3 hours ago, webstef68 said:

If i use afterburner my temp (2080ti) stays below 80 but my fans are running at almost 90%. Using the NVidia OC feature, the temp rises up to 85 but the fans are a lot quieter. The question is which of the fans or the chip will last longer ? I bet 85 deg for a chip is ok…

The hotter electronic components run, the shorter the life span. 85 C is 185 F. Try putting your hand on something that is 185F ( don't really you will burn the hell out of yourself. )

@Bobsk8 is absolutely right, electronics don't like to get hot, and cooler is definitely better for a longer life span. Especially power electronics. Anything you're planning on keeping a long time needs to be carefully thermally managed - I say this as someone who's ran their PC at 25%+ overclock for a decade, that CPU is rated to 95'c but it was recommended to keep it below 80'c and mine barely touches 73'c with an aftermarket cooler - my overclock was not limited by thermal considerations but concerns about long term usage at higher voltages.

@webstef68 However, graphics cards are designed and tested to run at temperatures in excess of 90'c, and whilst there will undoubtedly be some lifespan shortening with high temperatures within that range, unless you are planning on keeping it for 10+ years and fly many hours each month, it's very likely going to be someone else's problem unless there is a manufacturing defect with the card. If you go over the manufacturer's specified limit then you are into unchartered waters and bad things might happen sooner, but most cards have thermal throttling these days.

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by ckyliu

16 minutes ago, ckyliu said:

@Bobsk8 is absolutely right, electronics don't like to get hot, and cooler is definitely better for a longer life span. Especially power electronics. Anything you're planning on keeping a long time needs to be carefully thermally managed - I say this as someone who's ran their PC at 25%+ overclock for a decade, that CPU is rated to 95'c but it was recommended to keep it below 80'c and mine barely touches 70'c with an aftermarket cooler - my overclock was not limited by thermal considerations but concerns about long term usage at higher voltages.

@webstef68 However, graphics cards are designed and tested to run at temperatures in excess of 90'c, and whilst there will undoubtedly be some lifespan shortening with high temperatures within that range, unless you are planning on keeping it for 10+ years and fly many hours each month, it's very likely going to be someone else's problem unless there is a manufacturing defect with the card. If you go over the manufacturer's specified limit then you are into unchartered waters and bad things might happen sooner, but most cards have thermal throttling these days.

So the question is should i worry about the chip or fans lifespan ?

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by webstef68

Forgive me for answering the question with another question, but... how long do you plan to keep it and how much will you use it at that high temperature?

All in all, 5'c is not going to make a huge difference but I'd be minded to run the fans faster and chip cooler, for the reasons Bob said. I have a custom fan curve setup in MSI afterburner which brings the fans up to speed much sooner but does not allow them ever reach 100% speed.

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by ckyliu

1 hour ago, webstef68 said:

I had to enable the fps cap to cool down  within the menus, and this is where perhaps they could do something in the code ?

That’s true. The dev mode shows sometime 500 FPS in the menu and the GPU Fans go brrrrrrrrr

28 minutes ago, swiesma said:

That’s true. The dev mode shows sometime 500 FPS in the menu and the GPU Fans go brrrrrrrrr

This is why in the Sim I use V-Sync and FPS set to 30, but also use RTSS and lock FPS to 32, I use 32 so i can see when the SIM's FPS is not in use. RTSS set to 32 for menus etc stops huge FPS spikes and the GPU going crazy to draw completly wasted FPS.

I like to keep my CPU and GPU as cool as possable.

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by Nyxx

58 minutes ago, ckyliu said:

Forgive me for answering the question with another question, but... how long do you plan to keep it and how much will you use it?

All in all, 5'c is not going to make a huge difference but I'd be minded to run the fans faster and chip cooler, for the reasons Bob said. I have a custom fan curve setup in MSI afterburner which brings the fans up to speed much sooner but does not allow them ever reach 100% speed.

i would say 10 hours a week 5 years long so perhaps 2600 hours…if the Gods allow me to 😋

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by webstef68

21 hours ago, killthespam said:

The problem I see is that MSFS2020 is not properly optimized (Compared to P3D, XP11, DCS)

How did you arrive to that conclusion, if you don't have access to the actual code? P3D, XP11 and probably DCS are CPU dependent and so most high end cards end up being under utilized.

If MSFS users don't lock frames, then most video cards will be pushed to the limits. I have mine locked at 20 within sim (my curved monitor is configured to 120Hz,t that equals to 40fps) my card won't go higher than 85% in most scenarios with  almost all settings in Ultra.

The fact that I'm able to fly with constant 40fps with lots of eye candy on a pc that is more then 5years old, I call that properly optimized if you ask me.

 

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by CarlosF

1 hour ago, CarlosF said:

How did you arrive to that conclusion, if you don't have access to the actual code? P3D, XP11 and probably DCS are CPU dependent and so most high end cards end up being under utilized.

If MSFS users don't lock frames, then most video cards will be pushed to the limits. I have mine locked at 20 within sim (my curved monitor is configured to 120Hz,t that equals to 40fps) my card won't go higher than 85% in most scenarios with  almost all settings in Ultra.

The fact that I'm able to fly with constant 40fps with lots of eye candy on a pc that is more then 5years old, I call that properly optimized if you ask me.

