27 minutes ago, penta_a said:

note: I don't think military people care much how the sim looks, rather they are looking for functionality, and P3D is (proven) good to some extent in this area, hence their costumers in this market are guaranteed.

This is not the case, all my direct interactions with LM developers proof otherwise. Just look at HF2 list of improvements.. most of them are related to fix / improve the system capacity and looks. alpha channel corrections, SSAA fixes, the list goes on!

S.

15 hours ago, sanh said:

No. The Microsoft guy in the Q and A said no subscription and no micro payments. They were keen to stress this is being made for the hardcore simmers. A new far more detailed flight model they talked about is a good indication of that.

 

Edit (Now I've watched the video!):

Definitely looking forward to flying it, BUT well set up P3D will continue to provide a good experience (just cos there's a new, pretty sim on the block, it doesn't mean that P3D will sudden change for the worse).

I'm still investing in selected P3D add-ons, because it's not 2020 yet. If MSFS has good VR support, I'd imagine that it would become my primary sim, but i'd still be giving a solid amount of attention to P3D with all of it's wonderful addon aircraft. 

EDIT: Having watched the first 20 minutes of the Froogle video now, it certainly looks great. However, there's an Ars Technica report that VR will not be supported on release. So even though this looks absolutely stunning, it won't be my main sim until that feature is added.

I'll also add that I haven't heard anything definitive yet about it NOT being subscription only (officially - pricing not announced). My understanding from MS comments elsewhere was that outright purchase was an option, but I'll consider this to be an unknown factor until such time as I hear a definitive answer straight from MS.

As for the video that this post is based on, and what it means for P3D:

- The change from landclass scenery is dramatic. If P3D sticks with landclass, I think its market will shrink substantially.

- It's hard to see a market for TrueEarth-type scenery. The MSFS default looks as good as this. So I think add-on scenery sales will crash. Who is now going to pay $40 for a tiny area of the earth to be modelled?

- The lighting, sky, environment, water and atmospheric simulation leave P3D v4.x far behind, even with the hundreds of dollars of addons that many of us use.

- the addon planes Froogle saw - TBM, Cessna, Robin - are a pretty solid GA collection. I can imagine flying P3D or X-plane still for greater aircraft variety, though the default MSFS planes look and seem to fly far better than the defaults in P3D.  

- Rainbows! 600km cloud view distance? C'mon, LM - if you can build an F-35, surely you can bring us this!

TL;DR

P3D will continue to exist as a training platform. Its use by casual simmers will decrease markedly after MSFS is released. It will still get some use from those who want to fly a specific plane (Ray and his Concorde! Me and my NGX!). It will still get some VR use, though X-plane is a little better there at the moment.

What we don't know: What LM will do with v5. Honestly, having been through the V1 to v4.5 trip, it's been a SLOW journey. Let's see what the P3D team can do with the next release. I hope for great things! 🙂

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by OzWhitey

53 minutes ago, simbol said:

This is not the case, all my direct interactions with LM developers proof otherwise. Just look at HF2 list of improvements.. most of them are related to fix / improve the system capacity and looks. alpha channel corrections, SSAA fixes, the list goes on!

S.

The "military don't care about visuals" is repeated so many times in these parts, I've never seen any evidence to support this.

Having been a P3D flier since the early (dev subscription model) v1 days, I've seen LM slowly but steadily add the visual goodies that we all like to see. 

I also think the commercial customers are a pretty diverse group, not one monolithic block who all want the same thing.

For all of you guys who have decided to stop purchasing any more addons for P3D and XPlane......just remember that addon developers need to eat like the rest of us.

1 hour ago, OzWhitey said:

The "military don't care about visuals" is repeated so many times in these parts, I've never seen any evidence to support this.

Having been a P3D flier since the early (dev subscription model) v1 days, I've seen LM slowly but steadily add the visual goodies that we all like to see. 

I also think the commercial customers are a pretty diverse group, not one monolithic block who all want the same thing.

Everybody likes a good looking sim, and military customers are just as impressed by good visuals as anybody else. The "real" professional simulator solutions are often built like DCS, small regions that are hand-crafted to the best possible visuals.

Will a professional customer choose visuals over functionality though? Definitely not. If you need a platform where you can perform group training, all single instance applications fall short, no matter how good they look. If you need a platform that integrates into a DIS environment, all end-user sims fall short. If you need something that can simulate actions beyond flying an airplane (quote "from underwater to suborbital space"), then a pure flight simulator won't cut it. And most importantly, in professional training you need control, there can't be random events happening in the application. Whatever happens may look random to the trainees, but it is not for the instructor. That makes SimDirector and SimOperator so important - and at the same time negates the need for things like real world weather, AI airliner traffic or automated ATC - because those are unpredictable.

So in the future, P3D will probably leave the end user market and continue to live in the segment that it was designed for. Professional training, commercial application and special needs (like home cockpits etc.).

Funny enough, since the new MSFS is being built on FSX, all add-on developers who recently decided to go "P3D V4 only" are facing quite the challenge now. P3D V4 assets are not compatible with FSX, so they have to take two steps back to FSX compatibility, and then try to re-implement their advanced functionality once again for MSFS. 

Best regards

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by Lorby_SI

6 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

For all of you guys who have decided to stop purchasing any more addons for P3D and XPlane......just remember that addon developers need to eat like the rest of us.

So that means I’m obligated to spend my money even if I don’t want to?

7 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

For all of you guys who have decided to stop purchasing any more addons for P3D and XPlane......just remember that addon developers need to eat like the rest of us.

I actually increased my addon purchases after the MSFS. Partially because life is short, and this sim is not here yet. And partially because I believe in supporting the folk who provide the addons that provide so much enhancement to our sims.

if you understand politics, you understand lobbying, and you understand how debt works youll understand that LM have nothing to fear.  

4 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

It looks great but my decision about MFS20 is driven by FS Labs and which platform they will use for Concorde.

#metoo can't wait to have the new Concorde in P3D v4

P3Dv4 has a great future after I found out today that MSFS will not have seasonal scenery summer texture only. P3Dv4 will be the only sim with full support for season`s. 

8 minutes ago, rjfry said:

P3Dv4 has a great future after I found out today that MSFS will not have seasonal scenery summer texture only. P3Dv4 will be the only sim with full support for season`s. 

I have seen seasons in FSX-SE too 😉

3 minutes ago, Vindeballe said:

I have seen seasons in FSX-SE too 😉

Only 32bit you could never fly with the scenery I have and settings with OOMs, the more I read about MSFS more I get the impression it`s another VFR GA flyer like XP, no I will be moving to P3Dv5 when it comes out now I know.

1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

For all of you guys who have decided to stop purchasing any more addons for P3D and XPlane......just remember that addon developers need to eat like the rest of us.

why buy a $200 PMDG plane in 2020 for P3D if FS2020 is launching same year?  i'll buy the $200 PMDG FS2020 plane around the year 2025👍😅

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by Arthur42417

31 minutes ago, rjfry said:

P3Dv4 has a great future after I found out today that MSFS will not have seasonal scenery summer texture only. P3Dv4 will be the only sim with full support for season`s. 

MS2020 will only have one season, summer? Where was this stated by a team member?

….   Deleted

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by sillyflyer
surpasses knowledge or intelligence level