tutmeister

Monarch ceases trading

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Wow, didn’t see this coming. Not that I’m an insider so why would I but I’ve always had a soft spot for Monarch due to plenty of family holiday flights from Manchester and Liverpool.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41464934

Sad news for passengers and staff. CAA doing the right thing for everyone too, good job.

Chris

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Sad news indeen.

European sky is traded by a lot of actors with prices underevalueted... Only one way for future... Passengers must paid the right ticket-value for a travel.

 Perhaps a first Brexit consequence by the traders and investors.

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Apparently they nearly went bust last year. One of the primary reason is that they weren't competing with the super budget ones as they charged a bit more but fed you. Their money makers were Egypt, Turkey and north Africa which obviously have taken a dive in appeal so they have had to start competing with shorter European destinations and they couldn't compete with the short haul. They weren't the cheapest but did trade on giving a better service than Easy, Ryan and Jet2.

As I heard someone say on the news, people will put up with anything on an hour or two flight and will usually choose based on price only.

Chris

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Sad news, I had my only ever flight on a Boeing 707-720B with Monarch, never forget that.

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1 minute ago, ukplane1 said:

Brexit means Bankruptcy 

Sigh...without turning this into a political discussion...we are still in the EU.  Monarchs downturn as indicated above was primarily due to the decrease heading to the somewhat more terrorist prone countries of North Africa.

I hope that the people affected swiftly find new positions. 

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This happened last year,but they got funding at the 11th hour,so unfortunately it was on the cards.

Unfortunately with the likes of ryanair and easyjet the whole industry is in a race to the bottom.

Hopefully it will be ryanair next but unlikely unless he continues to treat his staff like s**t and they leave

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Could actually be a bonus for Ryanair in terms of their aircrew 'shortage' if only MOL could learn to treat his staff with some respect.

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How would that " help " Ryanair , of the 36 aircraft Monarch have 35 are Airbus "ses" . Not forgetting Ryanairs attitude towards it's pilots and cabin crew .

 

John

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23 hours ago, ukplane1 said:

Brexit means Bankruptcy 

Brexit means a cap on immigration. How many more human beings can this 600-mile long island's infrastructure cope with?

 

But I digress...

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1 hour ago, HighBypass said:

Brexit means a cap on immigration. How many more human beings can this 600-mile long island's infrastructure cope with?

 

But I digress...

Mark,

True that, but it makes it more difficult for the klepto-commiecrats, that run the EU, to finish the take-over of GB...I think that is ukplane1's concern.

You know, I have to say, AVSIM is such a good forum because of the lack of politics, but the progressives haven't been doing so well lately, so they just can't help themselves but to bring it up.

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55 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

Brexit means a cap on immigration. How many more human beings can this 600-mile long island's infrastructure cope with?

 

But I digress...

Well the millions of Britons abroad in the EU will all be illegal so in just a week the population would rise by 3 million - not quite what you wanted - eh?

 

Do you know what the single market is?

- Nope didn't think so.

 

 

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On 2 October 2017 at 7:55 PM, WotanUK said:

Sigh...without turning this into a political discussion...we are still in the EU.  Monarchs downturn as indicated above was primarily due to the decrease heading to the somewhat more terrorist prone countries of North Africa.

I hope that the people affected swiftly find new positions. 

Oh dear oh dear. What a load of nonsence.

Dear old Monarch died because it's shareholders thought it could compete with O'Leary.

It lost sight of its Long-hauls and profitable charter flights. Instead it went for the short-haul Euro (pay to pee) routes.

It couldn't win in the white heat competition for European low cost short-haul because its values of service and old fashioned manners have no place in the World today. We're the poorer for it - but who gives a t**s when we're flying from London to Berlin for a tenner!

I am very sorry it's gone. What goes with it is a sense of decency, customer service and respect. Values rapidly becoming extinct.

And once they're gone, they're gone. 

mon1.jpg

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2 hours ago, ukplane1 said:

Well the millions of Britons abroad in the EU will all be illegal so in just a week the population would rise by 3 million - not quite what you wanted - eh?

 

Do you know what the single market is?

- Nope didn't think so.

 

 

At least those 3 million Britons abroad... are British. Those 3 million would not be immigrants - they would take the place first and foremost over any non-British wanting to migrate into this country. No need to teach those expats English or how to integrate with UK culture. How desperately other EU countries want to kick the expats out remains to be seen.

