35 minutes ago, efis007 said:

We've been content to fly with disgusting, dark panels for 7 years!
7 years
Enough now, we're tired, we've waited too long.

Laminar fixed it like 2 years ago.

You just needed to care about flight sim enough to spend a few hundred dollars on a VR headset.

XP12.2 should fix it for everyone else. At least as far as is technically possible on your dark monitors in a brightly lit room.

Edited March 13, 20251 yr by mSparks

I just knew nature would find a way...to not paragraph-ize...

55 minutes ago, GoranM said:

Then I guess your remark about X-Plane "pretending" to be a flight simulator is moot. 

Do you know of an FAA-approved flight simulator with dark, unreadable panels?
As long as that stupid bug persists, XP will make a mockery of its reputation as a "flight simulator".
Maybe for you a flight simulator is something inherent only to dynamics.
For me it is something else.
For me a flight simulator starts with the airplane.
The airplane understood as avionics instrumentation, because it is thanks to that object called cockpit that I am able to carry out a simulated flight and fly the plane.
So the equation is very simple: dark and barely visible avionics? = buggy flight simulator to be fixed immediately with absolute priority!
This is what should have been done all these years.
In 7 years nothing has been done, not even a miserable attempt at fixing.
I seriously want to hope that in 12.2 it has been done. 🙏
I don't care about the clouds!
I don't care about Hollywood effects!
I want to see the panels of all the planes I've bought.
I didn't buy those planes to look at the lavatory or the flies squashed on the windshield.
I didn't spend money to see all my cockpits reduced to the color of tar, all in black shadow, all without light. 
For 7 years I had to put up with this mess.
And this is supposed to be a simulator?
Simulator of what?
Of airplanes,... or of darkness and glare?!? 

@efis007 have you paid for a professional X-Plane license and are using it on specific hardware related to the FAA certification? If no to either of those then please get a grip because you're using a consumer based flight simulator which is sold as an entertainment product. Temper your expectations - you're going to get "consumer friendly" updates because it is a consumer product.

On 3/11/2025 at 6:14 PM, Franz007 said:

I have no issue with reading the instruments. It was only a problem during the early beta at the start of XP12 that got fixed pretty quickly.

False, I could prove you wrong at any time. ✋
The whole world knows that if you display half the panel and half the sky, the "pupil of the crazy eye" function of XP12 makes the cockpits appear black.
You can continue to deny Franz.
After all, always denying is the mission of a true "fan".
In the poor Trolls, however, we will continue to tell the truth and provide evidence upon evidence. 

 

On 3/11/2025 at 6:14 PM, Franz007 said:

What this has to do with the simulation of a flight is a mystery to me…

Hey man, are you asking me? 
Ask Laminar!
It was Laminar who introduced all the special effects that you like so much, including the new shaky camera (luckily deactivable!) that... obviously... complicates avionics piloting... but someone will say that it is "realistic".
By now I think I understand what you xplanists like.
You basically like all those useless things that go AGAINST the best conduct of the plane intended as operational practicality, facilitation of on-board actions, ergonomics in the use of the cockpit.
In short, between the choice of (1) seeing the cockpit well and giving up solar glare, (2) not seeing the cockpit well and keeping the glare effect, 90% of xplanists would choose "I want to keep the special effect!.... I don't care if I see the cockpit badly".
And this is a choice that is exactly the opposite of what a serious and certified flight simulator should do.
In all the professional simulators where I have been invited (Rome Fiumincino - MD80, B737, A320) glare has never been simulated.
No one has ever shot an anti-aircraft light in my face to prevent me from seeing the cockpit in front of me.
So what "realism" is Xplane imitating?
Is it playing Hollywood... or does it want to be an airplane simulator?
And again... why did they do the bloom effect in the previous releases?
Another senseless imitation of Hollywood?
Bloom does not exist in nature, it is a special effect from video games or cameras: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloom_(shader_effect)
The bloom effect is excellent in simulators with "dull" graphics and not very rich in light, like FS9.
In Xp12, however, it is an effect to avoid like the plague!
In fact, as soon as that effect was introduced, the graphics became all pale and foggy, oversaturated with whitish light, the skies became blinding, the colors lost tone, in short Xp12 became a disaster (in fact, many users had to bypass that horror through some Lua scripts, including me).
And this was yet another failure of the "special effects" festival that has been ruining Xp12 for 2 years.
Who knows, maybe in v12.2 there is someone smart enough to put everything back in place.

