55 minutes ago, Wise87 said:

It's been a back and forth for years over Concorde between them.  

Well perhaps if they’d been a bit more open about their intentions that thread wouldn’t have ended up the same as so many others. Locked. And not because of anything I said just to be clear.

Ultimately,  SIX YEARS later we did get a 64-bit Concorde. But it was a long and stressful wait wondering if we’d ever see one.

If it's an uncharacteristic response, it must have come from an uncharacteristic place.

I can't see that the loss of their entire consumer income hasn't had a negative effect on them, regardless of other lines of business.

So perhaps your comment hit rather too close to home.

I'd just write it off to him having a bad day and not let it sour the relationship (as long as it remains an isolated incident).

The developer's response was certainly unprofessional and unwarranted IMO.  I understand that he may be having difficulties, and if so is likely stressed out, but he should have just stayed silent.

I don't support payware developers, and haven't for several years.  I got tired of their arrogance and lack of communication and support.  Some of these guys seem to think they are in the big leagues with talk of NDA's and such, or CEO's and CFO's like ORBX, which makes me laugh.

Dave

7 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

It’s in the General section so you should be able to read the topic.

https://forums.flightsimlabs.com/topic/34366-future-msfs-product’s-availability/

I read it now.  The whole thread reads exactly like an Eaglesoft thread circa 2009.

I fail to see the point of this whole forum topic.

It was a short exchange of views between the OP and one of the owners of FSLabs in which the OP stated an uninformed opinion and the other party responded by stating the OP was wrong and shutting down the topic.

Why air the laundry here? I'm baffled.

15 minutes ago, speedyTC said:

I fail to see the point of this whole forum topic.

It was a short exchange of views between the OP and one of the owners of FSLabs in which the OP stated an uninformed opinion and the other party responded by stating the OP was wrong and shutting down the topic.

Why air the laundry here? I'm baffled.

LOL come on now, we all love a little drama. So much more fun then turning on the news and watching the distress in the middle east, labor strikes and certainly a reprieve from the monster storm that blew through here last week and devastated the lives of so many around my town and just north in the mountains. Diversion I guess.

Pray for those folks. A lot of suffering up there.   

Lefteris and Andrew do have other jobs, no shortage of companies wanting to hire software engineers.  Just remember his history ... Lefteris was a key developer for PMDG until they parted ways (Airbus vs. Boeing).  Very few content providers for P3D and/or MSFS are full time, still just NOT enough money in it ... for most it's side gig/income.  Sorry to burst anyone's bubble that thinks these companies are massive corporations rolling in cash from the Billions of MSFS users ... ok, maybe 10,000 MSFS users (yes that is from Steam statistics) out of which maybe 5000 actually buy 3rd party content.

Creating a complex aircraft for a platform (MSFS) that is not really designed (at the SDK level) to support complex aircraft is a challenge.  Look how long it took PMDG to move to MSFS and FSLabs aircraft are more complex than PMDG.  Please no debates about MSFS SDK, it's not as complete as P3D SDK and never will be ... to very different audiences sharing a common activity ... and no I'm not going list everything P3D SDK can do that MSFS SDK can't do (read the SDK/PDK docs, they're available to all online).

What I found puzzling was FSLab didn't produce a P3D V6 version of the Concorde, the path to converting the P3D V5.x version of the Concorde is relatively simple  updating the 3D models ... not a drastic change in workflow, deal with SSAO and PBR changes.  Proficient 3D modelers in the EU are relatively cheap, probably looking at $3000-$4000 worth in update work ... I guess P3D V5 sales were so bad they couldn't even justify that expense?

His response to your post was fairly predictable.  But my last understanding was Lefteris was working well with Microsoft partner rep, perhaps MSFS 2024 has really tossed a wrench in their plans and they need to make some adjustments that's taking more time than expected ... or maybe they're just waiting for MSFS 2024 release and deploy to that platform?

