4 minutes ago, Zangoose said:

Just an FYI if you didn't know: A lot of X-Plane users do not buy it from steam due to slow updates.

Which is why I explicitly said "assuming more XP users buy XP 12 from the LR website, what's important above is the comparison of the peak XP 12 users relative to XP 11 users in Steam."  So if you consider that XP users bought XP 11 from Steam, what matters is the scale of peak XP 11 users on Steam versus peak XP 12 users on Steam.

Edited October 24, 20223 yr by abrams_tank

1 hour ago, abrams_tank said:

Thanks for posting XEnviro's Facebook post!  If XEnviro is developing for XP 12, that's a weird decision because XP 12 doesn't seem to be doing so well according to the latest SteamDB charts:

(assuming more XP users buy XP 12 from the LR website, what's important above is the comparison of the peak XP 12 users relative to XP 11 users in Steam).

As for developing for XP 11, well, that's kind of a dead end because over time, users will gradually leave XP 11.  I think XEnviro needs to think up other products for MSFS, but perhaps not a weather related product since Asobo has no plans to expand the weather SDK for MSFS.

For the 9000 times  X Plane 12 is in beta so the numbers are expected to be small. But when you look at look a 2 year released of MSFS they dropped from 61,829 to 8,362 peak use is nothing to be proud of either. We already know steam charts doesn't not tell the whole story and doesn't prove your point.

Just now, BobFS88 said:

For the 9000 times  X Plane 12 is in beta so the numbers are expected to be small. But when you look at look a 2 year released of MSFS they dropped from 61,829 to 8,362 peak use is nothing to be proud of either. We already know steam charts doesn't not tell the whole story and doesn't prove your point.

Beta or not, XP 12 is released. Like all games that release, the peak numbers are at the start of the release.

A lot of other video games also have peak numbers when they release on Steam, even if it's a beta release on Steam.

8 minutes ago, abrams_tank said:

A lot of other video games also have peak numbers when they release on Steam, even if it's a beta release on Steam.

As others keep pointing out to you and you fail to see, the user community are not you typical user on steams. So those number don't mean squat. 

Edited October 24, 20223 yr by BobFS88

How did I guess this would turn in to an XP argument...

18 hours ago, ryanbatc said:

 The XP12 clouds are awful for fps.  And if you disable AA in favor of fps you get a lot of shimmers.  I bought XP12 but I'm hardly using it.  It needs to be refined A LOT.

Aren't you running a 1440p monitor? Even if you aren't, the fact that you need a new GPU to satisfy your demands, is undeniable. The 1080ti is now a mid-tier card. It competes with the 3060.

That said, there are 2 possible responses here: "it's a beta" 

and

the ray marching algorithm used by XP12 draw out the cloud volumes is more advanced than the competition and therefore takes up more computational resources. I'm betting it's some of both.

 

17 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

I'm so glad MSFS clouds are so much better than XP 12 clouds

Anyways, I think live weather will get better an better for MSFS over time. I'm not sure what is the value of XEnviro for MSFS, aside from historical weather. I know some people want historical weather in MSFS so they have an add-on that can provide it now for the time being.

You make it sound as though you are being forced to use a flight simulator every day and that it tastes like medicine! 

Given the financial resources going into M$F$, it's very surprising that the weather engine still needs this much work. That's a fundamental, no? Weather should have been settled a long time ago. That said, I don't even think Asobo is running the weather model...but whatever.

 

I put historical weather as more important than live weather. It makes up for the sadness that comes with having to go to work every morning and miss a good weather system. In fact, historical weather can be more accurate than live because you aren't worrying about rolling in the weather predictions.

Now...a lot of people get angry when they don't see their desired cloud formations and winds. Interpolation volumes of this size (weather for the region or even planet) are notoriously difficult to nail with the precision users demand. The METARs get rolled up into a giant volume of points. Because of the surface area being covered, the spatial resolution of the volume is necessarily more coarse than what you'd need to nail the weather over a specific airport. Even if your airport does have a dedicated point in the volume, the conditions are going to get averaged out by the conditions at neighboring data points in the volume (airports or not). Using high-order interpolation schemes might improve the weather at your airport, but will create wonky transitions between weather conditions (e.g. sudden jumps in wind speed/direction).

XP12 is too new to test this, but I'd bet you could travel 30-60 miles away from the airport and run into the conditions you demand to see. I imagine Asobo's model would be similar. The conditions are actually in there, just at a different point in the volume. Such is interpolation.

2 hours ago, Ricardo41 said:

So, what the developer is basically saying: My first priority continues to be Xplane, but I'll make a quick detour to MSFS in order to vacuum up some cash.