Do I even care what the single market is? My car was made by a company owned by Tata... who are Indian. Our other car is Japanese. My XBOX and PC's components were made in China (probably) and the operating systems are American. My TV and microwave are Japanese..

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3 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

 

Do I even care what the single market is? ..

And this is why certain people shouldn't be allowed to vote.

6 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

My car was made by a company owned by Tata... who are Indian. Our other car is Japanese. My XBOX and PC's components were made in China (probably) and the operating systems are American. My TV and microwave are Japanese..

If we keep buying people's goods we will be broke , we have to sell as well and the EU are great partners to sell to.

7 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

At least those 3 million Britons abroad... are British. Those 3 million would not be immigrants -

You said this island can't hold anymore people , if it can't handle 150,000 extra a year how is it going to handle 3 MILLION IN A WEEK?

 

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Can Europe handle the mass transfer of 3 million people in a week?

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3 hours ago, ukplane1 said:

Well the millions of Britons abroad in the EU will all be illegal so in just a week the population would rise by 3 million - not quite what you wanted - eh?

 

Do you know what the single market is?

- Nope didn't think so.

 

 

Well I guess if that happens then the 3 million Europeans in the Uk will also become illegal, fair swap I say.

But we both know it's not going to be happening like that is it ?

Did you actually live in the UK as an adult before we joined the "common market" ?, thought not.

I did and I can tell you it was a much nicer place than it is now, relax it will be fine.

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Whatever happens - airlines will come and go, all trying to pack people into the planes like cattle. Gone are the days where a sense of decorum was expected when travelling by air... unless you can afford the luxury of business class etc. I wouldn't want to be cooped up in an economy seat for 12 hours or more to visit another country. That's not a way to enjoy a slow journey.  Hopefully Elon Musk's vision of transporting people to anywhere on the planet within one hour will reach fruition. I can cope with being in cattle class for a suborbital trip to start a holiday. Assuming I could afford one in the first place. easyRocket or Ryanspace ? 

Until then, when I look up and see an airliner overhead it will be either American or French, until such time as they stop flying altogether, that is.

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ive mixed feelings about Monarch.  I know I say it alot but ive 20 years in the airline business and how monarch could not see what was happening around them is beyond me...  

For the last 15 years the amount of Mid to old age "tunbridge wells" volvo driving, golfers type of people buying Cosmos, Citalia and such like holidays to Portugal and Sorrento has declined.  That was monarchs bread and butter.  Along came the internet and lowcos such as Ryanair and easyjet and basically cut out that middle man.  No longer do you need travel agents or tour operators to book hotels and bums on seats any old person can do it.  Hell my mother is 73 and can quite easily navigate the web.

This didnt happen over night and the AMB (airline management board) at Monarch couldnt see it happening whereas easyjet and ryanair have dominted short haul operations.

Sure since the 2008 finanical crisis Chavs no longer have the benefit money they use to have to afford a wedding in the Dom Rep so the long market has changed but they really didnt have a chance.

We had quite a few people from Monarch Ops join us at easyjet and the stories of incompetent managers and board members was heartbreaking to hear.

However I lost my job after Sept 11th and its a nasty business so my heart goes out to the front line staff.   

Bad management living on fairy cuckoo cloud land for the last 10 years is what killed that airline.

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18 hours ago, ukplane1 said:

Well the millions of Britons abroad in the EU will all be illegal so in just a week the population would rise by 3 million - not quite what you wanted - eh?

 

Do you know what the single market is?

- Nope didn't think so.

 

 

Eh?  I can see you are a remainer...me too, but this is pure rubbish.  I am assuming you believe that all the British in the EU will be told to go home (not sure where the 3 million figure is from i think the figure is 1.2 million)?  If that was the case then it would be the case that the British governement would send home the 3 million EU citizens, so the countries population would decrease by almost 2 million.

18 hours ago, ganter said:

Oh dear oh dear. What a load of nonsence.

Dear old Monarch died because it's shareholders thought it could compete with O'Leary.

It lost sight of its Long-hauls and profitable charter flights. Instead it went for the short-haul Euro (pay to pee) routes.

