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SirStiggie

TV Station investigates in-home flight simulators

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We (you) are all potential terrorists here. Always remember that.

 

Next time I fly to the US I'd like them to hold me a couple more minutes than average on customs, or even better, they should accompany me to a separate room for further interrogation. That's how I would believe the system is working and fly knowing they're doing their job properly.

 

What's the problem? I've got nothing to hide at all. I know I'm not a terrorist, but any of you might be...

 

 

PS: Dislikes from people who don't get sarcasm in 3, 2, 1...

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I have to say I like how they said that you could learn to fly the plane on a a simulator yet also said they could see no reason why the pilot had a simulator - they answered their own question.  They also didn't mention what I've seen discussed on a few NGX threads - generally people say not even PMDG can prepare you for hand flying, which I've heard is what happened in 9/11.

 

Just my somewhat overly-defensive  instant-reaction thoughts. 

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I certainly hope that nobody believes they can fly much of anything because of FS training. That's why there is ground school and flying lessons. Two very different events.

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I certainly hope that nobody believes they can fly much of anything because of FS training. That's why there is ground school and flying lessons. Two very different events.

Very different sometimes flying the rear thing is easier haha with a real plane you can feel what the plane is doing in the controls but in the sim its completely numb. Which to me makes it harder but for someone who has never felt that feeling I would think it would catch them very off guard if they had only flown sims because as a pilot your trained to know what those feelings mean and how to react to them from the start but a simmer has never felt those and wouldn't know what they meant or how to react.

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Hmm. I fly NGX and also am nearly through my type rating on the NG. The PDMG sim is great for systems and operating the aircraft, but it was no help at all on my circuit session!! ( mind you if I had bought my yolk out to Turkey it might have been more useful...)

 

The sounds, feel and ambience is just nothing like a real aircraft.

 

 

For learning how to programme FMC and do setup and learning procedures it's a useful tool, but I was unable to get the options to downgrade the sim to match the real aircraft we have here......Using real charts and stuff also highlights the FSX problems of just being laid out with 8 year old stuff. Loads of runways have changed now..

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At the end of the day Flight Sim is a thoroughly enjoyable complex game.  Whenever anybody asks me if I could land a jet after all the years (and money)  I have spent on FSX I reply with a definite "No". I fly in GA planes in the real world as a trainee and a passenger and (to me at least) doing it for real adds a sense of mortality to the situation which is very sobering. Now if I had to save my life I'm sure I'd do my level best but I'm still not certain it would be enough. 

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The world would be a lot less scary place if journalists and people simply performed an easy mathematical equation before deciding whether something is really a risk for whatever they are being told to be scared about. Take the number of confirmed terrorists who used FSX or PMDG to train for their attacks, divide by the total number of flightsim and PMDG users. You will probably find that that the percentage you get from that equation is either 0, or 0.000000000000000000001, which is 0 for all intents and purposes. Risk association would then be nothing. But this won't sell newspapers. And we can't have that.

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I remember my first RL flight was in a 68 Piper Cherokee and after 2+ years of simming, once I got airborne it was a letdown on how easy it was compared to the sim. The only downside was the heat and noise. My instructor wouldn't allow me to land, but I still believe I could have handled it.

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I remember my first RL flight was in a 68 Piper Cherokee and after 2+ years of simming, once I got airborne it was a letdown on how easy it was compared to the sim. The only downside was the heat and noise. My instructor wouldn't allow me to land, but I still believe I could have handled it.

Well it took me about 20 attempts to flare correctly in the C172 after years of flying it in the Sim and that was on a 7,000 foot runway. I got there in the end though and was a thoroughly proud moment. 

 

Slow Learner  :rolleyes:

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I remember my first RL flight was in a 68 Piper Cherokee and after 2+ years of simming, once I got airborne it was a letdown on how easy it was compared to the sim. The only downside was the heat and noise. My instructor wouldn't allow me to land, but I still believe I could have handled it.

I think most people in that situation believe they could have handled it...

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I think most people in that situation believe they could have handled it...

Absolutely. I'm just waiting for the day when the flight attendant announces both pilots have succumbed to food poisoning, and is there anyone onboard who owns FSX or P3D. I'll stand up, reassure my frightened fellow passengers with a winning smile, and resolutely make my way forward.

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The thing that annoys me, is they keep using that video of Zaharie with his FS system in the background, to bolster their position, but never mention the video had nothing to do about flight sims.

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The thing that annoys me, is they keep using that video of Zaharie with his FS system in the background, to bolster their position, but never mention the video had nothing to do about flight sims.

 

The human mind unfortunately is easily tricked. Without the plane, we won't know exactly who took that plane to where it ended up, and as far as I know, that plane hasn't been found yet. Speculation, fun as it may be, is not proof. In the absence of proof, anyone who is swayed to be distrustful of flight simulators as a tool to aid terrorists, or of flight simmers as all lurking terrorists, on the basis of the fact that the captain (when did we give up on the principle of innocent until proven guilty?) had a flight simulator can't stake a claim towards having a reasonable position. And whichever journalist propagates this scaremongering is unworthy of his/her profession. Still, the truth very often gets in the way of what we want to achieve.

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Facts of the matter doesn't matter. Media hype like this is rarely good for the hobby. Flying has a danger element in peoples minds and airlines and aircraft manufacturers will often resort to symbolic actions to show that they take security seriously. I'd be very surprised if we will ever see another authorised sim addon from Boeing after this.

