Spare a thought

[Flic1 976]

Mike - The developer you referenced in your original post has been on the forums ranting and raging for months-on-end since he just released a new product for P3D that may or may not be needed in MSFS.  He seems to be very vocal about it being unfair that he personally doesn't have an SDK while speaking in a condescending tone to everyone that shows excitement for a new sim that we are all in such desperate need for.  He also is repeatedly stating it is going be many years before any addons are available which is not factual information at this point.  PMDG has implied the NG3 will be out around the same time MSFS is out next year.  I would take their word over a guy that is very new to the flightsim addon business who thinks causing a stir in all of the forums is going to somehow change nature's course.  I get it, the past year was poor timing to enter the world as a new P3D developer. He should go about things a little differently as he certainly isn't doing himself any favors and may make some people not even want to buy a product from his company due to his patronizing attitude.  Maybe he could take some cues from Lorby's posts and insights as he is a long time developer and sees things for what they are.

The 3PD's have had a great run making up for all the deficiencies of the ESP platform.  The flightsim world has been shaken up and for the better.  This stuff happens every single day out in the business world so I am not sure why this should be any different.  I think some 3PD's will end up being in much better shape after MSFS is released and others will likely go out of business unless they change their focus.  Just like recessions, sometimes there needs to be a cleansing of the industry.  Look how many silly addons there are now with developers charging insane amounts for them (my favorite is 'better shadows' addon for $16 when this can be done with a simple .cfg edit).  Whether all these 3PD's are "speaking" to MS or not doesn't really matter for the most part as many of these products simply will not be needed.  Maybe there will be new things to exploit in MSFS that create new opportunities?  I have spent amounts I probably cannot compute over 30+ years of simming on different addons, many of which I only used once if at all. I am happy I won't need an SSD full of addons just to make the sim look and feel more realistic. Developers will have to start doing what PMDG did and provide some kind of path if they want to keep sales volume up.  Yup, they might need the SDK for that (PMDG apparently did not?) but that is just a realistic view considering most of us are not going to spend large (maybe even small) amounts of money on things that will not be relevant in a year or less.  

 

Edited November 17, 2019 by Flic1

[OSJJ1985 134]

2 hours ago, Ted Striker said:

I still use FSX, P3Dv3, and P3Dv4 due to addons made for them that are not available for succeeding sims. I expect to continue using them after MSFS2020 is released.

Why should I require a specific addon to be functional for the new Sim when the Sim itself can do a better job on its own? For example there really is no need for FTX Global products to be compatible with the new Sim. 

[irrics 1,517]

We could make wine with the amount of sour grapes tears cried for third party developers. 

 

This is a business. End of story. 

 

Those that adapt and get with the current environment will thrive as many many customers, new and old, will be there to support that. 

Edited November 17, 2019 by irrics

[Alan_A 1,650]

You know, it's also possible that new development shops will form - and give jobs to people - to take advantage of opportunities in the new sim.

Change isn't the end of the world.  It's just change.  Yes, some developers will disappear. How much Amiga software have you bought recently?

And if anyone watches the dev interviews and comes away with "oh, look, it's bad evil Microsoft with its (shock! horror!) marketing come to destroy our beloved community..." well, you're seeing different stuff than I am.

 

[CaribbeanCLANK 134]

I am very thankful to all the 3rd party developers that made products to improve my flight sim experience over the years. I am also excited about the possibility of not needing a large library of add-ons to "improve" my sim. I do have great admiration for many of the 3rd party devs that have produced great products for FSX and P3D but as their customer I will only support them in the future if they continue to deliver products that will enhance MY flight simming experience. I will not buy a product that I don't need.

If the default sim has a weather engine that is as detailed as promised, my sim experience no longer needs an add-on to enhance weather. If a default aircraft is not to the standard I am happy with and there is a 3rd party option then I will buy it. If certain default airports are not to my satisfaction and they can be replaced with better versions from 3rd parties, then I will gladly spend money on them. 

