No no and no lol - oh well never had much luck with any of these programs

 

Haha, it is all luck. That's been my experience also. "Long ago", I spent a few days trying to get get RC4 to work with P3d (which it finally did, after a few tips from Pete Dowson), but the quirks were just too cumbersome. I do miss how the app is sternly paternal about not maintaining a decent climb rate, etc, though.

 

I gave up  on ATC addons for a while and then bought Pro ATC, which also almost works as advertised. When combined with AI Controller, it seems to give the best overall realism. But mostly I just put up with the simplistic built-in ATC and try to avoid hub airports. It's good enough for VFR and most GA IFR flying.

Can someone tell me if the interface has been remodeled from the original PFE which  was re-coded for use in FSX   I never liked the PFE version because of it's interface and having to convert flightplans for use within the program and the many times I was left parked at the holding point, awaiting clearance for takeoff because the program had stopped. I'm aware that a demo version is available for the newer release, but am reluctant to try it. I would prefer to hear from a user the pros and cons of the new version over the old and if it's worth purchasing.

 

 

But mostly I just put up with the simplistic built-in ATC and try to avoid hub airports. It's good enough for VFR and most GA IFR flying.

 

I keep coming back to default ATC after my add-on adventures because, all things considered, it seems to be the least bad of the lot - not exactly a ringing endorsement but you know what I mean.  Good voices and the weirdness is fairly predictable.  Now if only it could accept aircraft profiles and not expect me to do slam-dunk descents in propliners...  which, of course, is one among several reasons that I keep experimenting and hoping for something better... and so the cycle goes...

Haha, it is all luck. That's been my experience also. "Long ago", I spent a few days trying to get get RC4 to work with P3d (which it finally did, after a few tips from Pete Dowson), but the quirks were just too cumbersome. I do miss how the app is sternly paternal about not maintaining a decent climb rate, etc, though.

 

I gave up  on ATC addons for a while and then bought Pro ATC, which also almost works as advertised. When combined with AI Controller, it seems to give the best overall realism. But mostly I just put up with the simplistic built-in ATC and try to avoid hub airports. It's good enough for VFR and most GA IFR flying.

 

Good info Jay - thanks

I keep coming back to default ATC after my add-on adventures because, all things considered, it seems to be the least bad of the lot - not exactly a ringing endorsement but you know what I mean.  Good voices and the weirdness is fairly predictable.  Now if only it could accept aircraft profiles and not expect me to do slam-dunk descents in propliners...  which, of course, is one among several reasons that I keep experimenting and hoping for something better... and so the cycle goes...

 

1+

Guys

Do try out the demo if you haven't already. I did and have purchased

already.I think it's the best ATC program out there at present.It uses flight plans made with the default sim.No more fiddly compiling.Very quick and intuitive and has a great warp function added.

Jay

Can someone tell me if the interface has been remodeled from the original PFE which  was re-coded for use in FSX   I never liked the PFE version because of it's interface and having to convert flightplans for use within the program and the many times I was left parked at the holding point, awaiting clearance for takeoff because the program had stopped. I'm aware that a demo version is available for the newer release, but am reluctant to try it. I would prefer to hear from a user the pros and cons of the new version over the old and if it's worth purchasing.

  

I keep coming back to default ATC after my add-on adventures because, all things considered, it seems to be the least bad of the lot - not exactly a ringing endorsement but you know what I mean.  Good voices and the weirdness is fairly predictable.  Now if only it could accept aircraft profiles and not expect me to do slam-dunk descents in propliners...  which, of course, is one among several reasons that I keep experimenting and hoping for something better... and so the cycle goes...

  

Good info Jay - thanks

 

1+

Guys

Do try out the demo if you haven't already. I did and have purchased

already.I think it's the best ATC program out there at present.It uses flight plans made with the default sim.No more fiddly compiling.Very quick and intuitive and has a great warp function added.

Jay

    

 

Mind posting a quick process of what your talking about here - sparked my interest 

You're right... ProATC/X is better about this - but you have to look over at the moving map to get it... which is kinda cheating :-)

 

Why do you look at the moving map? The info is in the flight info screen in sim. Also have the expected approach info available right from the start of the flight, so you can plan for it, in your pre flight. (On the same option screen.) ATC gives you the audible final approach instructions prior to the start of the STAR, which should be plenty of time.  As I said, you can get it sooner if you like on the flight info option. No need to go to the moving map.

To me, the #1 weakness of all ATC programs currently available is that they don't inform you of the runway to expect early enough and if the runway changes, they don't provide a "Plan B". Granted, all simulated ATC is subject to the whims of the FSX/P3D AI, which can be a challenge - but it shouldn't be insurmountable.