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Facts of the matter doesn't matter. Media hype like this is rarely good for the hobby. Flying has a danger element in peoples minds and airlines and aircraft manufacturers will often resort to symbolic actions to show that they take security seriously. I'd be very surprised if we will ever see another authorised sim addon from Boeing after this.

 

Better not train Airline Pilots anymore, otherwise they might learn how to fly a plane.

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Absolutely. I'm just waiting for the day when the flight attendant announces both pilots have succumbed to food poisoning, and is there anyone onboard who owns FSX or P3D. I'll stand up, reassure my frightened fellow passengers with a winning smile, and resolutely make my way forward.

 

I'm repeating myself a bit so sorry about that, but I expect many in this community would be able to land a 737, 777 and perhaps a few others on a runway with an ILS with ATC guidance, but not be able to accurately use it as a missile as some seem to think: a PMDG simmer would stand a better chance of saving a jet than crashing a jet!

 

 

 

(Obviously I mean crash in the sense of 9/11 - even an airbus can be crashed in to ground if you really want to.)

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Facts of the matter doesn't matter. Media hype like this is rarely good for the hobby. Flying has a danger element in peoples minds and airlines and aircraft manufacturers will often resort to symbolic actions to show that they take security seriously. I'd be very surprised if we will ever see another authorised sim addon from Boeing after this.

 

Indeed, but there is also much room for stupidity. As it stands, doubts are cast over the use of a flight simulator by the captain of MH370, who, as yet, has not been proven to have been the agent of disaster. But for all the hype about the dangers of flight simming as a tool for enabling terrorism, nobody in the media seems bothered by the really big elephant in the room. The guy was a trained pilot, not merely a flight simmer. Would he have been able to hijack the plane without the use of a flight simulator at home? Yes. Is a flight simulator an essential tool for hijacking a plane if you are its captain? No.

 

The fact that the media makes no effort to actually analyze the situation rationally is a damning indictment of the standard of journalism. That people are falling for this nonsense without even resorting to token critical thinking is further confirmation of what science has been showing us for the past 50 years about how people think. We are not given to rational thought, that requires effort to overcome the mental shortcuts that are hardwired into our brains. There should be an inverse Pulitzer Prize for journalists who exploit people's psychology for tv ratings.

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The fact that the media makes no effort to actually analyze the situation rationally is a damning indictment of the standard of journalism. 

 

Developing Story on CNN:

 

Boeing 777 aircraft will struggle to maintain altitude once the fuel tanks are empty.

 

 

Real CNN, not "The Onion", or CNNNN

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a PMDG simmer would stand a better chance of saving a jet than crashing a jet!

I think it's probably safer to say that a PMDG simmer would stand a better chance of saving a jet than someone who was completely uninterested in flight simming, or aviation in general. But by what degree ? How much depends on the ability to carry over the knowledge gained from a flat screen in a calm environment, to a real flight deck in an emergency ? And what state of mind would you be in, if you were suddenly thrust into such circumstances ? I daresay its a question that occurs to everyone who uses a flight simulator.

 

All I know is that having landed my Boeing 727 on the USS Nimitz, using the rear air-stairs as an arrestor hook, the ladies would find me irresistible. ;)

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Facts of the matter doesn't matter. Media hype like this is rarely good for the hobby. Flying has a danger element in peoples minds and airlines and aircraft manufacturers will often resort to symbolic actions to show that they take security seriously. I'd be very surprised if we will ever see another authorised sim addon from Boeing after this.

Yes but sims have positive influence on pilots. I used sims when I was working on my instrument rating to save money that way I had some idea of what to do when I went up with my instructor and wasnt burning $6 a gallon gas just learning the basics. My Dad used the old Fs2000 PSS 747-400 to practice before his checkrides. So sims help the public not hurt them. FS had nothing to do with the crash the media is just gripping at straws.

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Absolutely. I'm just waiting for the day when the flight attendant announces both pilots have succumbed to food poisoning, and is there anyone onboard who owns FSX or P3D. I'll stand up, reassure my frightened fellow passengers with a winning smile, and resolutely make my way forward.

And I'll be so nervous that I'll probably stand up and answer, "I speak jive." :)

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Lets see, do I have this right: guns, video games, movies and now flight simulators, how about knuckle heads who think they can protect us from everything.  I'm beginning to wonder if a sky marshal should sit up front and in the back on all flights or have a cop in every classroom and school entrance, or in every store, the list goes on.

The news media should understand a few things before they begin to write the narrative and fill those uneducated minds out there w/ crap. :wacko:  God help us

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A simmer would have a better chance of being able to program the auto land function as he would know how to use the FMC and actually know what the systems were and would be better able to follow instructions then a person with no flight experience or even a private pilot as most PP's dont even know what a FMC is. But if it came to hand flying a plane a PP would do better.

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The fact that the media makes no effort to actually analyze the situation rationally is a damning indictment of the standard of journalism. That people are falling for this nonsense without even resorting to token critical thinking is further confirmation of what science has been showing us for the past 50 years about how people think. We are not given to rational thought, that requires effort to overcome the mental shortcuts that are hardwired into our brains. There should be an inverse Pulitzer Prize for journalists who exploit people's psychology for tv ratings.

 

We are only partly rational, but extremely cognitively biased, meaning we don't seek out objective facts, but facts to back up our biases. That's why journalism, books and documentary films don't matter much. People can't be convinced to change their minds, even when evidence is staring them in the face.

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