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

Do you know of an FAA-approved flight simulator with dark, unreadable panels?

No.  I know of level D flight simulators with actual hardware being used for all panels and controls.  The fact X-Plane can replicate, with a high degree of accuracy, a simulator, with panels and controls, on a screen, that can be used under FAA regulations, tells me quite a lot about the flight simulator, and the people creating it.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

As long as that stupid bug persists, XP will make a mockery of its reputation as a "flight simulator".

A lighting bug, as determined by you, whose qualifications are unknown, that is designed to replicate the human eye when looking out of a window, which will result in anything within the cockpit to look darker.  When shifting the view down, everything becomes crystal clear.

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

Maybe for you a flight simulator is something inherent only to dynamics.

If you've seen my add ons, you would know that to be untrue.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

For me it is something else.

For you, the legitimacy of a flight simulator is determined ONLY on the lighting of the cockpit panels.  At least, that's what you're showing everyone.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

So the equation is very simple: dark and barely visible avionics? = buggy flight simulator to be fixed immediately with absolute priority!

You are, quite literally, the only one making this big of a deal over this problem.  In any case, I certainly hope you've sent in 1 or more bug reports to Laminar, with data to back it up, so they can look into fixing it.  Otherwise, it's just your opinion.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

In 7 years nothing has been done, not even a miserable attempt at fixing.

This comment is way out of line.  "Maya" has worked very hard at getting the lighting fixed in the entire sim.  What he originally came up with was even being used in MSFS 2020.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

I don't care about the clouds!

Other people do.  It's not all about what YOU want.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

I don't care about Hollywood effects!

Other people do.  It's not all about what YOU want. 

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

I want to see the panels of all the planes I've bought.

Maybe turn up the brightness of your monitor.

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

I didn't buy those planes to look at the lavatory or the flies squashed on the windshield.

Other people do.  It's not all about what YOU want.

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

I didn't spend money to see all my cockpits reduced to the color of tar, all in black shadow, all without light. 

It's looking more and more like the problem is with your monitor.  Color of tar?  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

For 7 years I had to put up with this mess.

You didn't HAVE to.  If I didn't like X-Plane, I'd look at other choices.  

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

And this is supposed to be a simulator?

Yes.  And it is.  Our CL650 is being used at selected FBO's for flight practise.  We also just closed a rather large contract late last year, with a highly reputable company.  But you can have your opinion if you want.

1 hour ago, efis007 said:

Simulator of what?

Flight.  Aircraft.  Systems.  Out of all the flight simulators that have come and gone, X-Plane and MSFS are the 2 that stand out.  One is made by a group of game developers (That's what Asobo specialized in) who are backed by a $2 trillion company.  The other is made by a group of about 20-30 artists and programmers, independent of any company, and is certified, with the right hardware, to be used under FAA regulations to count towards hours flown.  You can disagree all you want to.  The facts don't care.

 

EDIT:

I decided to take a quick look, to see if I can replicate what you're seeing.  I'm starting to suspect some tampering in your image on Page 2 of this thread.  Because this is what I see when looking out of the front window of the default C172.

 

Edited March 13, 20251 yr by GoranM

26 minutes ago, GoranM said:

You are, quite literally, the only one making this big of a deal over this problem.  In any case, I certainly hope you've sent in 1 or more bug reports to Laminar, with data to back it up, so they can look into fixing it.  Otherwise, it's just your opinion.  

Goram, do you realize the nonsense you write?
Will you please stop spreading disinformation?
Adjust the brightness of the monitor????????
Do you seriously still believe this word not allowed, when instead there is the entire Laminar staff who knows perfectly well the problem of the BUG inherent in their lighting engine and they have been working on it for months to fix that bug? 🤦‍♂️
A bug that is NOT due to "my or your monitor", but is a bug entirely dependent on XP12!!!
Stop being a denier.
Stop spreading hoaxes around that have already been widely debunked for a long time.
My patience has a limit, and I have read too much of your nonsense in these 2 years.
Believe whatever you want dear Goran, even believe in a flat earth or chemtrails if it makes you feel better.
But in the meantime, Laminar will soon prove to you that you are completely WRONG when they present the solution to the problem of dark panels that I have known well for 7 years because I have been studying that problem for 7 years, and I have widely reported or documented it with irrefutable evidence.
More than monitors!!! 🤦‍♂️
Some time ago you even clashed heavily with a user who now works for Laminar, denying (as you are used to doing) all his impeccable explanations.
That user who now works for Laminar proved you wrong then exactly as I proved you wrong too, and I will continue to prove you wrong every time you insist on spreading the hoax of "eh... it's your monitor's fault... you have to calibrate the monitor".
So according to your absurd theory, what will Laminar publish with 12.2?
A correction of the lighting and fixing system of the very famous dark panels... or will they publish a TXT sheet on which the instructions for calibrating the monitors will be written? 😄
But please!!!
 

