38 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

In 2-3 years you would get a full new sim with freshened features and core additions that give a leap in fidilety.

You must be new to flight simming, because nothing like that has ever happened in the history of it. MSFS gets more continued updates than any other platform in the entire history of the genre. Think about how complex this piece of software is. Not only does it have to simulate the entire EARTH and it's live weather, it also has to simulate flight dynamics and aerodynamics, it has to render entire aircraft, which at default, absolutely destroys any other platform, it has to simulate avionics, along with thousands of other things, all working in harmony to display what you see on your screen. To criticize MSFS and Asobo that they're going too slow is complete hogwash. We are leaps and bounds further ahead now because of this team. I can only imagine how lucky we'll be in 3 years from now. Manage your expectations and be happy that we have such smart and well financed people bringing our hobby back to life.  

1 hour ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

Where did the OP say that?

I can look out the window of an airliner at 30,000ft and see individual buildings.

His original post: "Being able to fly over my home area and recognize everyday landmarks (our local supermarket and even the fastfood restaurant we go to on Thursdays) straight-out-of-the-box makes it impossible for me to go back to any other flightsim."  He clearly was not talking about flying at 30,000 feet!

one can only compare msfs2020 to other flight simulators, no analogies needed  😎

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by icewater5
on topic

@Bdub22 Just a note that I think you quoted the wrong person there. 

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by Virtual-Chris

i can 😁 probably were lol, no seriously tho you sent good posts just on this one point this thing is moving forward. I have seen many online videos as well and it is definately a fast upward curve, despite tech problems some are having.

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by icewater5

1 minute ago, icewater5 said:

i can 😁

I think we were editing posts at the same time. 🙂

4 hours ago, David Mills said:

I completely agree with @lwt1971.

The OP "review" totally omitted any direct comparison of MSFS to P3D or to X-Plane. So, instead, the "review" compared MSFS to perfection rather than to any real-world alternative product. But as @lwt1971 states, I'll happily take MSFS and the Asobo developers over any alleged "competition." 

I clearly stated I've not got much previous experience with other flight Sims, therefore a comparison of any kind would not be fair especially to Sims I've never played(!).

Not every review has to compare to the competition in the genre, I view this Sim as a new *to me* genre of gaming and reviewed it as such 🙂

10 hours ago, blueshark747 said:

Folks are just angry they aren't fixing the VR issues at their own personal pace and expectations.

Sorry but that's not where I'm coming from, having been involved with racing simulations, where the Dev team is a fraction of MS/Asobo, I've seen VR progress much quicker than what I have here. As I said the SU7 debacle is nothing to do with being angry about the pace, it was a blatant disregard for VR users to release a build that totally broke a large segment of the game and then still not have it fully fixed to this day (as I clearly stated in the OP).

They had a VR Team, there are therefore no excuses for the glacial progress up to the point they merged that team back into the standard Dev team. I just don't think they knew what they were doing really and it shows.

But again, I'm not hating on the VR experience so please read the whole review, I clearly said it's awesome and I've had so much fun in VR, I'm "angry" (more disappointed actually) at the lacklustre attitude from the developers towards VR - especially when they had a dedicated team working on it.

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by MarcG

Well that fast food restaurant is at a visual reporting point so it has its uses 😉 For IFR I don't find MSFS to be especially worse than FSX (except the flight planning map, which is terrible).

 

3 hours ago, Bdub22 said:

You must be new to flight simming, because nothing like that has ever happened in the history of it. MSFS gets more continued updates than any other platform in the entire history of the genre. Think about how complex this piece of software is. Not only does it have to simulate the entire EARTH and it's live weather, it also has to simulate flight dynamics and aerodynamics, it has to render entire aircraft, which at default, absolutely destroys any other platform, it has to simulate avionics, along with thousands of other things, all working in harmony to display what you see on your screen. To criticize MSFS and Asobo that they're going too slow is complete hogwash. We are leaps and bounds further ahead now because of this team. I can only imagine how lucky we'll be in 3 years from now. Manage your expectations and be happy that we have such smart and well financed people bringing our hobby back to life.  

It hasn't? May be you have forgotten:

FS98 - FS2000: Became true global flight sim with very high coverage of airports, mesh, vector and scenery land class around the earth

FS2000 - FS2002:

1. Global 3D autogen system

2. 3D virtual cockpit

3. Interactive ATC and AI system that flies full flights

What special has FS2020 done in the two years of most updates in history? It couldn't even come on par with the keyboard controls, camera system, AI/ATC, weather of FSX or address all its own release bugs completely to a satisfactory final version in this time. Also in any of the new sims in FS history it never happened that a feature was blatantly left downgraded without a better addition to take its place, any feature from previous sims was never felt missed in the latest.

Still can not understand that "on a runway and wheels leave the ground = takeoff" logic is still missing after 2 years.

1 hour ago, MarcG said:

Sorry but that's not where I'm coming from, having been involved with racing simulations, where the Dev team is a fraction of MS/Asobo, I've seen VR progress much quicker than what I have here. As I said the SU7 debacle is nothing to do with being angry about the pace, it was a blatant disregard for VR users to release a build that totally broke a large segment of the game and then still not have it fully fixed to this day (as I clearly stated in the OP).