 

3 hours ago, omarsmak30 said:

So to summarize what Magnus is saying, "well is a fast money grab and we did it in few days to just suck some $$$ out of MSFS users in order to fund XP11 development". 

 

4 hours ago, ZKOKQ said:

The developer had posted on FB that the revenue from sales in XP11 had dried up, and released this port over of Xenviro to generate cash.  Read what you may into this. 

 

Pretty sure many of the xenviro team are Ukrainians. Magnus might have a poor reputation, but given current conditions, his declaration carries more weight than just a cash grab.

Read what you may into that.

Edited October 24, 20223 yr by blingthinger

Haha ok, first of all Abram's comparisons are relevant in the context of what Xenviro said on their FB page. Secondly, I know some of you don't want to face reality but when the XP12 beta launched, the no.1 request I saw EVERYWHERE was Steam support. You can argue all you want about where most users go but the fact of the matter is, a significant amount of them use Steam and those numbers can be used as a sample to get some insight into what's going on with the market share. MSFS is dwarfing everything else. Deal with it. 

1 hour ago, blingthinger said:

his declaration carries more weight than just a cash grab.

Well if he wants donation, we will be happy to donate giving the current conditions but selling a cash grab or scam, no way 

Edited October 24, 20223 yr by omarsmak30

1 hour ago, blingthinger said:

the ray marching algorithm used by XP12 draw out the cloud volumes is more advanced than the competition and therefore takes up more computational resources. I'm betting it's some of both.

That gif of Nicholas Cage laughing in Face/Off would really work well as a reply here but I'm too lazy to make it happen lol. So you're saying they're using a more complex algorithm that makes their clouds look absolutely horrible? Let me know if I'm misunderstanding you.

XP clouds sneak into the mix again! The steady slow decline in users will continue to put devoted developers out of business that refuse to switch platforms. Facts and figures tell the truth. Unfortunately certain YTubers don’t tell the truth for a host of reasons and lead the average or occasional flight simmer consumer down a false garden path to believe in a product. Accountability is another lost art in the age of social media.

I wouldn't even install this if I'd get it for free. Clear and obvious and even acknowledged money grab. No, thank you. What a joke. I wonder if it actually does anything apart from screwing up the MSFS weather with one single crappy algorithm.

The comments here, just shows many of us are not stupid to throw $$$ at Magnus due to the xE's history. Q8Pilot has screwed himself, big times. Unsubscribed  

3 minutes ago, omarsmak30 said:

The comments here, just shows many of us are not stupid to throw $$$ at Magnus due to the xE's history. Q8Pilot has screwed himself, big times. Unsubscribed  

A sampling from the comments (with user names removed)

It's very disappointing that Osamah (Q8pilot) has become such a sap for the developer Xenviro. It's like he doesn't seem to understand how the developer has burned many bridges with his customers and potential customers. The developer of Xenviro has a bad reputation, and for good reason. It's a wonder that he treated so many people rudely and believed that that can be a good business model. It can't. This is why the Xenviro product continues to be bad. Just ask any simmer. And I've lost respect for Osamah for basically becoming a lapdog for the Xenviro creator. Even during the video, Osamah kept saying how " he has to be careful what he says..". Osamah repeated this over and over again. It was like the Xenviro developer owns him or something. And don't say anything negative about the product or you will be banned by his mods in chat. That's not objective reviewing of a product. That's disingenuous. Creepy. Sadly. Who does Osamah work for? Magnus?

He does, few months ago he built an official partnership with The Threshold (where Magnus or Capt Kitten is involved). He mentionned this in some vidéos.

Indeed, such a sad thing Osamah has damaged his own reputation with his "praising" this scam add-one

39 minutes ago, Krakin said:

I'm too lazy

I concur.

39 minutes ago, Krakin said:

complex algorithm that makes their clouds look absolutely horrible

Nice subjective twist of my words. I'll gladly take XP12's sometimes wonky shapes in the beta version over Asobo's frequently absurdly dark and grey cloud blobs (think volcanic eruptions and nuclear fallout) any day.

What IS a joke, is the fact that Asobo is still making such significant changes to the weather visualization after so much time and so much investment $$. Resource$ vs. resource$, LR is far more impressive. But that's a side note.

 

As for the thread topic:

2 minutes ago, omarsmak30 said:

not stupid to throw $$$ at Magnus due to the xE's history

I agree this is a perfectly valid reason for not spending the money.

I'm saying that the claim that it's a simple greedy cash grab overlooks the tragedy at hand. That's all.