It couldn't win in the white heat competition for European low cost short-haul because its values of service and old fashioned manners have no place in the World today. We're the poorer for it - but who gives a t**s when we're flying from London to Berlin for a tenner!

I am very sorry it's gone. What goes with it is a sense of decency, customer service and respect. Values rapidly becoming extinct.

And once they're gone, they're gone. 

 

Nope, you say yourself that the profitable part of the business was the long haul routes to places like Egypt and Tunisia.  Unfortunately they took a significant downturn with the upturn in terrorist related incidents, certainly the possible terrorist incident with the Russian aircraft.  I don't doubt that they also had issues in the cheap European space, but certainly nothing to do with this country leaving the EU.  I don't recognize the "service and old fashioned manners", last time i went with Monarch they were almost the same as Ryanair or Easy Jet, couldn't tell the difference between them.

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16 hours ago, ukplane1 said:

And this is why certain people shouldn't be allowed to vote.

If we keep buying people's goods we will be broke , we have to sell as well and the EU are great partners to sell to.

You said this island can't hold anymore people , if it can't handle 150,000 extra a year how is it going to handle 3 MILLION IN A WEEK?

 

Really you are embarrassing yourself, seriously how old are you?

The big problem with the EU and a reason i nearly voted to leave is that it doesn't care where industry is located within the EU, so this country (UK) has lost manufacturing to Eastern Europe, for example Terrys in York relocated to Poland, as did Twinnings Tea.  If this trend continued we would be indeed in trouble.

Why would we be taking in 3 million people a week???  Even if the total number of British people in the EU was 3 million (it's not it's 1.2 million), we still wouldn't be taking in 3 million a week, the total number we would take is 3 million, then it would stop.  As i already stated, if this happened (it won't) then the UK government would send home the nearly 3 million EU people so the country wouldn't see a net increase.  But none of this will actually happen, everybody will stay were they are.

I don't know you 'ukplane1' but i really do hope that you educate yourself on the EU and politics in general.  There are real issues with us leaving the EU, but this kind of misinformation is really not helpful.

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11 minutes ago, WotanUK said:

Eh?  I can see you are a remainer...me too, but this is pure rubbish.  I am assuming you believe that all the British in the EU will be told to go home (not sure where the 3 million figure is from i think the figure is 1.2 million)?  If that was the case then it would be the case that the British governement would send home the 3 million EU citizens, so the countries population would decrease by almost 2 million.

 

I'm not a Remainer or a Brexiteer - i'm just sitting back and watching this issue. 

Unfortunately  i think the EU has more power points than us and when we have such a weak prime minister anything the EU says goes and with millions of people who want to block brexit i can't see them allowing 2-3 million EU citizens being deported without a fight. I'm not sure the local's in the EU will stop our Brits from being deported back to the UK.

So i'm still confident that the population will rise dramatically and quickly once the transitional period is over.

 

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, ukplane1 said:

2-3 million EU citizens being deported

No one is going to be deported either from the UK or from the EU, where ever do you get these ideas from ?

And if you have such an poor opinion of the UK's future outside of the EU why did you not use your right to vote, you had a choice and an opinion but chose not to use it, this I find incredible.

PS, just look how the EU handles democracy in its lack of response to the treatment of the Catalonians in their referendum, is that what you want for your countries future, I certainly don't

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4 minutes ago, ukplane1 said:

I'm not a Remainer or a Brexiteer - i'm just sitting back and watching this issue. 

Unfortunately  i think the EU has more power points than us and when we have such a weak prime minister anything the EU says goes and with millions of people who want to block brexit i can't see them allowing 2-3 million EU citizens being deported without a fight. I'm not sure the local's in the EU will stop our Brits from being deported back to the UK.

So i'm still confident that the population will rise dramatically and quickly once the transitional period is over.

I agree that the EU has more going for them than we do in the UK, but politics isn't simply.  I don't want to see my EU neighbours and friends have to go back, but if the EU forces the issue and requires that British citizens return home, i would very reluctantly support a UK policy to repatriate EU citizens, i think you will find that would be the position of the majority of the population.  I don't think that any of this will actually happen, i am almost entirely sure we will reach an agreement.

The population will be tied to the economic performance of the country, if the economy takes off (it won't) then immigration will increase, if the economy begins to fail (very likely) immigration will fall.

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