Not for one second do I think being a Doctor is easy, because I have never tried it. I know it is hard, and like flying, it requires a love and dedication because it is a mammoth long task. Now, if you as a 10 year Airline Pilot were to tell me how easy it is, then I might listen to you and actually think about what you are saying (see Chuck's post above, you might have a hard time finding one).You pick up a sim and manipulate controls and think flying is easy, then you are correct. The actual task of physically flying is quite easy, just like taking a knife and cutting a person's stomach is actually easy. But we both know that you have to understand how to prepare the patient, sedate, plan the incision, and millions of other considerations which I have not a clue about. I don't judge the medical profession simply by the act of actually cutting someone. That would be incredibly foolish and naive.

I agree with plenty of what you have to say. I never said anything about people getting flying jobs after college. I looked into and seriously considered a career path as a pilot, I know how difficult it can be to get a job in the U.S. There are pilots out there in Europe and Asia flying 737s and A320s that had zero hours 18months ago. Is it difficult to get licenses and training that fast of course it is. At the same time that is not something which would be possible for some to practice medicine. Again flying an airliner is not easy, but I just never understood the doctor comparison that's all. Too very different jobs. And in my opinion it's a bad argument to point out the great money doctors make compared to the terrible undeserveably low pay many airline pilots get. Hopefully market conditions change one, but there haven't been many good signs lately.

The doctor analogy is silly.Pilots are skilled, hourly paid labor and would probably be classified as heavy equipment operators. I think it's technically classified as more of a "vocational" type job than a professional job since pilots are not members of any self-regulating association and to be become a pilot requires no education beyond high school (except for US military pilots, but they are officers first, which is a different story).What about the Captain of a ferry boat? His job is almost identical to that of an airline pilot, the only difference is his machine operates on water instead of up in the air.Would the Captain of a ferry boat compare himself to a doctor?Unless he was really insecure, probably not.

And of course why do they always say in the movies...."is there a doctor on board" lol

His job is almost identical to that of an airline pilot, the only difference is his machine operates on water instead of up in the air.

As both a commercial pilot and USCG licensed captain, I can tell you have never done either :-)

Well, when I was six years-old I used to call myself the "Captain" of my rubber dingy I used to play with out in the lake... My maritime career was going all great until I crashed my dingy into a rock and punctured a hole in it... I abandoned ship even faster than that Italian guy, leaving my poor sister to go down with the ship... :( .My point was the guy who drives a ferry boat and the guy who drives an airplane are both part of the transportation sector: they move people and cargo in a machine. Sure there are technical differences between the two, but it's all the same general, broad idea.P.S. "Commercial pilot" means nothing... you can get an FAA commercial license with nothing but Cessna time. Big deal. I've got one. I'm not a hero.

And of course why do they always say in the movies...."is there a doctor on board" lol

They say that in real life,too. I've heard it three times whilst flying commercial.I'm actually very interested in the similarities between pilots and doctors with regards to approaches to emergencies. CRM is something that should be taught to all medical practitioners, IMHO.

They say that in real life,too. I've heard it three times whilst flying commercial.I'm actually very interested in the similarities between pilots and doctors with regards to approaches to emergencies. CRM is something that should be taught to all medical practitioners, IMHO.

From what I understand the medical world is slowly starting to adopt some practices that have been in use in aviation for quite some time. The introduction of checklists for example has caused some quite dramatic reductions in complications in some places.

I've been flying for a living for 35+ years, both rotary and fixed wing, turbine charter, regional airline (HS748, Saab340), forest fire suppresion (CL215 & cessna 310 - there's a combo for you) and it's been a great career. In short I was extrmemly flexible in what I did and as such was fortunate enough to pay the bills, keep toys in the driveway and live a good life. Time away from home was sometimes a challenge but it's part of the deal. And, when I say time awaay from home I don't mean 5-10 nights a month but litterally months at a pop. Luckily I don't dfo that now as I'm 90% office and 10% cockpit. I can't talk about the USA market but in Canada you can make 6 figures on a Saab, Atr, HS748 etc. You need to stay with the company and work your way up the seniority list and that takes time. A big part of the deal is picking where you want to be down the road and putting a realistic goal in front of you. I've never flown a jet or the "big iron" but on the whole I'm had a hoot. Not many places in the world on a fine October day you can start off on 11,000 ft of paved runway and finish up 6 hours later, -20'C, at night landing downhill (1.14' slope) in a blizzard on 4000' of gravel after doing a non-precision, circling approach in a snowstorn 1000 miles north of where you began the trip. This is no BS. I drove the Saab on this route. This was one of the routes of this airline who by the way is prospering, even in this economic climate. It's about doing your best to pick your market and your goals. It's still a roll of the dice but most jobs are.To all you young people who are considering this line of work consider this.......there's going to be a LOT of people in my age group retiring in the next 5-10 years and as such there will be a lot of jobs out there. Now's there time to be preparing.Pardon my typo's in my above post.....typing is one skill I am still working on........Thank God for spell check at work.

