Gizmo05

How to get the correct Departure Runway ?

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Hi all,

I would like to find out how can i find the correct departure runway? Allow me to elaborate. I am using PFPX and basing on the weather, it shows 02C departing on PFPX but on the simulator, it gives a different runway like 20R. How can sync both so i get the same runway and arrival for both PFPX and the simulator (P3D). 

Thank you in advance.

Regards

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You basically can't.... what the sim chooses for you is not always straightforward, especially with very low winds.

So you have to be a little bit flexible there. Either you check before what is used in the simulator right now and set that runway in PFPX manually or you ignore what the simulator is assigning you...

I hope there will be an easy software where you can choose what runway is used in the simulator.

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2 minutes ago, officercrockey said:

You basically can't.... what the sim chooses for you is not always straightforward, especially with very low winds.

So you have to be a little bit flexible there. Either you check before what is used in the simulator right now and set that runway in PFPX manually or you ignore what the simulator is assigning you...

I hope there will be an easy software where you can choose what runway is used in the simulator.

Thank you for your reply. Yes i agree that a simple software should exist. Oh Well... till then, be flexible (LOL).

 

Thank you

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I'm new to P3d, so this might not apply. I haven't enabled traffic yet to see if it works the same, but in FSX I would tune to ground and listen to what ATC was assigning to the other flights. It frequently was the "wrong" runway for the conditions, but at least I wasn't trying to taxi upstream.

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This is one of the controls that is missing in P3D and I've whined about it for a long time, an ability to control runway operations or in general any basic tools to control AI and general airport operations of this type. I find it pretty ridiculous that LM never bothered to improve this. 

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In my experience it's not a problem most of the time, in fact, I don't think I ever ran into trouble. What basically tells you what runway will be used is the wind, 320/05 and e.g. at MSP you'll land and depart west on runways 30L/R while 35 will also be available for landing. ATC will assign your runway based on this and your position. For departure, it will assign the runway which is closest to your gate but when receiving taxi clearance you can request a runway change from the ATC menu. On approach it works the same, approaching from the south your runway for landing will either be 30L (MSP again) or perhaps 35, in that case you have to see what runway you're closest to/which runway is closest to your flight plan. Of course you can still request different runways.

When planning my flight I usually ignore what PFPX says about the runways because it's often not precise either and go by winds and position of my airplane. I can't remember ever getting a runway assigned other than the one I expected to be in use. A bit of knowledge about the airports you depart out of or land at will also help, e.g. LAX obviously never really uses the 6/7 runways but the 24s/25s even when you have a (slight) tailwind (edit: P3D doesn't know this and will use the 6s/7s depending on wind direction. I edited the AFCAD for LAX with ADE to close runways 6/7 for landing and departure).

Edited by threegreen
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7 hours ago, Gizmo05 said:

I would like to find out how can i find the correct departure runway

Live ATC and Real Traffic are good for this.  Used Real Traffic this morning departing ENGM. 🙂

Grace and Peace, 

 

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Also, if you are using Active Sky with real live weather and check the conditions of the departure and arrival airports, lower left corner of the screen shows active runways in use in P3D at the moment.

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Runway changes happen, it's easiest to just know how to change your departure runway and associated SID.

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and that PFPX is a planning tool, not a takeoff / landing tool like its sibling Topcat tool .... which you use when you know / decide the runway to use.

52 minutes ago, Drumcode said:

Also, if you are using Active Sky with real live weather and check the conditions of the departure and arrival airports, lower left corner of the screen shows active runways in use in P3D at the moment.

or historic weather. AS call of the active runway is sometimes different to the sims atis call and neither seem to read addon airports "accurately" (open/closed runways). both do "score" the runway to use after considering visibility, navaids for landing, length & wind & if all equal (?) will choose closest to true north.

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Hi,

What I use before programing the fmc is what  I used in FSX, works in P3D also.  Contact ATC ground and request a departure, they will give you a runway along with the route to take to it.

Gnacino

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You can also force the winds in active sky if it is calm or variable to stop the AI shifting between runways. I find it quite useful. That feature is called ‘force ai wind lock’ I think. 

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14 hours ago, Drumcode said:

This is one of the controls that is missing in P3D and I've whined about it for a long time, an ability to control runway operations or in general any basic tools to control AI and general airport operations of this type. I find it pretty ridiculous that LM never bothered to improve this. 

the military dont care about it.  they care about training using VR.

 

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2 hours ago, tooting said:

the military dont care about it.  

We will see about that..

S.