I get your point about the wait ... we age, some of us loose interest, some of us just get to old, some of us don't make it to release date.  But 6 years to get an updated Concorde is most definitely "part time" work in addition to one's real day job that pays the bills.

Either way, I would NOT take it personally, venting is fine, even healthy, just part of being human.  

1 hour ago, CO2Neutral said:

Very few content providers for P3D and/or MSFS are full time, still just NOT enough money in it... for most it's side gig/income.

What are chances that they're basically doing it for free, as a labor of love, and any money made from sales goes to pay license fees for their tools and whatever and occasionally having to farm some work out that they can't do themselves?  When you're working full time on another job and doing this in your off hours, you may only spend 10 hours a week on it rather than the 60 you might spend doing it full time.

Only the truly insane among us will spend 16 hours a day on a project, which I did for 8 months once upon a time.  I couldn't have spent nearly that much time if I'd been working full time as well... 10 hours on a day job and a couple hours on the project.  I did that most of my career.

Hook

@Ray Proudfoot,

that reaction from Lefteris was certainly not fair, specially given the respect and loyalty you have always been showing for FSLabs work and achievements.

I am sure your comment was not derogative, but probably he interpreted it as an unnecessary intromission on their "business model".

If there's something I would love to see happening it would be the announcement of their first Airbus for MSFS. Even better if it was a 321 NEO... a Concorde... anything, because although I never purchased the Concorde, following posts from you and other users surely gives me the confidence that, at least it's 32 bit version is still  2nd to no other Concorde model for a desktop flight simulation.

Same applies to their Airbus fleet. Just yesterday, talking to a portuguese airline pilot, now on the 321 NEO too, and a simmer who uses FSLabs Airbus at home, he was saying how much better it is compared to all of the alternatives, including those for XP and MSFS.

In the end I just hope you can find a way around that episode, and continue to be the important contributor / supporter of FSLabs products and their users at the P3D forums !

 

Edited October 3, 20241 yr by jcomm

8 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

I'd just write it off to him having a bad day and not let it sour the relationship (as long as it remains an isolated incident).

If it was an isolated incident I would. Sadly it’s not the first time he’s had a go at me. He rarely posts replies to others. This is the second time in the last few months and I have been threatened with my posts being moderated if I continued. I hope people know me well enough to know I’m not the type to stoke flames. All I want was answers to when bugs would be fixed.

7 hours ago, dave2013 said:

The developer's response was certainly unprofessional and unwarranted IMO.  I understand that he may be having difficulties, and if so is likely stressed out, but he should have just stayed silent.

That would have been the better option by far.

4 hours ago, CO2Neutral said:

Lefteris and Andrew do have other jobs,

Maybe the situation now is different to two years ago.

4 hours ago, CO2Neutral said:

What I found puzzling was FSLab didn't produce a P3D V6 version of the Concorde,

It was originally planned for v4. That slipped to v5 and they then announced it wouldn’t be v4 compatible. As for v6 I guess they decided the work involved wasn’t justified given support generally for v6 amongst developers has been low or non-existent.

 

4 hours ago, CO2Neutral said:

Either way, I would NOT take it personally, venting is fine, even healthy, just part of being human.  

If he directed his ire at others I wouldn’t. But I appear to be the sole target. Hence why I became so annoyed and years of promoting their Concorde which remains the best by far seems to count for nothing.

1 hour ago, jcomm said:

that reaction from Lefteris was certainly not fair, specially given the respect and loyalty you have always been showing for FSLabs work and achievements.

My thoughts exactly. I’ve lost count of the times I’ve promoted their Concorde.

2 hours ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

My thoughts exactly. I’ve lost count of the times I’ve promoted their Concorde.

I recall when I was thinking about getting p3d it was the first aircraft you mentioned. Word of mouth isn't perpetual it needs encouragement and boy have you been starved of that from FSL. 

Dog that bites the hand that feeds it, comes to mind...