I might be moving to a new sim platform but that doesn't mean my spending habits will change also. Just like FSX and P3D, I will continue to buy things that I feel my sim needs. I feel in-love with certain 3rd party devs because they provided me with quality products that I felt my sim needed. 

 

Below are some developers I have grown to respect over the years. 

FlightBeam Studios, FSDreamteam, FlyTampa, PAC Sim, ORBX, Aerosoft, PMDG, Majestic Software, Taxi2Gate, LatinVFR, HiFi Studios, REX, Old Prop, Navigraph, Just Sim, & TropicalSim. 

Some of the products I purchased from some of the developers I listed, I probably will have no need for in Mircosoft's new flight simulator but for others, I may still have a need for their amazing products. I wish them ALL the best of luck in the future. 

 

[smoothchat 99]

There will ALWAYS be something that is not exactly as we want, and that will be an opportunity for a 3PD to fill the gap.

[Ted Striker 338]

4 hours ago, OSJJ1985 said:

Why should I require a specific addon to be functional for the new Sim when the Sim itself can do a better job on its own? For example there really is no need for FTX Global products to be compatible with the new Sim.

I guess we'll just have to wait to see what comes with the new MSFS. I'm not expecting all the aircraft I have now, especially the older aircraft like the 727 and 707 that are not as popular with the younger simmers. Global textures is different as it looks like the new MSFS tech to be better at least initially. Small airports, we'll just have to wait and see what we get.

Ted

[Scottoest 1,561]

10 hours ago, Cruachan said:

All perfectly fair points ( @B737NG , Oliver). To me it appears to be more about the timing of the product reveal when third party are at their most vulnerable. That’s what’s making me feel suspicious as to their true intent. However, I’m still happy to maintain an open mind In the hope that, in the end, some good comes from all of this.

Regards,

Mike

The timing of the reveal was completely unremarkable by the standards of a video game.  Games routinely get announced a year or two before they actually launch - sometimes even longer than that.  Assuming MSFS came out in 2020, it would be, at most, 18 months from reveal to release.  Microsoft have also been anxious to demonstrate their newfound re-commitment to PC gaming, of which a classic Microsoft series like Flight Simulator would be a huge part. ("game" vs. "sim' debate very much set aside here)

It's part of a conventional media strategy to get it out there, let interest percolate, occasionally poke the embers by releasing new media or interviews, and build the hype.  And so far, that has worked masterfully, if I can enter this forum as evidence.  They also wanted the ability to collect early feedback via public tests, which requires disclosing it's existence.

Does this situation work great for 3PD? Not really.  But it seems a little bit of a stretch to say it's Microsoft's job to worry about how the mere existence of their future software might affect the 3PD purchasing decisions of customers for other flight simulators.

If I were ASOBO, I might get 3PDs on a conference call or something, and let them ask questions about what will be possible with the forthcoming SDK, so they can try to plan their futures, reasonably solid in their understanding about whether there will be a place for the products they currently sell.  But either way, I don't think they'd done anything wrong thus far.

[irrics 1,517]

I’m still honestly a bit blown away MS is back in this space.  It’s like I’m dreaming...  I never in a million years thought they’d get back into making MSFS.

 

Now...

Can MS please release a PC golf game again next?

Edited November 18, 2019 by irrics

[Cruachan 705]

Playing devil’s advocate:

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/564138-be-careful-what-you-wish-for-a-cautionary-note/?do=findComment&comment=4130554

Mike

[Skywatcher 133]

20 hours ago, irrics said:

Can MS please release a PC golf game again next?

Now that would be INCREDIBLY exciting!

[SimPlaneDriver 173]

17 minutes ago, Max50 said:

Now that would be INCREDIBLY exciting!

Right!  Declaring and emergency to land and golf. 😁

[Skywatcher 133]

6 minutes ago, daveinca2000 said:

Right!  Declaring and emergency to land and golf. 😁

We really got to figure out how to start a golf thread without AVSIM deleting it!

MS are reading this stuff!

[Christopher Low 5,353]

The last golf game that I played was Links LS2000, and it was really good!

[Cruachan 705]

Back on topic please!

Thank you.

Mike