With PF3 you have some ways to circumvent this:

1. Before the flight, mark all runways except those you want to land on as closed or take-off only (SIDs/STARs page)

2. You can request a different runway via Ctrl-Shift-W.

3. While in contact with Approach, use the hotkey 1 to request cleared to final at pilot's discretion.

4. While in contact with Tower, use the hotkey 9 to report a missed approach.

Exactly correct... and this not the fault of the ATC programs.  They are at the mercy of the sim in this regard.  Until LM or Dovetail open up the AI logic (or <gasp> fix it themselves); it is what it is.  That doesn't get the ATC programs off the hook though... what if the wind was 15 kts?  In that case a runway change is justified and ATC needs to compensate by vectoring you in such a way as to allow for a successful approach.  Pointing you at the airport and telling you to have a good day is not the way it's done in real life  :smile: .

 

Except for issue that PF3 doesn't seem to care whether you're at 3000, 5000, or 10,000 when you arrive at that 7 nm point.  Issuing a descent clearance to the FAF altitude and having the logic to make sure there's enough distance for the aircraft to make it down there are two different things.  That's where PF3 needs to be more intelligent.

Then set your FAF altitude in the relevant SID STAR page for the airport. Create one if none already exists.

Why do you look at the moving map? The info is in the flight info screen in sim. Also have the expected approach info available right from the start of the flight. (On the same option screen.) ATC gives you the audible final approach instructions prior to the start of the STAR, which should be plenty of time.  As I said, you can get it sooner if you like on the flight info option. No need to go to the moving map.

 

I run ProATC/X (actually all my ATC programs) on a remote client.  It's easier for me to peek over at the  other computer where all that information is displayed full time on the left side of the ProATC moving map (it's also great for finding my assigned parking spot :smile: ).

 

ProATC still has issues with STAR/Approach implementation (the audible STAR assignment is issued too late, switches you to approach way too far out, no decend via, sometimes issues altitude restrictions after clearing for the approach, etc.) but it's slowly heading in the right direction (no pun intended :smile: )  Now if only we could teach it how to vector....

Can someone tell me if the interface has been remodeled from the original PFE which  was re-coded for use in FSX   I never liked the PFE version because of it's interface and having to convert flightplans for use within the program and the many times I was left parked at the holding point, awaiting clearance for takeoff because the program had stopped. I'm aware that a demo version is available for the newer release, but am reluctant to try it. I would prefer to hear from a user the pros and cons of the new version over the old and if it's worth purchasing.

The demo version is free so that's no skin of your nose if you don't like it. Also the user guide is free and I think page 126 onwards there's a mini tutorial for setting up an IFR fpl.

 

 

Except for issue that PF3 doesn't seem to care whether you're at 3000, 5000, or 10,000 when you arrive at that 7 nm point. Issuing a descent clearance to the FAF altitude and having the logic to make sure there's enough distance for the aircraft to make it down there are two different things. That's where PF3 needs to be more intelligent.

 

I completely agree. I had now six flights, not a single one successful at the point when I should start the ILS. I was either too high, to close, or ATC just stopped telling me what to do.

 

I was pretty enthusiastic towards PF3, as I loved PFE, but the handling of the landing phase is much, much worse than in Radar Conctact. In fact, it's a major step backwards from PFE as well.

 

:-(

I tried creating a flight plan right in P3D and loaded it into PF3 and nothing keeps saying resume on navigation - took forever to get clearance to take off something is definitely wrong here

 

 

With PF3 you have some ways to circumvent this:
1. Before the flight, mark all runways except those you want to land on as closed or take-off only (SIDs/STARs page)
2. You can request a different runway via Ctrl-Shift-W.
3. While in contact with Approach, use the hotkey 1 to request cleared to final at pilot's discretion.
4. While in contact with Tower, use the hotkey 9 to report a missed approach.

 

I know you're trying to help... so please don't take this wrong... but I'm aware of the workarounds.  I've been using workarounds with these ATC programs for years.  Workarounds are always going to introduce some negative aspect to immersion.  One day, we'll get an ATC program that can do the job without workarounds; but that day has yet to arrive.

I know you're trying to help... so please don't take this wrong... but I'm aware of the workarounds.  I've been using workarounds with these ATC programs for years.  Workarounds are always going to introduce some negative aspect to immersion.  One day, we'll get an ATC program that can do the job without workarounds; but that day has yet to arrive.

Ok, valid point. Until then I'm happy enough with what we have now. For me it is PF3, for others it might be something else.