Reality Check

[Isaiah53six 134]

There will be naysayers in just about everything in life.  Most of us just want to see the success of this project because when it works well, it can be a lot of fun.  It's also why many of us buy games and sims to have fun and learn along the way.  Many of us won't ever become a pilot IRL but a quality sim can give us a taste of the seriousness, joy and excitement of flying.

[wim123 761]

7 hours ago, himmelhorse said:

To be fair, the trouble is that a lot of the people who cannot see the good stuff are too busy trying to sort out the broken stuff, to put their heads up to look around. 

I am not one of these people with a broken system, but, can you imagine the unholy joy that the sufferers experience, when they read that xxx or yyy do not have any problems at all. I could understand statements like the one I quoted, if all the problems were imagined or trivial.  They are not, even if the problem is blown way out of proportion, it is still, very significant to that person. The problem is further compounded if the simmer is experienced and has previously had no issues.

Comments like these, credible, true or otherwise, are not the best example of how to help someone solve these issues.  I totally agree with everything the OP has said, and even reacted to it. We definitely need carrots and to throw the sticks away, to try to encourage the sufferers, and all of this so that everybody can eventually really enjoy this sim.

Tony  

sorry to see that you dont really get my post.  ( my bad, it was a tad short)

i know there are many bugs in the program, but i play in such a way the bugs dont harm me.  ( i dont fly the tubes for now).

and a lot of bugs are really at the userside.

ppl have a tendency that when something does not work, to go whine uselessly, instead of trying

to intelligently solve the problem, or find workarounds.   ( again this does not count for everyone, but quite a few i am afraid.

also some ppl take it way way too seriously..after all its just a game.   ( i know that saying this wont be populair amongst some)

have a good day and many nice flights.

[himmelhorse 1,276]

wim123,

I understood exactly what you were saying and, whilst it was short, it reflected many views that are being displayed as we speak. My response to you (ie quote) was general in nature and not a personal dig. 

Whilst I agree with you that (some) people tend to whinge and whine, this is not true of all.  My comments (and sympathies) lie with the fact that we are not talking about 1 person, nor are we talking about multiple issues in this case.  Clearly there is a problem here and this number of simmers with a common fault, is not really a whinge in my view.  

Further, the ongoing debate about whinging or whining or "I don't have this problem" is not addressing the crux of the matter, which is where we should be trying to help.  Frankly, in my view again, any debate or conversation which does not address this issue is getting a little tiring, mainly because the same thing is being said in different ways and none of them, regardless of intent, is particularly helpful.

I cannot think of anything that could be really helpful, but I would like very much, those with the abilities to nut this out, start making some suggestions to try to eliminate the issue in its entirety.  

Even though, I am not experiencing any of these issues, I would like to thank those who have made suggestions for people to try.  This is what they want, not a debate or conversation about whether or not they are whining.

Again, nothing of a personal or demeaning nature aimed at anybody is involved here.

Tony

 

[flightsim1818 79]

I'm an airliner simmer and mostly fly A320. Unfortunately it is completely garbage after the latest patch. I will not jump into a Cessna and go "ohhh" and "ahhh" about the beautiful scenery. Been there, done that. It is wonderful and the potential is HUGE for this sim. It will be the platform in the future.

BUT they have released it NOW and people have paid for it. For many it took days to download. Some are still having issues installning it.

The truth is Asobo needs to get their code together pretty quickly. There's nothing wrong about being p*ssed if the basic features of an airliner (like flying it) are broken. 

It's like having a silver plate in front of you with the most tasting dish there ever was and then the chef comes out and dumps a pound of salt on it. 

[ErichB 3,640]

Great post @Jaxsimmer

[Ricardo41 5,949]

10 hours ago, himmelhorse said:

To be fair, the trouble is that a lot of the people who cannot see the good stuff are too busy trying to sort out the broken stuff, to put their heads up to look around. 

Yeah, maybe complainers should take their heads out of their you know what and look around. Like so:

This sim has been around for only 30 days, devs have released two patches, are actively working to adress many of the bugs, and people still whine on and on. 

 

 

Edited September 20, 2020 by Ricardo41

[Tuskin38 6,468]

2 hours ago, flightsim1818 said:

I'm an airliner simmer and mostly fly A320. Unfortunately it is completely garbage after the latest patch.

What issues have you had with the A320? Other than the engine turning off, it’s been working fine for me. Until that’s fixed I just start on the runway, or use the skip to take off button after pushing back.

Edited September 20, 2020 by Tuskin38

[Old_As_Dirt 160]

I'm an old simmer going back to the Pro-Logic days  and it is amazing how the programs have evolved.  Someone here mentioned FSX (including the original poster) and, yes, it was the greatest at the time and served many for years.  I had, for the last few years, moved over to X-Plane after the failure of MS with Flight. This past week, I decided to try MSFS 2020 and boy was I in for a treat.  Yes, I was just in time for the latest update which has been the subject of many gripes.  Thinking back to FSX (and others), when you bought the program, that was it.  There were no updates (except for, I think, two patches - after some time) for FSX.  There was not much, if any, listening to users, and, for that matter, no ready means of distributing patches/updates. Although there are a few glitches with 2020, it is a great step forward and the team is working on them with frequent attempts to remedy them.  Let's don't push MS into doing what they did with Flight and cause them to figure that it's not worth the effort.  I have been around for 77 years now and have seen a lot and am not nearly as anxious for a "right now" resolution.  It is coming.  Have patience.

