... :Praying:

 

You mean other than the DX11 engine and tessellation features moved to the GPU from the CPU and a host of bug fixes and enhancements?

 

Its far from just 'eye candy' 

 

Its fair to say its far from perfect yet, but at least its being actively developed and worked on as the point releases already demonstrate.

Me agree too. My Fs2004 & 'Golden Wings' (a regressed version of FS9) get flown far more than P3D. Just far less hassles & better graphics of the area where I fly.

 

So right that we all approach the sims for different reasons.

Those that whant to play & fly the fastest.. this I have seen at our VA when we have open days, kids whant to fly fast & shoot & we try & get then into some sort of discpline about this.

 

Those that love the 'low 'n slow's'. I love flying the older prop planes to historic airports & situations.

Those that love the tube liners & want to fly as realistically as possible

Those that  on-line fly.

 

So to each his own then.

 

A large user base? Yes, maybe, but then the majority of the current user base have a sim anyway.

The new potential base? As I say, yup, getting them into FSX: Steam!

The new guys will have to be spoon fed to really get up to speed to get the sim tweaked properly.

We all know the issues of FSX. I got it as soon as it was released & the tweaking never stopped.

 

My story? I moved with the times & shifted to P3D.  Never mind the "Professional Trainer" tag.

When I saw how much better, in all aspects, than FSX, I just had to retire FSX.

 

So what are the main-stream choices for a newbie out there what wants a flying sim & not a combat sim?

X-Plane (from Steam)

FSX: Steam  ( from Steam eventually)

A.N.Other sim from Steam.. dunno when we will see that?

FLIGHT? - not sure if you can still download it for free & get it registered.

P3D - from LM

A few assorted freeware sims

Maybe a few that I have missed..

 

I surpose there is room for all out there.

 A most interesting discussion, thanks to all.

Interesting to see the mods of shoehorning FSX scenery into FLIGHT. The planes also being converted?

So, where do we, existing simmers, fit in the greater scheme of things.

 

Hacking Flight to look like FSX? Copyright issues? Surely some guy/company's work cannot be decompiled?

 

vololiberista makes a lot of sense.

 

 Off the subject somewhat, I also fly 'TheFlight' from http://www.imoox.com/newImoox/TheFlight/TheFlightGame.html  --- but that's another story! ;-)

Eh, I have  lot of things I mess with from time to time. FSX, ROF, DCS, XPX, FLIGHT, Outerra, Aerofly, Wings of Prey, War Thunder.... and then there are all the space-sims, new and old. Each scratches a particular itch and holds a particular bit of mind-share from me, just at different times, and all are valued in their own way.

 

If DTG comes out with something, I will look at it using my main criteria: Is it interesting?

 

If it is, then unless the price is outrageous, its probably sold.

 

If DTG comes out with something, I will look at it using my main criteria: Is it interesting?

 

If it is, then unless the price is outrageous, its probably sold.

Just don't get taken in by their hard sell.

Yup, my itches also get scratched with 'TheFlight' from http://www.imoox.com...FlightGame.html  --- & it comes with 4x aircraft by Carenado and Alabeo.

I had never heard of The Flight before you mentioned it, Robin. Based on the description, it reminds me a lot of the original Flight Unlimited.

 

EDIT: Ah, it's for mobile devices.

I had never heard of The Flight before you mentioned it, Robin. Based on the description, it reminds me a lot of the original Flight Unlimited.

 

EDIT: Ah, it's for mobile devices.

 

Yes, and on my ipad the control system drove me completely insane and it was uninstalled in a fit of rage! 

HughesMDflyer4

 

Is this a Dovetail FS2015 shot official? 

 

 

No, the screenshot I posted earlier on was taken in Microsoft Flight (in southern California) using Steve's currently in development FSX to Flight scenery converter.

 

 

I have to agree with that. Whilst I am sure that getting all of that stuff into MS Flight is a significant technical achievement, those graphics don't look any better than FS2004.

 

Agreed! I use FS2004 and my graphics of Paris are much more superior.

 

For the record, the conversion isn't finished. There's lots of missing buildings and vegetation that have either not been converted over yet, or not been remapped to Flight-equivalent autogen. Some is even mapped to improper autogen for what is appropriate for the region it is in. Landclass blend masks are also not working yet, so the transition from one to the next is rather abrupt currently. What you are seeing is NOT the end result. With full autogen and the far superior rendering engine of Flight, the end result should at least look better than FSX.

 

 

 

If Dovetail makes a sim based on the Flight engine and keeps the same file formats currently, Steve's (Stonelance) efforts to make tools might come in handy if they don't release an SDK with everything we need right away.

My view of Steam is a little different than what a few others have espoused in this thread. First of all, Steam is designed to combat the pirating of PC games. Second, it is also designed to put the "little guy" online game retailers out of business. Third, it is designed to eliminate the hassle of a game's developer also having to provide their own eCommerce website to sell the app in a downloadable form. In that limited sense, both LR and DTG are both smart in using Steam. 

 

The guys that will be hurt  in the long run if flight sim content keeps moving to Steam are Flight1, FlightSim Store, FS Pilot Shop, etc..

 

 

The guys that will be hurt  in the long run if flight sim content keeps moving to Steam are Flight1

 

So Flight1 signed on with Steam in order to get hurt in the long run? You do know that the 2 have struck a deal already, right?

 

 

You mean other than the DX11 engine and tessellation features moved to the GPU from the CPU and a host of bug fixes and enhancements?

 

So if I port over all my FSX stuff into P3D what will I be looking at?

 

What actual program differences are there between the 2? What new features have been added? No DX11 and tessellation features are not new features. 

So Flight1 signed on with Steam in order to get hurt in the long run? You do know that the 2 have struck a deal already, right?

 

I don't think Flight1 counts as a small developer.  He's talking about the 1 man shops, which based on what I hear in the train simulator community, is very hard to do through Steam. 

 

 

I don't think Flight1 counts as a small developer.

 

You might not. but the quoted poster does.

 

Anyone think that all of this Steam stuff might actually HELP developers instead of all this doom and gloom?

Compared to Steam, Flight1 is a tiny operation. Flight1 sells both their own products and products developed by other people. I stand by what I wrote. Why buy a product on Flight1 when you can buy it directly on Steam? In the PC game arena, only the biggest developers like EA have resisted the move to Steam. EA has it's own Steam-like website, Origin.

 

 

I don't know where you are getting "doom and gloom".  Steam has probably saved PC gaming from a complete and final meltdown. Piracy was running rampant because it was almost impossible to prevent it when PC games were sold only on CDs or DVDs. I'm all for having a website like Steam and I pretty much buy any PC games that I buy these days from Steam. But there will be consequences for anyone competing with Steam. Maybe Flight1 wants to get out from under the overhead of delivering content directly to the consumer. I'm not privy to their motivation.