Speaking of Soviet Canuckistan...Anyone still watching Ice Pilots?I heard (Audrey?) the French Canadian girl gave up after 3 years slavery on the ramp at Buffalo to become a Flight Attendant at Westjet, essentially putting an end to her flying career since there is no way she'll ever transition from FA to pilot at Westjet.Is this true?

Speaking of Soviet Canuckistan...

Haha! Wow. I don't have your answer, but I got a good laugh out of that this morning.As for the arguments in this thread, if you really want the job, you can have it. Getting the training is ever more expensive, but if you want it, go get it. If you don't want it, then spare yourself the thousands and stay out of my way.

Sure there are technical differences between the two, but it's all the same general, broad idea.P.S. "Commercial pilot" means nothing... you can get an FAA commercial license with nothing but Cessna time. Big deal. I've got one. I'm not a hero.

I worked my &@($* OFF to get my ratings while full time in college. Not only are you way off base, but you are offensive. It is a big deal. This isn't a commercial driver's license we're talking about. I spent upwards of $50,000 and 300 odd hours, while paying college tuition, to pursue my career. Next time you want to come in and make trivial such achievements, do it under your breath. To yourself. It's more surprising that you, no less, has made such flaming and miscalculated statements. That's not like you...

Edited February 3, 201214 yr by ZachLW

You think you're the only one who worked their &@($* off? C'mon.I used to think like you... I thought I was God with my with commercial license and my fancy university education years ago... then I got a reality check:I walked into Chief Pilots office -he was a big, gruff, redneck kinda guy- looking for work only discover that in his eyes, my 250 hours and Commercial License made me, at best, maybe one notch higher than pond scum.And he was right: Low time pilots are a dime-a-dozen... You have no experience....Maybe the attitude is different in your neck of the woods.Cheers,

From what I understand the medical world is slowly starting to adopt some practices that have been in use in aviation for quite some time. The introduction of checklists for example has caused some quite dramatic reductions in complications in some places.

Slowly, but yes it is happening.Aviation is about a generation ahead of medicine when it comes to dealing with incidents with adverse outcomes.Simulation obviously has a long history in aviation. It's a much newer concept in medicine but it currently gaining traction. Humans are much more complex to simulate than planes, and the simulators used in medicine are much, much cheaper/simpler than a level D sim. But some of the same concepts apply. For example, a checklist is a useful means for student doctors to learn a new procedure as they perform it on a simulated patient.

I worked my &@($* OFF to get my ratings while full time in college. Not only are you way off base, but you are offensive. It is a big deal. This isn't a commercial driver's license we're talking about. I spent upwards of $50,000 and 300 odd hours, while paying college tuition, to pursue my career. Next time you want to come in and make trivial such achievements, do it under your breath. To yourself. It's more surprising that you, no less, has made such flaming and miscalculated statements. That's not like you...

Zach, I agree with you on a lot, but don't take things so offensively, really. I understand you spent a lot of money. So did we all. I just managed to escape going to a large aviation university, so I avoided that cost.To be honest, Congress shot us all in the foot when they passed the bill requiring an ATP (a test originally meant to test fitness for captaincy) to sit right seat, part 121. So, essentially, Congress did make it worthless.What does my COMM get me? The potential to be a CFI, a banner tower, or a crop duster. Not much else. Even if it did, the min hours requirements are pretty high now, so again. I'd support the idea that it's relatively worthless.Are you a better pilot than a PPL, in general? Probably.Your IR guy without COMM? Probably.As I always say:Offense is what you make of it. It's a conscious decision. Get upset or let it go. Let it go man. The world isn't out to get you, especially with words. Words only have the meaning you give them.(The above isn't meant to be condescending)

I'm not the only one that worked hard. Nor did I imply that! Don't put words in my mouth. --EDITED, nevermind I said something stupid--. In fact, you are the one who implied such achievements are "no big deal". In the grand scheme of things, they may not be. But did it occur to you that these achievements were in fact a little more than what people like you suggest they are. (trust me, we have guys like you around the FBO...) Let me be a little more clear. Since I'm but a redneck, my sister and I are the first in my family to graduate college. That is an achievement in itself. I've beaten the odds so far. Now lets get to the rest of your negative BS. You don't think I realize there's competition? I was born at night, but not last night! But I am competitive!The point: I was more responding to the ridiculous statements brushing off college and ratings as small feats, "no big deal". Get a grip and stop being so demeaning. A PPL is a big deal to a 60 year old. A commercial is a big deal to a 20 year old. A new airline gig is a big deal to a 23 year old. Why would you want to trivialize anyone of those things? Because you have more time?

Thanks Kyle. Just some heated discussion! After Bryan gets that NGX FS2Crew out, I'll have forgotten it all.And if you get in by August 2013, you need not hold an ATP. Speaking of ATP, they have a decent explanation that eventually says "train with us to get it". http://www.atpflight...-explained.html

Edited February 3, 201214 yr by ZachLW