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3 hours ago, tooting said:

the military dont care about it.  they care about training using VR.

Yup true. Chances are military training on P3D is using a real person on a headset to do any controlling which might be required for mission training  (as is the case on most high end training simulators). They don't care about lovely wave reflections on water or realistic cloud shadows etc, they'll be more bothered about whether it can simulate the correct parabolic arc a retarded Mark 83 bomb will take when it is dropped from an F-16 flying level at 450 knots at 300 feet AGL, and that sort of thing.

Back in the simulator though and comparing that to the real thing, for real operations at Manchester, we use a system called Chroma, which feeds information to various companies which are using the airport. Along the top of the screen where we do all the planning and stuff, it has a big yellow strip with up to date information on things to do with the airport, such as which stands are not operational and which runway(s) are in use. This is the info that airlines can feed to their airliners via things like long range radio or ACARs or whatever.

A few years ago you used to be able to sort of simulate that kind of thing in your flight sim with Flight Keeper, which had an ACARS gauge you could add to your aeroplanes, and that would indeed tell you which runways were in use at your arrival airport long before you got anywhere near to actually using the runway, but it is sadly not available for P3D. However, the forthcoming Global Ops expansion from PMDG may add some of that functionality to aircraft. I know a lot of people were a bit underwhelmed by PMDG's announcement of Global Ops, since many of them were expecting news of maybe a 787 or some such, but the moment I found out that it would have a stab at making ACARS realistic, I thought it might actually be a real step forward for how airliners are simulated. It's worth bearing in mind that Aerosoft's new Airbus Pro which was released recently, is the first third party airliner to promise compatibility with that.

Edited by Chock

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Basically ATC is instructed by the weather, mainly winds. So in your weather app set up the weather that most likely causes ATC to choose the runway 'direction' you want. The actual runway will be decided based on the Ai traffic around and your location nearby the runway.

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19 hours ago, officercrockey said:

I hope there will be an easy software where you can choose what runway is used in the simulator.

That's not likely as that would mean the weather would have to be generated to correspond with that requested runway. Although IF10 does it by doing it that way more or less.

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Just now, SteveW said:

That's not likely as that would mean the weather would have to be generated to correspond with that requested runway. Although IF10 does it by doing it that way more or less.

Not true.

The wind does not give you the right answer. If the wind is 310 at 5 knots, it does not mean, you have to take off and land from runway 31. It can make perfect sense to still use runway 13, depending on the airport.

So just to rely on the internal decision gives you wrong results most of the time. It is just not flexible enough.

And if I understand it correctly, something like this is announced already.

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No. I said to set the weather so that is DOES get ATC to choose the runway direction you want. 5knt is probably going to prove indeterminate.

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7 minutes ago, officercrockey said:

just to rely on the internal decision gives you wrong results most of the time. It is just not flexible enough.

Sure your weather app works properly?

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Sorry Steve, but I have to feeling you totally misunderstand what the OP is talking about. Why should someone want to change the weather. He wrote he is using PFPX with real weather.

It is just a fact, that P3D's runway selection is wonky at best and it can be necessary to change that selection. How is it related to my weather app?

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Sorry David I interpret it as if he wants to have a plan to start from a certain direction and a flight that corresponds with that. So ATC has to be instructed by the winds (mainly as I said). However you'll need to set more than 6knts because of certain problems.

Weather in the sim is complicated by location, the nearby other weather stations, terrain, and the features of the airport and the Ai traffic. So you might need to set 10 knts to get more reliable direction at another location. In AS you can get it to pre-set up the winds so that ATC does it (I think).

And I do it all the time in IF and that is as reliable as I can expect from the system as well. It's good advice.

 

Edited by SteveW

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That's a hack and not a solution. I don't want to change the weather to use a certain runway, I just want to use it. That's how it happens in real life as well. ATC doesn't change the weather but they choose a certain runway according to the weather and other restrictions/rules. And that's what I (and many others) also want to do.

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3 minutes ago, officercrockey said:

That's a hack and not a solution. I don't want to change the weather to use a certain runway, I just want to use it. That's how it happens in real life as well. ATC doesn't change the weather but they choose a certain runway according to the weather and other restrictions/rules. And that's what I (and many others) also want to do.

In the sim we are talking about though right? SO in the sim then weather stations transmit out the weather into the sim Sorry if you don't understand how the sim works

So ATC works by mathematics - right? I am saying it works reliably, the situational outcome is fooling you -  you are saying that ATC chooses runways by random? Not sure where you are going here David....

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