:-D

You guys are so funny.

 

Edit: i am not childish, I am ELITIST!!!!

This was a topic with a civilized and fact based discussion. And then this troll comes around. Sad, but this unfortunately happens to many topics here on AVSIM. 

I think other developer have made the same mistake and then after some mounth you saw plenty of promotion nearly at 30-40% off.

So stay tuned on your preferred shop and you will see Fs2crew on sale!

I also think that the 777 is so easy to fly, that you don't really need a copilot, on the other end the 737 and the 747 needs are more tasks.

 

1 hour ago, swiesma said:

:-D

You guys are so funny.

 

Edit: i am not childish, I am ELITIST!!!!

The problem is because of the likes of you that will just accept any old crap is the other developers will also go along with this line.

Let me give you a couple of examples.  

In the UK our trains are terrible they are over priced and their on time performance is terrible.  Now because the people in the UK are wimps and dont complain, they just "take it", nothing ever changes and the prices go up each way way beyond inflation.  To the point that it now costs over £1 per mile to travel by train, tube or bus.  

Now in France and the USA for example if you had the same thing the French and Yanks would riot, complain and boycot it.  Hence the French and for the most part the USA public transport system is reliable and good value for money.  They wont be getting ripped off.

Another example is the pay to beta crap we have seen from the likes of FSL,BBS.CLS,and Flight 1  pull.  

This is because other developers have gotten away with in the past BBS and CLS, so FSL and Fight 1 have followed suit.  But once again because people like yourself  think its ok, so this is now the new norm.

I predict the next one will be paying for support per year.  Chris Bell is the first to be trying it, so I hedge my bets the next company to pull this stunt will be Flight1, this end opens the doors to the other developers doing it.  If theres extra money to be made, the developers will try it.

This is social conditioning at its worst.  The more you push it, the more its the norm, the more people will just accept it.    

 

 

 

 

14 minutes ago, tooting said:

This is social conditioning at its worst.  The more you push it, the more its the norm, the more people will just accept it.

If I was to purchase Fs2Crew again the total cost for me would be 88 Euro, about $130 NZD ( costs include the extra voice pack ) the PMDG 777 cost me $120 NZD (P3D) so FS2Crew cost more than the bloody plane

And exactly what was compiled to make fs2crew work in P3DV4 ? A couple of guages ? Most of us operate on a 64bit bit platform, so most of the hard work is already compiled. I love my hobby, but not that much when I feel a developer maybe guilding the lilly.

well i am with the majority of simmers on this post

i just cant see the business sense in charging nearly full price

i think a lot of simmers are going to turn there backs on FS2CREW 

i am one of them

30 minutes ago, jeff20 said:

i just cant see the business sense in charging nearly full price

Yep. I would have upgraded all the four FS2Crew products I own (777, NGX, Aerosoft Airbus, Q400) even if that would have meant paying an upgrade fee of up to 50% of the full price. But now I'm not going to upgrade any of these products and most likely will not buy any future product from FS2Crew. It is just a stupid business decision completely disregarding how important customer loyalty is.

But wait. Maybe I'm just underestimating how many stupid people there are who are willing to pay full price for this again. So it might not be a stupid decision after all. Just makes you wonder who is stupid... ;-) Ok, sorry, I'm getting a bit off-topic here.

To add even more legitimacy to our claims, below is a recent article posted on AirDailyX with regards to MilViz upgrade fees for P3D V4. I've highlighted the most pertinent points:

 

"Perhaps the best news in relation to the advent of P3Dv4 is the notion that nearly  all developers would be releasing compatibility updates to to the new platform free of charge. MilViz has instituted an upgrade charge of $5 per addon and has decided to reverse the decision announcing that those who paid for the upgrade will receive refunds. Here's the statement from MilViz:  

"Dear Clients, Regarding the upgrade to v4.
In hindsight it is clear that charging our valued third party vendor customers $5 to upgrade was a mistake; a mistake we would like to rectify as soon as possible. We are therefore arranging to refund your $5 and offer all existing owners the upgrade gratis from now on.
We unreservedly apologise for the inconvenience.

Best wishes - Milviz"" (link to article - http://www.airdailyx.net/fsnewsbreaker/2017/7/6/milviz-reverses-compulsory-charge-on-v4-upgrades)

So here we have a company reversing its decision of a mandatory $5 install fee (which I would consider to be a reasonable upgrade fee).

Yet, we've heard nothing from Bryan York. I've linked him this forum. We've all posted in the FS2CREW forum. He is still treating us like fools. 

