12 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

If all we are going to get are planes dumbed down to run on an XBox,  X-Plane 12 is exactly where I am going to go,

My thoughts exactly. I'll use MSFS for VFR, but if we continue down the route of very little happening on the more complex systems, possibly XPlane could be the answer. I'll certainly be paying more interest when it launches.

5 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

One has nothing to do with the other. The Kodiak and the DC6 are two of the best planes I have flown in years. Has nothing to do with X box, that is just garbage that poor developers spew trying to cover up for their poor , unfinished products. 

Well I don't know. But it seems to me that the pull to sell on the marketplace and XBox is too great for any developer to resist. I'm guessing the XBox dictates the future of the sim.

Edited January 23, 20224 yr by jarmstro

9 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

If all we are going to get are planes dumbed down to run on an XBox,  X-Plane 12 is exactly where I am going to go,

Aerosoft would deliver exactly the same aircraft no matter what sim it was released on, so they are definitely not dumbing it down for the Xbox on MSFS. 

1 minute ago, eaim1973 said:

Aerosoft would deliver exactly the same aircraft no matter what sim it was released on, so they are definitely not dumbing it down for the Xbox on MSFS. 

Agreed. It was just a 'lazy' release. They couldn't be bothered and knew that a bunch would just purchase it because it is the Twotter.

They can release two different versions, but won't.

And the winner of the 2022 “Most controversial and most widely opinionated” thread goes to “Twin Otter is Out Now”

In all seriousness, it is a matter of expectations when we purchase an aircraft based on pre-release info from a Developer. There is a wide range of known facts and not so sure info on the Twin Otter that tells us to buy it or not buy it. From my take on all this, Aerosoft is clearly driven to sales geared towards the average mid-range detailed flight simmer that sees it somewhere on the internet and says “wow that airplane looks neat, I want to fly it” - likely the vast majority of people who purchased MSFS2020.

4 minutes ago, Doering said:

And the winner of the 2022 “Most controversial and most widely opinionated” thread goes to “Twin Otter is Out Now”

In all seriousness, it is a matter of expectations when we purchase an aircraft based on pre-release info from a Developer. There is a wide range of known facts and not so sure info on the Twin Otter that tells us to buy it or not buy it. From my take on all this, Aerosoft is clearly driven to sales geared towards the average mid-range detailed flight simmer that sees it somewhere on the internet and says “wow that airplane looks neat, I want to fly it” - likely the vast majority of people who purchased MSFS2020.

You may be right. I see it as Aerosoft being a little lazy and getting a little burned for it. If it was aimed at the 'mid-range' consumer then they might charge $10 less for it and that would probably sit nicely with folks. None of us can complain about bugs, we are all grown-ups here hopefully. Nobody release software without bugs. However. the Twotter just seems a little thrown together, missing some stuff that really should have been there (or at least implemented better). Nobody expected a 'study level' aircraft either, just something that was ready for release (given a bug or two).

If vendors release sub-standard products then there is always going to be 'controversial and widely opinionated' threads. That isn't a bad thing.

 

 I also have thousands of hours flying many different types of a/c IRL. The LAST thing I want to do when I start up MSFS, P3D or XP is go through a realistic startup process. Sorry guys, I'm one of the crtl e guys - I want  to just get in a fly and enjoy the experience, The Twotter is fine for this. So, something doesn't work? I've been in real a/c where something doesn't work - that's part of piloting - deal with the issues.

For those that get their enjoyment from a study level sim and proper procedures, that's fantastic. The idea is to enjoy what you are doing. So, if a model doesn't meet your standards for "study level" - don't buy the product but please don't blame the developer.

1 minute ago, vgbaron said:

 

 I also have thousands of hours flying many different types of a/c IRL. The LAST thing I want to do when I start up MSFS, P3D or XP is go through a realistic startup process. Sorry guys, I'm one of the crtl e guys - I want  to just get in a fly and enjoy the experience, The Twotter is fine for this. So, something doesn't work? I've been in real a/c where something doesn't work - that's part of piloting - deal with the issues.

For those that get their enjoyment from a study level sim and proper procedures, that's fantastic. The idea is to enjoy what you are doing. So, if a model doesn't meet your standards for "study level" - don't buy the product but please don't blame the developer.

 

I completely agree, but animated "Trim Wheels" is not something I consider "Study Level". 

 

And Aerosoft stating that's it's not fixable in a patch, cause its due to the limitations of the Xbox. when other reputable Add-on Devs have spoken otherwise, is frustrating and unacceptable to me. 

 

Hence, I will not buy their product!

46 minutes ago, eaim1973 said:

Aerosoft would deliver exactly the same aircraft no matter what sim it was released on, so they are definitely not dumbing it down for the Xbox on MSFS. 