2 minutes ago, efis007 said:

but is a bug entirely dependent on XP12!!!

That only you experience.....

Or....

29 minutes ago, GoranM said:

A lighting bug, as determined by you, whose qualifications are unknown, that is designed to replicate the human eye when looking out of a window, which will result in anything within the cockpit to look darker.  When shifting the view down, everything becomes crystal clear.

Another super mega hoax!
XP12 does not mimic the behavior of the human eye in any way.
It mimics the pathetic behavior of a camera!!!
Stop spreading misinformation.
We have already discussed all these technical details months ago in pages and pages of technical discussions.

19 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Goram, do you realize the nonsense you write?

My name is Goran.  With an n at the end.

And you're one to talk about people writing nonsense.

20 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Will you please stop spreading disinformation?
Adjust the brightness of the monitor????????

Yes.  Have you calibrated your monitor?  Monitors degrade over time. 

21 minutes ago, efis007 said:

when instead there is the entire Laminar staff who knows perfectly well the problem of the BUG inherent in their lighting engine and they have been working on it for months to fix that bug?

Nowhere near to the extent you make it out to be.  As I showed in the screenshot I posted.

22 minutes ago, efis007 said:

A bug that is NOT due to "my or your monitor", but is a bug entirely dependent on XP12!!!

A bug that, apparently, only bothers you to the extent that you keep going on about it for, as you just said, months.  Has it ever occurred to you that Laminar don't come here?  So they can't respond.  Has it ever occurred to you that you come across as someone who enjoys complaining about the same thing, over and over again?  We get it.  You don't like the lighting.  Your complaints have been addressed by several of us, INCLUDING the person who works on the lighting.  And you didn't even have the common decency to acknowledge him or respond to him.

28 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Stop being a denier.

Just because I don't complain about it, doesn't mean I don't think it's there.  Maybe I can just accept the fact it's being worked on, and choose not to come to a forum to incessantly complain about the same thing, over and over.  

29 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Stop spreading hoaxes around that have already been widely debunked for a long time.

Stretching it quite a bit, aren't you?  

29 minutes ago, efis007 said:

My patience has a limit, and I have read too much of your nonsense in these 2 years.

Likewise.

30 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Believe whatever you want dear Goran, even believe in a flat earth or chemtrails if it makes you feel better.

I fail to see the link, but ok.

30 minutes ago, efis007 said:

But in the meantime, Laminar will soon prove to you that you are completely WRONG when they present the solution to the problem of dark panels that I have known well for 7 years because I have been studying that problem for 7 years, and I have widely reported or documented it with irrefutable evidence.

👍

31 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Some time ago you even clashed heavily with a user who now works for Laminar, denying (as you are used to doing) all his impeccable explanations.

You'll need to elaborate.  I'm friends with everyone at Laminar, so I have no idea who you're talking about.

31 minutes ago, efis007 said:

That user who now works for Laminar proved you wrong then exactly as I proved you wrong too, and I will continue to prove you wrong every time you insist on spreading the hoax of "eh... it's your monitor's fault... you have to calibrate the monitor".

If the lighting, or the lack of it in the cockpits, bothers you to the point of you blowing a fuse in a forum, when I refuse to take part in your complaining, the alternate solution would be, obviously, is to turn up your brightness.  Otherwise, deal with the dark cockpits as best you can.  If something doesn't work right for me, I look at alternatives and compromises.  I don't go to forums to scream about the problem.  I actually respect the work people do.

33 minutes ago, efis007 said:

So according to your absurd theory, what will Laminar publish with 12.2?

What theory is that?

34 minutes ago, efis007 said:

A correction of the lighting and fixing system of the very famous dark panels... or will they publish a TXT sheet on which the instructions for calibrating the monitors will be written? 