They had a VR Team, there are therefore no excuses for the glacial progress up to the point they merged that team back into the standard Dev team. I just don't think they knew what they were doing really and it shows.

But again, I'm not hating on the VR experience so please read the whole review, I clearly said it's awesome and I've had so much fun in VR, I'm "angry" (more disappointed actually) at the lacklustre attitude from the developers towards VR - especially when they had a dedicated team working on it.

VR isn't one of the top priorities for MS/Asobo and no matter what they say I'll never believe there's an actual dedicated VR team for MSFS, it's most likely a couple of team member's low priority additional duty.🤣

You can't compared race sim dev teams like Kunos, Slighty Mad or Image Space Incorporated's VR progress to a huge complex multilayered full globe flight simulator like MSFS.

Project Cars 2 VR implementation and performance was absolute rubbish compared to MSFS, it was a rushed and poorly optimized feature that didn't even mesh well with half of PCars2 graphics options.

Kuno's implementation with Assetto Corsa was pretty much bare minimum, 3rd party mod creators gave the VR feature the icing and cherry on top it needed..ie Content Manager, Natural Graphics Mod, Real Head Motion, Top Center Flags for VR. 

I don't feel RFactor2's VR is even worth a mention.

I get your enthusiasm and passion for MSFS's VR feature but I feel your expectations are too high for MS/Asobo's particular progress pace and continuity with VR. 

Where something as simple as the VR menu resize bug was deliberately ignored for months, I'll keep my expectations low of what comes out of Jorge's mouth and this "dedicated MS/Asobo VR department" will continue to be a fairytale.🤣

Still a great flight sim with the best VR implementation I've ever experienced as someone who's been around since Oculus DK1 and DCOC.

 

 

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by blueshark747

27 minutes ago, him225 said:

What special has FS2020 done in the two years of most updates in history?

Good question ?  I ask myself that same question whenever I seat at the desktop to play an airline or GA flight under real world weather with a scenery that looks so close to real I couldn't have imagined was possible at such performance levels, with cockpits and illuminaton that are 2nd to none, even default ATC and AI that isn't  2nd to any other default system in other editions of MS FS, X-Plane, P3D, name it sim....

What the heck have this guys been doing that prevented me from uninstalling MSFS since SU9 ?  

Are these guys serious ?  Is this what developing a general purpose flight simulator is ?  And now they even have redesigned the whole rotary wing flight dynamics, will include gliders with realistic operations and soaring wweather ?

What do they think ?  They must be kidding.... 

P.S.: And yet, I am still eagerly awaiting XP12, and still find IL-2 to be the most advanced flight simulator I ever used in terms of feel of flight / flight dynamics..., but those two have their own places in my simmer heart ! 

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by jcomm

20 minutes ago, jcomm said:

Good question ?  I ask myself that same question whenever I seat at the desktop to play an airline or GA flight under real world weather with a scenery that looks so close to real I couldn't have imagined was possible at such performance levels, with cockpits and illuminaton that are 2nd to none, even default ATC and AI that isn't  2nd to any other default system in other editions of MS FS, X-Plane, P3D, name it sim....

What the heck have this guys been doing that prevented me from uninstalling MSFS since SU9 ?  

Are these guys serious ?  Is this what developing a general purpose flight simulator is ?  And now they even have redesigned the whole rotary wing flight dynamics, will include gliders with realistic operations and soaring wweather ?

What do they think ?  They must be kidding.... 

P.S.: And yet, I am still eagerly awaiting XP12, and still find IL-2 to be the most advanced flight simulator I ever used in terms of feel of flight / flight dynamics..., but those two have their own places in my simmer heart ! 

Good question isn't it, if you draw a clear line between release features and time for fixing those and then feature additions thereafter?

AI system 2nd to none what are you talking about? The AI engine is badly downgraded even for default content, it just makes it less noticeable. The splattering touchdown of AI, the silly taxiing roundabouts, bankless turns in air, cruising AI spawning at your altitude than their cruise level, etc its like a high school project to look at, the whole thing feels worse than FS2000 fidelity in motion which didn't even have a proper AI engine.

Have a look at this at 18:44, you call it 2nd to none? :

BEST Freeware AI TRAFFIC For MSFS | Tutorial + Guide! - YouTube

3 minutes ago, him225 said:

Good question isn't it, if you draw a clear line between release features and time for fixing those and then feature additions thereafter?

AI system 2nd to none what are you talking about? The AI engine is badly downgraded even for default content, it just makes it less noticeable. The splattering touchdown of AI, the silly taxiing roundabouts, bankless turns in air, cruising AI spawning at your altitude than their cruise level, etc its like a high school project to look at, the whole thing feels worse than FS2000 fidelity in motion which didn't even have a proper AI engine.

Have a look at this at 18:44, you call it 2nd to none? :

BEST Freeware AI TRAFFIC For MSFS | Tutorial + Guide! - YouTube

I see you use P3D.  And you keep harping on what little MSFS has done in the last 2 years. So maybe let's reverse the script. Nevermind the last 2 years for P3D. What has P3D done in the last 10 years?

Edited August 30, 20223 yr by abrams_tank