I have been using BATC for the past month and it is like most ATC programs in MSFS. It’s a love hate relationship. When it isn’t screwing up, I find it highly immersive. The problem is that it screws up a lot. P2ATC is the other ATC program i use, and it has its pros and cons as well. I am starting to think that these two programs are essentially gateway drugs to using VATSIM, which I have just never seriously considered using. BATC handled all the radios for me, but it did get me more familiar with ATC phraseology. Interestingly enough, P2ATC also handles a lot of the radio chores, but it also seems more natural to use a mic with. And yes, BATC allows you to use a mic too, but it just came more naturally with P2ATC. 

Of course, as i get more comfortable interacting with ATC I wonder how much longer it will take before i end up on VATSIM, so i wanted to ask those using it what the pros and cons are? Because it seems like the next step in my journey.

Side note: I have been using GSX Pro and while it can be quirky I really like it. I feel like i have to rush to leave on time, and Delta’s on time performance is currently crashing thanks to yours truly lol. It also helps me organize the things i need to do, and the immersion increase is really good. I should have done this sooner, but i had so much to learn and now it is all coming together. I am finally using those nice Navigraph charts I have been paying for over a year, and they just don’t look that intimidating anymore. And neither do these Boeing and Airbus planes either. This hobby really is like peeling an onion. 

Edited March 3Mar 3 by RobJC

 Vatsim will be a night and day difference and improvement. There is simply no comparison except in coverage. It all comes down to finding a route or pairing that has the coverage which for the most part isn't that difficult or rare.

I have had same thoughts recently as you. I came to the following conclusion. You are right in that you're talking now to an AI bot so you may as well talk to a real person.

1. If used to the auto-tune feature for the radio then manual radio discipline in vatsim may take some getting used to 

2. Vatsim is best when all the ATC centres are filled. When this happens the airspace will be busy. So being on your toes is necessary. The centres near me especially in organised events require strict adhesion to set procedures. Again, getting used to that. Would be fun though.

If I had less disruptions from family and kids I'd take the plunge more but happy with BATC as I can just not announce on hand off if I have to and I'll be fine until I re engage.

Edited March 3Mar 3 by Max Kraus

Hi,

I’ve only ever used VATSIM & PilotEdge. Both are extremely good services. 

I’d avoid the big events for your first outing.

On the whole, just make sure you know your routing and know your aircraft. Providing you brief yourself before the flight, nothing will surprise you. I go through the Simbrief pages and just check VOR names etc, as often controllers will shortcut you direct Barnes rather than spelling out BAF. Know how to hold. 

You mention DAL, so I’m guessing you’re US-based. In the US, they send your IFR clearance when you login which makes life a little easier. The ramp is not controlled, and you don’t need to call for push unless you’re going back onto an active taxiway. Check the most likely taxi routing from your position - again, brief.

I don’t know the quality of the ai ATC services, so I’m unsure how forgiving they are, but if you’re flying in a busy VATSIM patch and the controller is having to tell you something for the third time, don’t expect them to be happy. 

Unsure if they still do it, but there used to be a VATSIM first wings event. 

Finally, watch a YouTube of someone on the network. 

TL/DR: be prepared.

I used BATC to help fill the coverage gap that I experienced on Vatsim in less than covered places. For example I was flying a lot in the caribbean but locally I'm in GMT which meant no one was online when I was. 

I do still however use vatsim to fly with friends and during events thats interests me. Obviously BATC can't replace Vatsim but it helps fill the coverage gap for sure and if I could I would always prefer flying on Vatsim.

The other thing to note was BATC also made airports feel more alive, often times on Vatsim an airport can be borderline empty if it wasn't particularly popular which wasn't respective of real life.

For my usage, both programs completement each other to their respective weaknesses.

I love Vatsim as others have said night and day difference. I stopped flying on Vatsim about a year ago only because the ATC coverage for when I fly is very spotty in the US. So I use BATC 99% of the time again only due to lack of ATC coverage.