You don't need a txt file to calibrate your monitor.  I use industry standard hardware.  And I use it once a month.  You'd be surprised how much a monitor degrades on a monthly basis.  

 

44 minutes ago, efis007 said:

Another super mega hoax!

super mega hoax?  Would you like to throw in any more adjectives to emphasize your point?  My top post was a screenshot showing clouds.  Not lighting.  Yet you feel the need to constantly post about lighting in almost every update thread that is made here.  It get's a little boring.

I honestly think you're taking this to the point of ridiculousness, which includes making personal attacks.  If the lighting bothers you that much, shelve X-Plane, try an alternative, and check the changelogs for each update to see if the lighting is fixed.  And again, I want to reiterate.  You never acknowledged or responded to the person responsible for fixing the lighting.  One has to wonder why.

Edited March 13, 20251 yr by GoranM

7 hours ago, efis007 said:

I simply showed what is the priority bug that I expect to see fixed in 12.2 after 7 years of holy waiting.

It has been confirmed that this will be fixed. In version 12.2, they are focusing on lighting, which is the major change in this update. The exact outcome of these changes is uncertain at the moment, but it’s likely that the beta period will be lengthy, giving plenty of time to report any issues and offer feedback.

7 hours ago, efis007 said:

This (for me) is not realism ! 🤢 

I haven’t personally experienced this issue (as I mostly fly slow GA and don’t notice it to that extent), but I’m not dismissing it—it’s clearly a problem, as many others have reported. My concerns are more about things like the uniform colors of trees, the darkness of the scenery, and the lack of sunlight on the terrain. However, these have been improving over the years, and based on the screenshots, I expect 12.2.0 to bring even more improvements.

6 hours ago, efis007 said:

All the other "fans" seemed to have blindfolds on, no one noticed anything and even denied the existence of the problem. 🤦‍♂️
Something never seen in any other simulator.

I don't personally believe I'm a blindfolded "fan", but I do believe the sim needs MORE visual enhancements—better lighting and overall eye-candy, not less. That said, I agree that these improvements shouldn’t come at the cost of the overall experience and should be optional or toggle-able whenever feasibly possible.

7 hours ago, efis007 said:

Did you know that I've been happily flying FS9 since 2014?
The mere fact that among all the Xplane users I'm probably the only one who still flies FS9 is a clear indication that I'm not part of that group of users defined as "spoiled".

I’m not quite sure what you’re getting at here. If FS9 already meets your needs and you’re happy with it, why is this such a big issue for you? I’m not dismissing the dark cockpit problem, but if you’re expecting LR or even MS to downgrade the sim’s visuals to address it, you’re likely to be disappointed. If I have a piece of software that works just fine for me, I'll happily stick with it and not upgrade unless the newer version actually offers something I want.

Please just calm down and stop with the aggressive attitude towards others who don't agree with you, it's not helping your cause and it's not the way to get a message across

9 hours ago, efis007 said:

And what makes you think I'm not already doing it? 🧐
Did you know that I've been happily flying FS9 since 2014?
 

Just out of curiosity, and I know this is not the forum to ask it, why not P3D ?

Well, I would still play FS9 too from time to time, if not for other reason for the unique addons I had for it, a few of which I did port to P3D v1, v2... but then could no longer port because that would cost me a for$une 🙂

Wait !  I have my answer 🙂

But FS9 caused too many optimization problems ... Xp12 allows me to run aircraft, including rotaries, with a flight dynamics model that provides sensations and a feeling of being there that FS9 and it's 64 bit cousins can't match, not to mention some weather effects that Active Sky could make feel a bit more realistic, but never as it can be in X-Plane (well, and even MSFS ).

Then I probably benefit from not being able to use HDR, and having the reflection effects also at the minimum settings, because I don't have that awful "black cockpits" effect I see so many users complain about 🤔

Edited March 13, 20251 yr by jcomm

Im not one of thise that suffers the dark panel issue. But than i do use trakir mostly and move my head like in real world. Not everyone has that issue. A lot of developers did what they could . As pointed out many times, your trying to simulate real lighting on a limited monitor. Will always be compromises and someone will always complain. Anybody would think someone yook away there coffe the way somcarry on.

8 hours ago, GoranM said:

A lighting bug, as determined by you, whose qualifications are unknown

Come on, stop it. That's so low.