6 minutes ago, jarmstro said:

The community seems strangely underwhelmed about World Update V? Both here and on flightsimulator.com. Odd.

Maybe because we already have plenty of community addons for mesh, airports and other stuff in this very specific regions? And maybe because the satellite imagery is already pretty decent? 

8 minutes ago, AnkH said:

Maybe because we already have plenty of community addons for mesh, airports and other stuff in this very specific regions? And maybe because the satellite imagery is already pretty decent? 

i wonder if you have flown there??? satellite imagery is far from decent there, whole parts of norway look not good.

but i think all these world updates tend to get a bit too much after some time.

Norway look like garbage right now. Super excited to see if wu will fix it. 

6 minutes ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

Norway look like garbage right now. Super excited to see if wu will fix it. 

We know the DEM and high profile landmarks / buildings will be added, but there are a lot of beautiful and unique bridges as well, so I hope they add a good amount of those.
It just doesn't have the same atmosphere to see the little islands linked by a flat piece of standard road bridge. 

I think I saw at least one in the preview video.  Tromsø, and maybe the Atlantic Road Bridge would be a good start, in nice scenic areas.

10 minutes

 

12 hours ago, fogboundturtle said:

My FDST CYVR is broken since the last update. It won't load anymore

Landing there yesterday with no issues. Check for conflicting scenery add-ons, probably in the vicinity.

7 minutes ago, Tuskin38 said:

10 minutes

 

So, no more time for a new wave of discussions about cleaning up or not the CF?. Really a shame 😂😂

2 hours ago, cobalt said:

As far as I can see, none of these examples, including the ones you cited earlier, demonstrate that the problem is caused by files stored in the Community folder. There are add-ons that involve changes to MSFS aircraft or other files and do not use Community, and it is entirely possible that updates could cause conflicts with those. But this has nothing to do with Community.

Do you consider that a change made to the simulator that rendered existing .cgl files in addon scenery installed into the Community folder incompatible with Bing data is unrelated to addon scenery installed into the Community folder?

I think that most would consider it to be directly related and the very reason why Asobo do not want anything in the Community folder after an update.

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/bing-data-causing-crashes-with-add-on-airports-or-scenery/

3 hours ago, crimplene said:

You are NOT providing evidence that files in the community folder can break the update process.

I NEVER said files in the community folder can break the update process, and I never asked to provide evidence of that. The guy claimed I should provide evidence that such files MIGHT interfere with the simulator operation NOT the update:
 

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I have followed this issue closely, in this and other forums, and have yet to see any actual evidence that an add-on placed in Community has adversely affected the working of MSFS in any way. Can you cite even one documented case where this has happened

That's the evidence I was asked to provide, which of course I have, not that there was any need for it, both because it's a known fact it can happen, but most importantly because I thought my explanation of what a "virtual override" means was more than enough to explain why IT IS possible ( and it DID happened, many times ) that after a Simulator update, it's POSSIBLE that some files in the Community folder might cause issues to something in the sim ( not the update, I never said that ).

 

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Files in the community folder do not influence which files are copied to the Official folder during the update process.

I never said that, and I haven't been asked to provide any evidence of if.

 

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Every problem occuring can be fixed by deleting the content of the community folder AFTER the update

That's exactly what I said, when I was asked about this, I replied with "That's why I said this is easily fixed and no real harm is done, because it will be enough to disable/remove the add-on, and the sim will be back using all its new files".

 

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 Files in the community folder can be incompatible with the updated version of MSFS. Nobody claimed otherwise.

That's the only thing I tried to point out, and yes, Cobalt's, which was triggered by first reply, said exactly that:
 

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Placing files in Community (or removing files from it) has no effect whatever on the basic MSFS program operations. 

He said "the basic MSFS operations", NOT just the update process, that's why I replied to it saying it's not the case.

There are a couple points to be made here, which makes this a complex issue, and I think some of y'all may be talking past each other a little bit.

First, @virtuali's technical description is 100% correct regarding the VFS, and the way in which mods can affect the game.

