I think PMDG should probably just ditch the marketplace, they have a website and their own online store for a reason.

In any case, expect their MSFS products to be more confined to the simulator's constraints, as MS/Asobo won't let people sell stuff on the marketplace that has "external systems" and a FM that doesn't rely on the default MSFS FM. Hence the reason why the FBW A32NX was pulled from the MSFS marketplace a while back.

Personally I'm not too bothered with the state of the 777 cockpit, however I do think that their LNAV update is long overdue, especially if you're paying upwards of multiple triple digits. I have some confidence that they will fulfill that promise, but I'm not putting my full trust.

Edited December 14, 20214 yr by arwasairl

3 hours ago, arwasairl said:

I think PMDG should probably just ditch the marketplace, they have a website and their own online store for a reason.

In any case, expect their MSFS products to be more confined to the simulator's constraints, as MS/Asobo won't let people sell stuff on the marketplace that has "external systems" and a FM that doesn't rely on the default MSFS FM. Hence the reason why the FBW A32NX was pulled from the MSFS marketplace a while back.

Personally I'm not too bothered with the state of the 777 cockpit, however I do think that their LNAV update is long overdue, especially if you're paying upwards of multiple triple digits. I have some confidence that they will fulfill that promise, but I'm not putting my full trust.

Piracy is the biggest issue.. we are only fully protected via Marketplace, MSFS is so sand boxed we cannot implement any DRM unless it is via Marketplace.

Another big issue, the real sales are not coming via normal websites.. big number via marketplace.. so..

S.

10 minutes ago, simbol said:

Piracy is the biggest issue.. we are only fully protected via Marketplace, MSFS is so sand boxed we cannot implement any DRM unless it is via Marketplace.

Another big issue, the real sales are not coming via normal websites.. big number via marketplace.. so..

S.

Of course, MS need their 'cut', or nothing is going to go down.  $$ talks...

Interesting discussion. Taking advantage of PMDG's sale for P3D (ends today), I just purchased the B744 and B748. Been meaning to get into those birds for a while. Haven't flown them since FSX. I'm sure I will have to buy them again for MSFS, but figured I would take advantage of what's here now. 

I am curious how this plays out long term. I understand that for now MSFS is where the money is, and no doubt the initial excitement about the visuals and the Microsoft/Xbox name has drawn a LOT of people who wouldn’t normally be drawn to flight simulation to give it a whirl. But unless it massively expands the interest in flight simming, which lets face it, most people who aren’t avidly interested in aviation fight dull, I don’t see the core group of “hardcore” simmers expanding massively; it’s a niche market and I think two years from now that niche will be roughly the same size as it was two years ago. Are the majority going to continue to stick with a sim that is “broken” every few months and lacks complex functionality because of stunning visuals, or will they gradually migrate back to other platforms? The assumption is “give it time, it is the future,” but I am less than certain that is the case, and assumes no progress with other platforms. 

I am curious how this plays out long term. I understand that for now MSFS is where the money is, and no doubt the initial excitement about the visuals and the Microsoft/Xbox name has drawn a LOT of people who wouldn’t normally be drawn to flight simulation to give it a whirl. But unless it massively expands the interest in flight simming, which lets face it, most people who aren’t avidly interested in aviation find dull, I don’t see the core group of “hardcore” simmers expanding massively; it’s a niche market and I think two years from now that niche will be roughly the same size as it was two years ago. Are the majority going to continue to stick with a sim that is “broken” every few months and lacks complex functionality because of stunning visuals, or will they gradually migrate back to other platforms? The assumption is “give it time, it is the future,” but I am less than certain that is the case, and assumes no progress with other platforms. 

Edited December 14, 20214 yr by IUBrian

As a businessman, some of the decisions at PMDG baffle me, right now Xbox users have bad taste with PMDG as the product is pulled (not everyone will get a refund b/c some will wait for the fix).  On top of this alienating all the users who supported by P3D versions by not pushing updates.

