New MS Flight Sim shown at E3 - Updated Information

[Superdelphinus 718]

I meant more all of the subscriptions I’ve got on the go

[SamYeager 244]

18 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

The base FSX title was licensed to Dovetail who made a mess of it.. IMHO.. leaving a void which XPlane filled very nicely..

IMHO Dovetail's problem is that they didn't have deep enough pockets to fund the developers needed to rework the code quickly enough to bring the money in. It didn't help that they chose to take forward the FSX code, as they were already familiar with it, rather than the Flight code which had already been improved. Aided and abetted by the "It's not MS and there's no big jets to fly" crowd they ran out of money.

[Christopher Low 5,359]

Dovetail's problem was that they took the FSX code, and made another version of FSX with it. Harsh maybe, but that's all I ever saw in screenshots and videos of FlightSim World. Nobody needs another version of FSX. We have P3D for that.

[threexgreen 3,142]

3 hours ago, rjfry said:

Think about todays PC playing this now and in the future and not having to keep upgrading your PC.

I doubt you'd need to seriously splash around some cash in order to be able to run MSFS if the scenery is not streamed, provided you have a system like most simmers. I think people are so accustomed to constantly think about hardware and upgrades (myself included) and still worry about performance that many seem to forget what it's like on the non-ESP side of things - there are plenty of games that are stunning graphically that I can easily play without a single stutter at 60 FPS on my 4k TV with high settings. Compared to today's tech P3D really still is an ancient elephant because of the underlying old FSX code. Can't comment on X-Plane.

From the trailer it looks like MSFS is another dimension compared to what we have now - and I fully expect that's not only visually but also technically.

[Superdelphinus 718]

Yeah I have a gtx 1070 an an i7 9700k (slightly unbalanced as I have just upgraded everything other than the gpu) and it will will run most things at 4k/60. Obviously on more demanding aaa games I have to turn down settings (though usually only anti aliasing, and maybe shadows) but it’s still pretty.

Originally I had planned to buy one of the second generation rtx cards next year but I might just hold off for a bit and see what happens with the way the industry seems to be going, and what the new consoles are offering. I feel less comfortable dropping that much money on graphics cards these days, even though paradoxically I have a lot more disposable cash now than when I first got into pc gaming (as an adult at least).  £800 or whatever I spend on this sort of stuff is £800 I don’t spend on my daughter, and there’s people within 15 minutes of where I live that can’t even afford food, let alone silicon that makes graphics shinier and update the screen more times in a second. 

[jpc55 185]

• On ‎6‎/‎20‎/‎2019 at 3:25 PM, Superdelphinus said:

  • This is not a reply to the person before me.
  • What I would like to know, I like the HEART button, why don't we  have a  BS button, or a Disagree button?

 

Edited June 23, 2019 by jpc55

[penta_a 429]

17 hours ago, Jonnoxx said:

Here's an interesting video by Google explaining their Stadia gaming portal concept.  It provides strong clues as to what will be possible with software in MSFS, and the reality of actually delivering that new experience seamlessly to the user on whatever device he has.

Both Google and MS are battling it out in the same market sphere, and with similar business models.

Bottom line … simulation's computing and delivery future has finally arrived in a way that truly and forever changes the current paradigm - and obliterates all conceptions embedded in the past.

Headline quote from Google … "This is just the start!"   Pretty sure MS will want to brag the same.

 

I think this will be a perfect (platform) choice for LM P3D V5 to compete with MS new FS especially when we know that google earth has far better and new images of planet earth, play it in any of your devices at any time with highest quality.

Just my opinion.

[Shack95 2,658]

It seems that Aerosoft isn’t involved, at least that’s how I read this quote:

“I was as much surprised as all others,” said Winfried Diekmann, CEO of Aerosoft, a German manufacturer of simulation software and content for Microsoft Flight Simulator, in an email. “There were rumors but those rumors have been seen from time to time in the last years.”