[mjw25 42]

I love your post !!  A Lot food for thought...Thanks for sharing.....

[wthomas33065 994]

9 hours ago, desbean said:

My use of the sim has ended since the patch broke every plane that I fly, so I guess it's hard to see the forest for the trees.

I wonder what other activities you judge with such scrutiny.  Every plane is broken?  Does that mean you can't fly it at all?  Are there not other planes you can discover?

I wonder if your picnic is ruined if the temperature is outside a range of 75 to 78 degrees?
Is an entire movie ruined for you when the person next to you gets up to go to the bathroom?

Is your dinner ruined when the waiter gets one aspect of your order wrong?
And what happens at a concert when the band doesn't play the exact playlist you want.  Or worse, the singer fouls up a line?
Do you dismiss an entire sporting event because your team lost?  

The point is, you can CHOOSE to let these issues ruin the experience or you can choose not to.  

Skyrim is a buggy mess.  Yet is is beloved by me and countless other gamers.  Why?  Because when it works, it really works.  No other RPG gives me the feeling of being in an actual populated world.  Does clipping occur.  Oh yean.  Is the AI dumb as rocks.  Absolutely.  There are countless memes and video parodies done to expose some of the ridiculousness of the game.  Yet those of us who play it find a way to look around the errors.  And when they happen, I just shake my head and go...."oh...Skyrim", smile, and move on.

The same holds true on this game.  I work around the bugs, I make due.  Why?

Because when this sim works, it works.  When I am flying through towering clouds feeling small, it works.   When I break out of a low ceiling and find myself still lined up and the runway smoothly coming towards me, it works.  When I fly over my home town and look 360 and recognize nearly everything.  It works.

The choice is up to you.  you can choose to focus on the issues, or focus on what you enjoy.  

Edited September 20, 2020 by wthomas33065

[flightsim1818 79]

4 hours ago, Tuskin38 said:

What issues have you had with the A320? Other than the engine turning off, it’s been working fine for me. Until that’s fixed I just start on the runway, or use the skip to take off button after pushing back.

PFD turned off during final (thanks for that), AP behaving erratic, flight dynamics and in the middle of the sky, out of the blue (literally) my A320 started to spin just like that scene in Top Gun back in the 80's. At that point I almost thought the sim was joking with me. It was fun and sad at the same time...

[ryanbatc 12,834]

5 hours ago, Ricardo41 said:

Yeah, maybe complainers should take their heads out of their you know what and look around. Like so:

This sim has been around for only 30 days, devs have released two patches, are actively working to adress many of the bugs, and people still whine on and on. 

 

 

I'm a rw pilot so I can appreciate the beauty of that screenshot and the very capable VFR simulator Asobo has created.  Unfortunately we are missing some important features that were present in earlier sims - such as correct taxiways, reliable/accurate weather, proper avioincs (which a 5 year old competitor sim has by default) and so on.

I try to remain optimistic though, as most of the issues could be fixed!

[Scottoest 1,561]

I think MSFS is pretty clearly going to be the sim platform of the future, and it's just a matter of exactly when that future "arrives" for people.

Some people are already there, and struggling with the bugs, unfinished systems, and early lack of critical payware add-ons - but dealing with it because what's there is great and promising in other ways.  For others it'll be when those fixes and updates have arrived, and they can do all of the kinds of basic things they can do in XP and P3D without incident.  For still more it'll be when their study level aircraft of choice start arriving.

And of course, some will stick to XP and P3D forever - which is fine.  It's just a hobby.  Some people have their setups configured just the way they want them, and don't want to abandon that for something new, and that's understandable.

Most skepticism of whether MSFS gets to that kind of maturity as software seems to rely on referring to nebulous "bean counters" at Microsoft, who will abandon this sim on the side of the road in six months when it is long into it's sales tail.  These people fundamentally haven't been following how Microsoft approaches game development for several years, it would seem - nor what their priorities are.

I also think this reality is why you're seeing some toxic backlash towards the sim as it takes it's early post-release steps, from people who very badly want to quickly write it off as pretty video game eye candy for teenagers and nothing more.

[desbean 357]

5 hours ago, wthomas33065 said:

I wonder what other activities you judge with such scrutiny.  Every plane is broken?  Does that mean you can't fly it at all?  Are there not other planes you can discover?

I wonder if your picnic is ruined if the temperature is outside a range of 75 to 78 degrees?
Is an entire movie ruined for you when the person next to you gets up to go to the bathroom?

Is your dinner ruined when the waiter gets one aspect of your order wrong?
And what happens at a concert when the band doesn't play the exact playlist you want.  Or worse, the singer fouls up a line?
Do you dismiss an entire sporting event because your team lost?  

 

Your analogies are silly. Try not to upset yourself when others are critical of the sim, and don't take it personally, remember it's just a sim, and you didn't create it. plonk

Edited September 20, 2020 by desbean

[wthomas33065 994]

44 minutes ago, desbean said:

Your analogies are silly. Try not to upset yourself when others are critical of the sim, and don't take it personally, remember it's just a sim, and you didn't create it.

....Says the man that says everything he flies in the sim is "broken".  Listen to your own advice.  It's just a sim.  Find happier roads.