I used to fly solely on VATSIM and loved it.  I still would.  Now however there is always a good chance I will have to help my kids with something so can't commit to it like I used to.  

Besides Vatsim, there is also IVAO, which I prefer. Both have their plusses ans minuses.

The biggest issue with online networks is coverage and coverage time.

It's a hobby after all so the usual time from which the most controllers are online are the evening hours betwen 19 and 22 local time.

And then the general problem of coverage. Since Vatsim counts on locals to be controllers the coverage is heavily dependant on where the most people do flightsimming in the real world as well. Outside of Europe, Northern America, Australia and Southeast Asia the number of controllers is very, very limited.

And even in those areas it is very unevenly distributed. On VATSIM for example in the U.S. the coasts are relatively well covered, but the inner parts of the country not so much. In Europe, Germany, Austria, Scandinavia, Poland and the Netherlands have the best coverage, followed by the Balkans. But France, Spain, (when IVAO split itself from VATSIM decades ago, they seemed to have taken most of the romanesque countries with them as France and Spain are much better covered on IVAO) Switzerland, the UK and Ireland have very spotty coverage. The Czech Republic has one of the worst coverages in central europe followed by Belgium and Luxemburg and Italy where you sometimes have the feeling that the country doesn't exist south of Bologna.

Then there are areas globally that basically never get any coverage and if they do it's almost always just on special occasions and then it's done by controllers from other regions of the world and not locals. 

So if you really want to fly in areas with 100% coverage it will always be in the same regions at the same time of day. And that is severly limiting.

 

I hope that one day in the future one of the ATC add-ons, like BATC for example will have real, full integration with VATSIM and IVAO, where the real human controllers can actively hand you over to the AI controllers of the program and vice versa, so that you can have a full hybrid coverage experience.

Edited March 3Mar 3 by Farlis

I've been using Vatsim since 2011. "VATSIM" is my Colorado License plate number. See my profile picture. For the most part it's a very good free service.

6 hours ago, tamba765 said:

I've been using Vatsim since 2011. "VATSIM" is my Colorado License plate number. See my profile picture. For the most part it's a very good free service.

That is awesome. 

Thanks guys. I guess I need to up my ATC phraseology game but I am going that route.  

Biggest problem I have in VATSIM is when controllers give 3+ commands all stringed together.  Even writing them down quick enough to read back is hard.

 

But Im a beginner at VATSIM,  so I assume it's a skill and it will get easier over time.

 

Great feeling during and after a flight with VATSIM.    😀

1 hour ago, RobJC said:

Thanks guys. I guess I need to up my ATC phraseology game but I am going that route.  

I think going with VATSIM is probably the best way to come as close as possible to simulating ATC IRL while concurrently keeping in mind that it is not possible to simulate the ATC complexities of a KJFK or EDDF with a free service or a $50 consumer product.  ATC is the weakest part of a product like MSFS 2024 and this is not going to change.  In VATSIM, controller availability, controller disappearance (plan a route with controlled air space but by the time you get "there" the controller has signed-off) and partial air space coverage (e.g., TWR controller present, no Departure or Center controller) are the challenges.  When there is end-to-end coverage, it's great.  Despite this, if you are willing to fly in the geographic areas I have listed below during evenings and/or weekends (times local to the airspace), you will get a good understanding what ATC is like.  Per my experience, this is where I see air space controlled most frequently.  Sometimes it gets quite intense.

• Northeast U.S. (Boston FIR)
• Southeast U.S. (Jacksonville FIR)
• West Coast U.S. (Los Angeles FIR)
• Northwest Europe (especially Germany)
• U.K. (London)

I tend to avoid London / southern UK because the VATSIM controllers there have a longstanding habit of trying to control far too many aircraft at once so you can't get a word in edgeways. They open up centres covering multiple busy airports with no ground or tower coverage, resulting in 20+ pilots fighting for radio airtime. I assume it's something they do to show off to each other but it makes the whole experience so much worse.