But if the development happens on P3D first and then pushed to MSFS, won't it be easier to release those updates to users anyway (they already have the build).  I have absolutely given up on DC-6 to be ever ported to P3Dv5 with a new installer (I have to resort to registry method - they say P3D 4.4+ that Plus indicates v5 to me) but it is almost 2 year wait for this (d)amn product to get released.  I feel bad for those XP10 users who bought the DC-6 and within few weeks v11 came out and they never could get that plane in that platform.

What is worse is that LM can release v6 next year (I just hope it is v5.x naming convention) as some of these devs are just lazy to make a new installer.  If devs want to make money just make the new installer and charge it but having no path to upgrade is a disaster. 

I have all the P3D birds and the DC-6 MSFS but after learning about their decision I will probably be skipping them for their next releases and just going with other hi-def players; as they all are waiting to take the crown to be the next king.

 

PS - Don't even get me started why PMDG doesn't even do external installations in P3D like FSLabs & Leonardo.  Thank God , they are forced to do so in MSFS

 

Edited December 14, 20214 yr by Skywolf

Just a few months ago msfs seemed like the certain path forward. But now it’s looking like they are going after a simmer totally different than many of us. Mostly I feel sorry for the devs who have dumped a ton of time and resources only to be broken by yet more updates.  

2 hours ago, micstatic said:

Just a few months ago msfs seemed like the certain path forward. But now it’s looking like they are going after a simmer totally different than many of us. Mostly I feel sorry for the devs who have dumped a ton of time and resources only to be broken by yet more updates.  

At least they've announced to separate future sim updates from world updates and focus on bug fixing and stability for the next update(s). It's my hope that will also include fleshing out the SDK further. I mean, at some point Microsoft should realize releasing updates akin to breaking things and turning everything upside down isn't helping anyone, including them.

2 hours ago, Skywolf said:

But if the development happens on P3D first and then pushed to MSFS, won't it be easier to release those updates to users anyway (they already have the build).

This one baffles me too.  RSR explained more than once that PMDG was essentially working with P3D tweaks, porting that code, and confirming it works as expected in MSFS. 

Anyway, my reaction to RSR's missives is that PMDG has only one strategy right now -- get every product it can into MSFS and the marketplace (if possible), recoup it's likely considerable investment, and hopefully have the greatest stream of revenue they've ever seen as quickly possible.  If doing anything else diverts resources from that strategy, PMDG won't do it.  Even if that means alienating some longstanding customers. 

I'm not a longstanding customer, so I guess I get what I deserve for buying PMDG's P3D products in 2021 and expecting to them roll out the P3D updates that RSR talked about multiple times this year.

 

3 hours ago, micstatic said:

Just a few months ago msfs seemed like the certain path forward. But now it’s looking like they are going after a simmer totally different than many of us. Mostly I feel sorry for the devs who have dumped a ton of time and resources only to be broken by yet more updates.  

I don't feel sorry for the developers who have obviously relegated P3D updates/etc to a significantly lower priority and are chasing dollars. You make your bed and lay in it.

Great way to build customer loyalty. /s

5 minutes ago, pgde said:

I don't feel sorry for the developers who have obviously relegated P3D updates/etc to a significantly lower priority and are chasing dollars. You make your bed and lay in it.

Great way to build customer loyalty. /s

Not all developers have left p3d people behind. Heck look at @simbol  he has continued to support us. 

And @simbol is one of the few developers that has not changed priority. Bravo Simbol!

Happy Holidays to all!

Edited December 14, 20214 yr by pgde

Captain sim just released a 767 with the internal systems of a 747 and the visual cockpit of a 777 for 30 bucks: https://fselite.net/content/captain-sim-releases-764-captain-for-msfs/

This is what we used to call freeware merges in the FS9 days. Incredible how low standards has sunk. After the release of FSL Concorde for P3D I have no idea what to expect anymore. 

Yes, when producers such Aerosoft are able to release something like Simple Traffic. Bar is lower now. My quess is that if PMDG would release their product without some features the majority would even care. Regarding simmers that go more into depth - yes they would not be satisfied. But it seems that they are not satisfied even now.... so 🙂

So as I business executive - you have to set your strategy and targets (or milestones if you want)...