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/06/23/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020-announcement-surprised-fanatics.html

[anden145 2,285]

Thanks for the link, @Shack95

Gotta say, I find it both interesting and on the same note, a little disconcerting, that Microsoft apparently haven't talked to anybody within the existing 'eco-system' and community, in the process of developing this.

It could mean, that Microsoft simply haven't gotten to the point of discussion and revealing it to the (obvious) developers yet. But it could also indicate (which is more ominous) that Microsoft simply won't bother with it, and that they haven't gotten the existing developers in mind or that giving them information and a head-start, simply isn't a priority or agenda.

Quite frankly, I'm not sure what to read into it - if anything... We'll see...

[Cruachan 705]

On 6/21/2019 at 8:11 AM, Woozie said:

Thank you MS, i knew you can be trusted

The statement clearly indicates that this is more about passion and the love for aviation rather than just balance sheets,  I really hope this creates a much more positive spirit in the community.

We wouldn't have been on the moon without passion and open mindedness...

That first sentence is what makes me feel a little uneasy about this latest development. While I can join in the excitement and anticipation of what potentially might lie ahead, Microsoft’s track record in this arena was tarnished with the previous abandonment of FSX. Also, their apparent lack of concern for its faithful customers who, for a time, were left high and dry albeit with an ageing simulator in dire need of some TLC. Doubtless they would attempt to excuse this by proclaiming there’s no sentiment in business.

Yes, they appear to have accepted mistakes were made and have apologised for their shortsightedness. This is, of course, laudable, and I, for one, am hoping their intentions are truly honourable this time around. If not, and a year or two down the line we find ourselves in the same situation as before, then the consequences for Developers could be very serious. 

So, for the time being at least, I would encourage our enthusiasm to be tempered by an appropriate degree of cautious expectation.

Microsoft need to prove they mean what they say. Perhaps we should consider imposing a period of ‘probation’ whereby we include our continuing loyalty to Prepar3D and/or X-Plane while the situation has adequate time for clarification.

Without any guarantee of future longevity, a rapid mass movement towards making the switch to MS2020 might be counter productive in terms of ongoing 3rd Party development and viability. They still need our support during what could turn out to be a particularly challenging period financially.

Just some food for thought.

Microsoft, the ball is in your court. Please don’t disappoint us again.

Mike

 

[Paraffin 2,197]

1 hour ago, Anders Bermann said:

Gotta say, I find it both interesting and on the same note, a little disconcerting, that Microsoft apparently haven't talked to anybody within the existing 'eco-system' and community, in the process of developing this.

It could mean, that Microsoft simply haven't gotten to the point of discussion and revealing it to the (obvious) developers yet. But it could also indicate (which is more ominous) that Microsoft simply won't bother with it, and that they haven't gotten the existing developers in mind or that giving them information and a head-start, simply isn't a priority or agenda.

Quite frankly, I'm not sure what to read into it - if anything... We'll see...

Well, one more positive way to read the apparent lack of communication with the "eco-system" of developers, is that they plan to tightly control the base product including default aircraft developed in-house, and then give everyone else the tools to create whatever add-ons they want outside of the core simulator.

Basically the FSX/P3D/XP model. It might make financial sense for MS if it's not just a one-time purchase, but involves some sort of subscription so they can continue development.

That would be a little more "Wild West" for the people here who were hoping for a more curated approach and a single storefront for add-ons. But it could explain why none of the major 3rd party developers were approached ahead of the announcement.

Edited June 23, 2019 by Paraffin

[Amon1973 1,421]

After reading the CNBC article Austin Meyer (I own and use X-plane and P3d) is in denial, with the quote that is referring to the E3 MS2020 launch as "Ferrari not launching a new car at the next car show, but telling Uber instead". This is rubbish as E3 launches are going to reach out to 100's of millions of potential customers instead of 100,000's, marketing never was one of LR's strengths.

He goes on further criticising the trailer saying that "the buildings, cars, trees and shadows didn’t look perfectly realistic to him". For god sake Austin MS2020 is probably only in an Alpha state right now, existing Flight Sims, need to wake up and smell the coffee if they want to continue to flourish. Maybe MS even have a team of Devs capable of mastering ground handling Austin?

