Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I've not read the entire thread, but one theory I've heard is that the pilot said gear up and the co pilot operated the flap lever instead, by mistake.

1 hour ago, martin-w said:

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I've not read the entire thread, but one theory I've heard is that the pilot said gear up and the co pilot operated the flap lever instead, by mistake.

That theory has now slid down the list of likely causes. Still on there until conclusively disproven though. 

It seems more like a loss of thrust in both engines shortly after lift off (for whatever reason). 

It looks (and sounds) like the Ram Air Turbine was deployed. The list of things that can trigger its deployment is fairly short. 

DB

5 hours ago, jon b said:

If there was insufficient lift or thrust the aircraft would either have not got airborne or climbed very slowly at a very shallow angle, not climbed to 600ft and the descended. And non of those would cause RAT deployment.

That's the thing - there must have been adequate thrust at least until the plane got off the ground, so whatever catastrophe that caused the loss of power must have happened almost immediately after rotation, giving precious little time to respond even if the pilots could have averted a crash somehow.

Dave

2 hours ago, RobPol471 said:

in many airports you do not see planes that need longer runways to land/take off and it makes no sense to use the entire runway before taking off to have more speed than VR, considering the danger of obstacles or houses near the runways such as, for example, at VAAH

Actually that’s exactly what is done in the case of an obstacle limited runway. It’s known as using “unbalanced V speeds”  for improved climb gradients thereby increasing the obstacle limited RTOW.

It’s a bit complicated and beyond my current level of motivation to explain in detail.

The reason, I suspect ,this particular flight used all the runway is one or both of the engines weren’t developing the required thrust. The aircraft then has reduced acceleration up to VR but performance is predicted on the aircraft  reaching a height of 35ft by the end of the runway on one engine.

23 minutes ago, dave2013 said:

there must have been adequate thrust at least until the plane got off the ground, so whatever catastrophe that caused the loss of power must have happened almost immediately after rotation

Indeed, or if the reports of the aircraft rotating later than is usual are correct, it may have been in the process of happening between V1 and VR.

If the aircraft only became airborne right at the end of that 11500 feet long runway, then I cannot see any option other than it lost some power during the acceleration sequence.

3 hours ago, jon b said:

Actually that’s exactly what is done in the case of an obstacle limited runway. It’s known as using “unbalanced V speeds”  for improved climb gradients thereby increasing the obstacle limited RTOW.

It’s a bit complicated and beyond my current level of motivation to explain in detail.

The reason, I suspect ,this particular flight used all the runway is one or both of the engines weren’t developing the required thrust. The aircraft then has reduced acceleration up to VR but performance is predicted on the aircraft  reaching a height of 35ft by the end of the runway on one engine.

The loss of engine power seems evident at takeoff, but for me the problems arose during the run of the 787 on the runway.

We know the number of passengers and crew and the empty weight of the 787-8 which is 126 tons, but we do not know how much fuel was loaded or if there were loads in the hold, and consequently we do not know what speed the V1 or VR indicated to the pilots and if the instruments indicated the correct speed.

We do not know if the Captain launched the Mayday, for the loss of engine power, when he was on the runway or after takeoff.

However, we know from the ADS-B data provided by FR24 that, in addition to taking off at the end of the runway, the 787 did so at a speed of 179 miles which is normally about 20 miles higher than the VR as in the posted video and other videos where the VR is always under 160 miles and in this situation only the FDR and the CVR can give a certain answer as to why the pilots who arrived at the VR did not rotate, continuing on the runway and then doing it at the speed of 179 miles and at the end of the runway and, "if" there was a loss of power in the engines "under the V1", why did the pilots not abort the takeoff?

Obviously, in this last case it is not an accusation against the pilots because there could have been electrical or hydraulic causes that prevented the pilots from stopping the plane with the only possibility of continuing along the runway.

Disregard

Edited June 16, 2025Jun 16 by WestAir

18 hours ago, martin-w said:

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I've not read the entire thread, but one theory I've heard is that the pilot said gear up and the co pilot operated the flap lever instead, by mistake.

thats was from captain steeve from one of  his previous video on this accident

They now have both black boxes.

must of been quite serious, I had quite a few flights go "crew down" this weekend because they didnt want to fly on 787s or flights to India.  

either that, or it was the good weather and it being the "special"  month of June... just saying.

My bet is that the aircraft suffered a massive electrical failure that resulted in both engines shutting down. It seems that the main gear is tilted in a position which suggests that the gear retraction sequence had commenced, but was stopped for some reason. Total electrical failure would presumably be one reason for that.

I just feel that the multiple electrical problems in the cabin that were highlighted on the previous flight from Delhi to Ahmedabad were an indication that the entire electrical system was ready to quit.

1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

My bet is that the aircraft suffered a massive electrical failure that resulted in both engines shutting down. It seems that the main gear is tilted in a position which suggests that the gear retraction sequence had commenced, but was stopped for some reason. Total electrical failure would presumably be one reason for that.

I just feel that the multiple electrical problems in the cabin that were highlighted on the previous flight from Delhi to Ahmedabad were an indication that the entire electrical system was ready to quit.

 

 even with the most complete electrical power failure on board, 

 the engine control should still be    unhampered.  

 

 

Edited June 16, 2025Jun 16 by aerostar

1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

My bet is that the aircraft suffered a massive electrical failure that resulted in both engines shutting down. It seems that the main gear is tilted in a position which suggests that the gear retraction sequence had commenced, but was stopped for some reason. Total electrical failure would presumably be one reason for that.

I just feel that the multiple electrical problems in the cabin that were highlighted on the previous flight from Delhi to Ahmedabad were an indication that the entire electrical system was ready to quit.

The video of a pax from the previous flight showing that the air conditioning and entertainment were not working was made on the ground at Delhi airport, but I assume it was repaired because the survivor of the crashed flight did not say anything about the non-working air conditioning on board the 787 and it should be considered that at VAAH it was +38 C° (100 F) with the plane in the sun, and it would have been very hard for the pax to stay inside the plane without air conditioning also considering that the flight was supposed to last more than 8 hours.

Unfortunately, there are those who "enjoy" being a... jackal to invent fake news in bad taste by peddling online a false official preliminary report from the Indian AAIB that identifies the main cause of the accident.

However, this false report was immediately unmasked because... the word not allowed who had made it, had made a mistake by dating this document to the... future June 25, 2025 while the Indian commission of inquiry with people from the NTSB, the AAIB, Boeing is meeting only today June 16, 2025 for the first time.