Agreed, we will see what happens.

13 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

ms2020 was always going to be aimed and sold to young gamer kids who like farting about, and not old farts like us who like to fly tuber liners and take it a bit more seriously

Utter nonsense.

11 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

No worries.  Anyways, for those who are interested, here is the source quote from Iceman, the lead developer of the FBW A320:

So to emulate any systems for aircraft products that target the PC and not X-Box, the MSFS SDK has always been complete from day 1 (aside from the weather radar).  The Fenix team always knew that the MSFS SDK was capable for their needs since 2020, and that's why they were able to proceed with their A320 project.  The limitations and dependency on the MSFS SDK kick in for aircraft products that target the X-Box (ie. PMDG want to release their 737 on the X-Box, so PMDG is more reliant on the MSFS SDK than Fenix is).  Regarding PMDG, I believe they have surpassed the last of their hurdles with the MSFS SDK, so it's very likely the PMDG 737 will have all of its capabilities on the X-Box version as well, so the MSFS SDK should be comprehensive enough now (minus the weather radar), even for the X-Box (however, due to sandbox issues, Microsoft still needs to patch the X-Box so that the PMDG DC-6 and PMDG 737 can be released on the X-Box).

According to the Prosim team there are still SDK features not ready for MSFS. And they are pc only developers. They use a lot of workarounds to have the 737 flying in MSFS.

Rob A also showed  multiple MSFS SDK features that said Not ready a while ago. And Robert from PMDG also wrote several times that they could not develop the 737 any further till Asobo worked on some issues. He just wrote that they can continue as several issues have been solved and they use workarounds for others.

That is the opposite of what Iceman stated….

Left or right : There is some movement towards the correct direction 😄
 

- - - 

Regarding P3D developers : I hope that there will be released new scenery/aircraft (updates) in the future, 

Edited February 6, 20224 yr by GSalden

24 minutes ago, GSalden said:

According to the Prosim team there are still SDK features not ready for MSFS. And they are pc only developers.

Rob A also showed  multiple MSFS SDK features that said Not ready a while ago. And Robert from PMDG also wrote several times that they could not develop the 737 any further till Asobo worked on some issues 

That is the opposite of what Iceman stated….

So I think we need to separate the SDK needs for the systems of aircraft products such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc, versus the SDK needs for other products such as Prosim or Rob A's products.  What Iceman is referring to is the MSFS SDK for the systems of aircraft such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc.  The MSFS SDK has everything there for the systems of aircraft so you can make a study level airliner, except for the weather radar at WASM level, if that aircraft is only released on PC. 

The MSFS SDK may still be missing features for non-aircraft products such as Prosim, Rob A's product, 3rd party weather products, etc.  What Iceman said is for aircraft products.  I think I specifically mentioned systems for aircraft products in my second post in this thread (I did say systems in my first post, but I thought systems for aircraft products was implied, but since I cannot edit my first post, I meant to say systems for aircraft products).

PS. I hope you get what I mean when I say aircraft products such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, since Prosim is still related to aircraft systems.  I can't figure out an exact word that separates products like PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc, from products like ProSim.

Edited February 6, 20224 yr by abrams_tank

14 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

So I think we need to separate the SDK needs for the systems of aircraft products such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc, versus the SDK needs for other products such as Prosim or Rob A's products.  What Iceman is referring to is the MSFS SDK for the systems of aircraft such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc.  The MSFS SDK has everything there for the systems of aircraft so you can make a study level airliner, except for the weather radar at WASM level, if that aircraft is only released on PC. 

The MSFS SDK may still be missing features for non-aircraft products such as Prosim, Rob A's product, 3rd party weather products, etc.  What Iceman said is for aircraft products.  I think I specifically mentioned systems for aircraft products in my second post in this thread (I did say systems in my first post, but I thought systems for aircraft products was implied, but since I cannot edit my first post, I meant to say systems for aircraft products).

PS. I hope you get what I mean when I say aircraft products such as PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, since Prosim is still related to aircraft systems.  I can't figure out an exact word that separates products like PMDG 737, Fenix A320, Maddog, etc, from products like ProSim.

You are probably correct.

Prosim has a flightmodel inside MSFS and all Prosim modules are running outside MSFS and “talk” to MSFS via Simconnect. That indeed might be different from the FBW approach.

When I use the Prosim WASM module that shows outside parts moving and external lights after 1-1,5h the framerate starts to drop. At the end it seemed that the continuesly Trim corrections caused it as the data flow is too much for the current state of the SDK/Simconnect.

However, when complex ac start to come to MSFS I beleave MSFS will support more and more features.

 

 

@fluffyflopsI basically agree with your premise that the market is niche.  I don't think the whole market is going to die out.  I think it will go back to what it was before.  A small niche market with limited 3rd party developers making addons.  I can remember for 6 months or so after MSFS first came out.  Getting flight sim questions from friends who don't care at all about flight sim.  But they have moved on.  The articles in blogs and magazines have also moved on.  I can't find the link but somebody showed publicly available data that is showing MSFS steam usage beginning its descent.  I'm sure abrams has it somewhere.  

Gents, this topic is about MilViz and P3D. If you’re going to continue to discuss MSFS then start a topic in that forum please.

I was looking for the Milviz B55 update for V5 but it was not available to vendor sites like Just Flight. If you contact Milviz support with your vendor purchase number they will add it to your forum support account for download. Works just fine in V5.3. Can anyone confirm if the C310 Redux will work with the V4 install redirect method? And is it with or without the ORBX rain and true glass? 

6 hours ago, fluffyflops said:

the top streamer on ms2020 has 49 people watching it. ,  there is 12884 watching some fool play Pokemon

The numbers speak for themselves, no one is want to invest a ton of money when the figures look like that.,  49 verses 12k, thats how niche the flightsim market is.

Did you just measure the success of a flight sim by counting the number of watchers of a live stream on Twitch?

Did you tell Milviz and the other 200 3rd party developers that they cleary made the wrong decision by ditching P3D?

37 minutes ago, Multisim said:

Did you just measure the success of a flight sim by counting the number of watchers of a live stream on Twitch?

Did you tell Milviz and the other 200 3rd party developers that they cleary made the wrong decision by ditching P3D?

I don't recall seeing him say that is the only measure of flight sim success.  I think you are inferring something he never implied.  Not to mention you would struggle to come up with a list of 200 3rd party developers that stopped p3d productions entirely.  Going back to his early point.  I believe even Milviz would acknowledge that the long term market for complicated (study level) airplanes probably hasn't changed much due to MSFS.  Though the market for captainsim like addons probably has.  

On 2/6/2022 at 3:05 AM, abrams_tank said:

 I would want accurate information about P3D or XP as well

When someone does that in the MSFS forum, you are one of the first to ignore and tell him to go back to to his forum.

No you want, for some interest, to push MSFS a la promotional content.

Otherwise, if your claim was true, you will understand how many wrong claims you personally made through out those last months, maybe even more than a year.

And it's also time to stop quoting people who currently work for MSFS (FBW) as they have the biggest interest to defend it. Funny enough when they quote wrong info about other flight sims from the MSFS SDK (very low move by MSFS, very low, no wonder it got deleted but the same claims are still being made), you are also the first one to requote them as a "proof" for MSFS superiority.

So no dear @abrams_tank, you are the LAST one in here who can claim he only wants to get accurate information spread. 

Edited February 7, 20224 yr by mtaxp

If the next post in this MilViz topic in the P3D forum is about MSFS it will be locked.

2 minutes ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

If the next post in this MilViz topic in the P3D forum is about MSFS it will be locked.

How about just delete the garbage?

Nothing last forever.