10 minutes ago, Alex222 said:

Yet, we've heard nothing from Bryan York. I've linked him this forum. We've all posted in the FS2CREW forum. He is still treating us like fools. 

I can only summise that he is cashing in on the new fsx to p3d users. I don't like saying this, but what else am I suppose to think ?  There is not many aircraft coming up (new) with an SDK that he can create new products like fs2crew. FSLA320 being one.

I think loyalty has gone out the window with some developers, but some if not most have been very gererous and loyal. FSDT is one that I can imagine would have been a lot of work involved getting their products 64bit ready, yet it cost me not a jot.

Has the tide turned when we say no ? we don't accept this and vote with our wallet, and remove our loyalty.

It is not all about the developer, they would not exist if we did not purchase their goods, clear and simple.

Never thought I would be posting this about FS2Crew, but there you go.

 

 

TBH, I've gotten used to flying without FS2Crew. Plus full price? Really? Nah!

I own fs2crew for NGX and NGX reboot + voice packs both times,  777, aerosoft airbus, and I even have the MD11 and previous pmdg747.  willing to pay an update price, but I'm not buying this again full price.  I just won't do it sorry.  the thing that really irks me as well is that there is a 5 euro "loyalty" discount offered.  which might even be acceptable if I hadn't shopped there for years and realize that EVERY fs2crew product has that discount, so it's just full price as usual.

But to be honest, what do we expect?  The developer has to know that if we're shopping for addons for the pmdg p3d products that we are already willing to swallow ridiculous gouge jobs.  Hell, my rectum still hurts from the great PMDG "update" scam of 2015 (where the update, to be fair, had some upgrades to accommodate cockpit shadows, but was mostly just removing the intentionally crippling code they had in the FSX version that artificially made it incompatible in the first place)  our reward for "loyalty", a 140%  fee so we can purchase the exact same product again!  yay, us!  

of course, all I hear on the forums these days is the constant bleating about the PMDG v4 updates being free,  excuse me while I don't share that view.

PMDG make great sims.  I wish I could say I didn't cave, but I did.  I bought the NGX again and the T7.   didn't buy the 747, and probably won't, even though I want it badly, so at least I am that strong.

I understand there is work on this. I am not begrudging fs2crew or PMDG for that matter, a revenue stream.  I am also not broke, I have spent thousands on flight sim addons, and have no issues buying more, or paying fair value for upgrades that require real work.  but right is right and wrong is wrong.

20 hours ago, swiesma said:

:-D

Edit: i am not childish, I am ELITIST!!!!

You do know what 'elitist' exactly means, don't you?
 

9 hours ago, Travelling_Wilbury said:

I can only summise that he is cashing in on the new fsx to p3d users. I don't like saying this, but what else am I suppose to think ?  There is not many aircraft coming up (new) with an SDK that he can create new products like fs2crew. FSLA320 being one.

I think loyalty has gone out the window with some developers, but some if not most have been very gererous and loyal. FSDT is one that I can imagine would have been a lot of work involved getting their products 64bit ready, yet it cost me not a jot.

Has the tide turned when we say no ? we don't accept this and vote with our wallet, and remove our loyalty.

It is not all about the developer, they would not exist if we did not purchase their goods, clear and simple.

Never thought I would be posting this about FS2Crew, but there you go.

 

 

Perhaps this is the case. Nothing wrong with trying to capture revenue stream from people moving from FSX to P3D v4, or who have not been previous purchasers. But for those of us who ARE previous purchasers (and who are were probably loyal customers I might add) then why not offer an cheaper upgrade path? I don't expect him to work for free but I do expect to be treated right as a customer. Slapping this cost on us is simply wrong. It's not a new product, it was released only a few weeks after v4 came out, therefore it is reasonable to perceive that not a lot of work was required in the conversion (and it must have been a very short testing period too). Most other devs are either providing upgrades FOC, or at a nominal cost, and with Milviz's recent admission that they will absorb upgrade costs for people who did not purchase through them - that is an example of how to treat customers right and keep them on-side. It seems to me that Bryan stands more or less alone in trying to charge more or less full price for what amounts to a relatively simple conversion. I am happy to stand corrected on this if it is not the case.

And you're right, it isn't all about the developer.

 

 

2 hours ago, jjf said:

Perhaps this is the case. Nothing wrong with trying to capture revenue stream from people moving from FSX to P3D v4,

Yes, agree totally. What is more concerning, is he knows about this thread, he has read it, but is yet to reply to our concerns.

His choice, I will just re direct my spending to another more deserving developer.

 

he  already  explained  why  his  has  gone  this  way on other  threads  and  why  the  full price