[anden145 2,285]

38 minutes ago, Paraffin said:

Well, one more positive way to read the apparent lack of communication with the "eco-system" of developers, is that they plan to tightly control the base product including default aircraft developed in-house, and then give everyone else the tools to create whatever add-ons they want outside of the core simulator.

Basically the FSX/P3D/XP model. It might make financial sense for MS if it's not just a one-time purchase, but involves some sort of subscription so they can continue development.

That would be a little more "Wild West" for the people here who were hoping for a more curated approach and a single storefront for add-ons. But it could explain why none of the major 3rd party developers were approached ahead of the announcement.

Agreed! Well said. 🙂

But if Microsoft (for financial reasons) introduces some kind of take-a-cut off all addons sold and/or are forcing addon developers into certain marketplaces or stores - well, that a condition that I just don't see many (current) developers accepting.

If they're continuing the current market scheme, where developers are free to sell and experiment with the sim without any involvement from Microsoft - well, that would be great and would be the most open approach. 

[shivers9 1,174]

Well it really is good to watch many getting excited and having fun because this group deserves a little good news. I don't know of any other "hobby" when the people who spend their hard earned money and more than just a lot of there time. Many of us have been doing this for many years now and we are constantly either being told by the marketeers or the DEVs how stupid we are and we don't know how hard it is for them. Take a minute and think about it my friends. We hear nothing but what a small meaningless market we are and they will tell us what we need and can have. This dribble and hard luck stories are coming from two of the largest companies is the world ie. MS and LM. Then we have Xpain who is owned by a guy who flies around the world in his own plane. Next we have a developer who only releases models of the real world planes that he buys tears apart, rebuilds and analizes with computer equipment. There are many more like this. Listen, I don't know where this is headed in the future with MS and this release but I do know where it has been in the past. MS and others have brought a lot of good things to my life. I just think it may be a good idea for us all to take a bit of time and get some real facts before we break our back again bending down to this company just because they have a new marketing plan. I truly hope it is great but we shall see.

[ricka47 611]

48 minutes ago, eaim said:

After reading the CNBC article Austin Meyer (I own and use X-plane and P3d) is in denial, with the quote that is referring to the E3 MS2020 launch as "Ferrari not launching a new car at the next car show, but telling Uber instead". This is rubbish as E3 launches are going to reach out to 100's of millions of potential customers instead of 100,000's, marketing never was one of LR's strengths.

He goes on further criticising the trailer saying that "the buildings, cars, trees and shadows didn’t look perfectly realistic to him". For god sake Austin MS2020 is probably only in an Alpha state right now, existing Flight Sims, need to wake up and smell the coffee if they want to continue to flourish. Maybe MS even have a team of Devs capable of mastering ground handling Austin?

I use XP11 exclusively now after switching from P3D about 18 months ago.  I really like it and it looks very good.  It is much less "cartoonish" than P3D which always bothered me.  But, too much is still missing from it that we had even back in FSX.

There is a video of Austin trying the new xEnviro 1.10 weather plug in on XP11 and some of his comments about XP11's default clouds and how things work in his own product in general are disconcerting.  He seems, at best, to run the company based on only what he wants and not so much on what the consumer wants like being able to taxi a 172 after a successful flight and to have seasons.

XP11 is markedly better than XP10 which I could not even use and I would not go back to P3D at this point. Nevertheless, if MSFS2020 is anything like what many of us envision and is indeed the next generation of flight sims, I won't hesitate to switch.

It would be a shame if XP11, which has attracted a fair amount of former FSX/P3D users, goes back to being a niche player in the FS market because they didn't react quickly and boldly to the announcement of Microsoft.

As a small organization, perhaps there is only so much that they can do compared to Microsoft and its vast resources.  But, denying reality is not a good way to respond to a major competitive challenge.  If David is going to stand up to Goliath, he must at least recognize the existence of the giant and why people may want to be on the side of giant.

Edited June 23, 2019 by ricka47