 

Carlos,

 

My "conclusion" is based on what I see, scientific or not, numbers are what they are.

Unfortunately, many of us are not "programmers" to make a sound decision, there are many discussions pointing to different "speculations. All that I see is that MSFS for some reason is creating this issue, high temps and fans going crazy while other games don't suffer as much from this.

If it was all across the other games I would suspect a faulty programing or design of the video card.

Right now, IMHO seeing this behavior only in this particular case I suspect some oversight, coding, programming issue. 

Also, I agree that we can go and tweak underclocking, under-volting, limiting FPS etc, basically compensating for something that other games don't require.

All that I'm trying to say is that we should not go to this extend to adjust and find a solution/fix for a game that has a problem like this while others don't have.

The bottom line is that it should be investigated especially when there are so many complaints about it. Not to try to silence or argue because some of us don't see it or it's not a concern, we should sympathize (respect) others' points of view.

 

Thank you. 

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/p48wtbiz5o8hqmv/MSFS2020.jpg?dl=0

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9hngikuy7y210wc/P3D.jpg?dl=0

 

 

83C for a GPU is nothing to worry about. 

100% utilization is normal after SU5.

4 hours ago, ckyliu said:

@Bobsk8 is absolutely right, electronics don't like to get hot, and cooler is definitely better for a longer life span. Especially power electronics. Anything you're planning on keeping a long time needs to be carefully thermally managed - I say this as someone who's ran their PC at 25%+ overclock for a decade, that CPU is rated to 95'c but it was recommended to keep it below 80'c and mine barely touches 73'c with an aftermarket cooler - my overclock was not limited by thermal considerations but concerns about long term usage at higher voltages.

@webstef68 However, graphics cards are designed and tested to run at temperatures in excess of 90'c, and whilst there will undoubtedly be some lifespan shortening with high temperatures within that range, unless you are planning on keeping it for 10+ years and fly many hours each month, it's very likely going to be someone else's problem unless there is a manufacturing defect with the card. If you go over the manufacturer's specified limit then you are into unchartered waters and bad things might happen sooner, but most cards have thermal throttling these days.

You are right, but in my experience with GPUs, the fans go before the GPU itself. 

Like you said, they are built to run at 85C or more. 

On my RTX 3090 I'm running Silent Bios which means 70% fan speed at maximum. That results in lower noise, less stress on the fans and about 85C on the chip. It's thermal throttling of course, and a bit of reduced performance vs Performance Bios. Still it beats just about everything out there. I plan on keeping my card for at least 4-5 years. 

I only game around 2-3 hours a day, the rest of the time it's just chilling with 0 RPM fan speed. 

I just wish Asobo would give us sliders for even more performance.

On 8/11/2021 at 7:05 PM, lambourne said:

Same card here. I have an aggressive fan profile, over 75 C my fans ramp up very quickly to 100%. I've been wondering about reversing the top fan in my case so it's pulling hot air out instead of pulling cool air in.

Go for it. I did this experiment myself trying fans pulling air in or blowing out - blowing air out of the top was several degrees cooler for the graphic card.

1 hour ago, Republic3D said:

83C for a GPU is nothing to worry about. 

100% utilization is normal after SU5.

I had set up my sim for 100% gpu utilization initially by bumping up render scaling  then the London update came and screwed that over.

Glad to see that 100% utilization of my GPU has returned. That's how its supposed to be running. Ill concede that its absolutely not necessary when in the Menu or running updates however so in that regard they probably need to look at that. Otherwise im very happy with it running at maximum.

3 hours ago, JSmith2112 said:

Go for it. I did this experiment myself trying fans pulling air in or blowing out - blowing air out of the top was several degrees cooler for the graphic card.

When I built my current pc I did a pull fan in front and a push fan on top, which seemed (as you found) to be the best.

But here's where my build isn't working quite as expected -- I wanted "positive pressure" such that just a little more air was going out, than was coming in.  The idea being that dust is reduced inside the case.  My case insides still get dusty.  Maybe it's not as bad as it would be otherwise, if I hadn't built any positive pressure at all.  And maybe I didn't quite get that right.  Any of you know about positive pressure?

1 hour ago, Mace said:

But here's where my build isn't working quite as expected -- I wanted "positive pressure" such that just a little more air was going out, than was coming in.  The idea being that dust is reduced inside the case.  My case insides still get dusty.

What you describe is negative pressure. For positive pressure, you need to push more air in then you take out.

Positive pressure may reduce dust a bit, as any air gaps will have air going out of the case (pushed out by positive pressure within the case relative to ambient outside) rather than being sucked in... but the vast bulk of dust is still being blown in by fans so it would be far more effective to have intake filters.

With positive pressure you can get deadspots of still air and weird airflow, in my day job where I design room ventilation we aim for slight negative pressure for this reason; we mechnically replace about 80% of the air we extract but the rest is left to natural draught infill to ensure proper air circulation around the space.

Amongst PC builders there is no concensus, some swear by positive pressure (with filters on intake fans) others insist on negative pressure. I'm on the negative pressure side of the fence (no prizes for guessing that correctly)

Edited August 12, 20214 yr by ckyliu