Hmmm...  But MK basically has said they have.  It is fairly low poly (they were aiming for good performance on the xbox), and he said there is no animation on the trim wheel because this would affect performance on the xbox as animations in MSFS are costly. 
I am not saying he is right, but that is what he said.  Either way, I suppose we are just about argued-out on this.  It is down to them to deliver the goods with the updates now. 
Hopefully a couple of updates should do it, and if not, I am prepared to buy a decent sound set for it, like the one in the earlier video from TSS - it sounds absolutely superb and is relatively inexpensive. 

The usual modders will also jump in to improve things where they can.  There is already a decent alternative flight model and better default camera view mods at flightsim.to. 
If Aerosoft don't deliver on sounds in the update (I'm not expecting much), I will purchase the TSS sound set.  This is one of my all time favourite aircraft so I just want to be able to enjoy it in the sim - simple as that.

Is TSS developing sound packs for MSFS?  Great news if so, I bought a ton of their work for previous sims.

Edited January 23, 20224 yr by regis9

55 minutes ago, Car147 said:

My thoughts exactly. I'll use MSFS for VFR, but if we continue down the route of very little happening on the more complex systems, possibly XPlane could be the answer. I'll certainly be paying more interest when it launches.

VFR is just tick mark you use on your flight plan and rules you obey unless you decide to file IFR. And yes in GA you can file in midflight! But flight plan has  nothing to with how you apply stick and rudder skills  in flight. Those must have skills in VFR or IFR. The only difference where you use as reference visual ques or instruments.

 Both X-plane and MSFS can be used for instrument or visual flying. However, none will ever get a credit in real life  for flying" study level" complex aircraft whether it is in X-plane or MSFS. As far as I concern you can file IFR VFR on TOP and do both at the same time LOL

Let me ask you a question! How many "complex/ study level" twins you ever flown in any sim? I'm pretty sure quite a lot! Now, tell me how many realistic emergency scenarios have your tried in them? How about random failures? I would assume none or not many! Most simmer including myself primary goal is to enjoy sim not torture yourself with emergency drills! It's only a psychological factor that one fly high fidelity or "study level". At the same time simulate stick and rudder which not matter how close to reality always will be approximation! So there are better approximates and not.

So while it's nice to have many system implemented. It is again very entertaining. There is nothing wrong to fly with basic but decent modeling.

22 minutes ago, Kilo60 said:

 

I completely agree, but animated "Trim Wheels" is not something I consider "Study Level". 

 

And Aerosoft stating that's it's not fixable in a patch, cause its due to the limitations of the Xbox. when other reputable Add-on Devs have spoken otherwise, is frustrating and unacceptable to me. 

 

Hence, I will not buy their product!

I agree, but also consider that. Knowing aerosoft for many years I have no illusion about their approach. However, they do tend eventually fix some stuff quietly while initially publicly denying it.

Yes I wish they fix animated trim wheel and edgy squared wheels !

29 minutes ago, vgbaron said:

 

 I also have thousands of hours flying many different types of a/c IRL. The LAST thing I want to do when I start up MSFS, P3D or XP is go through a realistic startup process. Sorry guys, I'm one of the crtl e guys - I want  to just get in a fly and enjoy the experience, The Twotter is fine for this. So, something doesn't work? I've been in real a/c where something doesn't work - that's part of piloting - deal with the issues.

For those that get their enjoyment from a study level sim and proper procedures, that's fantastic. The idea is to enjoy what you are doing. So, if a model doesn't meet your standards for "study level" - don't buy the product but please don't blame the developer.

I think some folks are getting the wrong end of why some folks are complaining. It has zero to do with whether it is study level or not. AS said it wasn't going to be, so if you thought it was and you are annoyed that is a whole different issue.

The issue is the lazy approach AS took. Sounds are awful, some texturing issues, some AP issues. It just seem thrown together. That is what folk are complaining about. Telling people to just live with it is not an option. Some folk paid for it.

3 minutes ago, RICHUK said:

I think some folks are getting the wrong end of why some folks are complaining. It has zero to do with whether it is study level or not. AS said it wasn't going to be, so if you thought it was and you are annoyed that is a whole different issue.

The issue is the lazy approach AS took. Sounds are awful, some texturing issues, some AP issues. It just seem thrown together. That is what folk are complaining about. Telling people to just live with it is not an option. Some folk paid for it.

So I'm paid for it as anyone else . From what I understand there is a patch coming  that suppose to address most of those issues. And yes it sucks they release like that, but then they don't refuse to fix most of the issue either

The plane provides enjoyment.  Nuff said.

ns