Second, @cobalt is also correct, more practically, that cleaning out your community folder for an update likely doesn't actually prevent any problems with the game itself.   To that effect, the rote repetition in the release announcements and the folks who echo it can sound a bit cargo-culty.

But what also needs to be taken into account is the human element.  Because what can, and often does, happen is that mods are not compatible with an update, and they cause people an issue.   Then, because troubleshooting is a skill that does not come naturally to many people, they say "the update broke my game", when in fact it's actually the mod breaking the game.

But, as they say, a lie (or innocent misconception) often makes it around the world before the truth gets its shoes on.  Just having that report both causes other people concern, and can make trouble for developers on both sides of the game/mod line as they're obligated to look at reports of breakage even when it's not clear where it came from.

For that reason, I feel like the "please clear out your community folder" reminder is a bit of preventative medicine, in that people who do that will have an opportunity to test the base game, and validate that it works, before laying their mash of mods on top and finding something broken.   Is it strictly needed?  No.   Does it save a lot of people a lot of trouble and time?  Quite possibly.

For what it's worth, I use Addons Linker to disable all my mods the first time I launch a new update and sanity check everything.  Then I gradually layer my add-ons on top so I can tell what step of the process broke something.  I think it's a practice people could do well to follow, but everyone has their own level of patience and tolerance for problems.

Edited June 17, 20214 yr by kaosfere

53 minutes ago, kaosfere said:

For that reason, I feel like the "please clear out your community folder" reminder is a bit of preventative medicine, in that people who do that will have an opportunity to test the base game, and validate that it works, before laying their mash of mods on top and finding something broken.   Is it strictly needed?  No.   Does it save a lot of people a lot of trouble and time?  Quite possibly.

I agree that this is a "safe" way to go, but caution that this is in turn misrepresented on this forum..

What I read on the forum, is : "Rename the community folder before the update, run the update, delete the new community folder, and rename the community folder back".  Then start the sim.

Unfortunately, that is not the correct sequence  😉

As you stated above, you can run the update, then before running the sim, empty out the community folder as a precaution!

Edited June 17, 20214 yr by Bert Pieke

3 minutes ago, kaosfere said:

Second, @cobalt is also correct, more practically, that cleaning out your community folder for an update likely doesn't actually prevent any problems with the game itself.   To that effect, the rote repetition in the release announcements and the folks who repeat it can sound a bit cargo-culty.

Sorry, but these were his words:
 

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Placing files in Community (or removing files from it) has no effect whatever on the basic MSFS program operations. 

Which is wrong, and I'm sure you know very well, a file in the Community folder that overrides a stock file, especially one that HAS been updated by Asobo, WILL have some kind effect on the "basic MSFS program operations".

The amount of the adverse effect will change a lot, from harmless (maybe only cosmetic), to fairly serious and everything in between, depending which file was updated by Asobo, what the add-on did with its override. 

I never said you should *always* clear the Community folder before an update, because that's not always needed, I just said it's wrong saying it's a useless practice and doing it or not won't make any difference. That was the one and only reason for my reply, making it clear it's not an urban myth or some kind of voodoo ritual that doesn't have any technical basis. 

 

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For what it's worth, I use Addons Linker to disable all my mods the first time I launch a new update and sanity check everything.  Then I gradually layer my add-ons on top so I can tell what step of the process broke something.  I think it's a practice people could do well to follow, but everyone has their own patience and tolerance for problems.

That's precisely the point I was trying to make.

Considering it takes a moment to temporarily disable everything with the Addon linker, I think it's way easier to do it this way. I personally don't do it, but that's just because I don't usually keep any add-ons other than the ones I'm working on in the Community folder, but for users with hundreds of different add-ons, how they could possibly *know* which ones made an override of a stock file ? 

40 minutes ago, virtuali said:

Which is wrong, and I'm sure you know very well, a file in the Community folder that overrides a stock file, especially one that HAS been updated by Asobo, WILL have some kind effect on the "basic MSFS program operations".

Perhaps it's a language thing, but I think we're reading that statement differently.   For me it reads more like "things such as, for instance, game updates will not be broken by having things in the community folder".   But I agree it's a little vague and I can totally see parsing it the way you have, too.

I think we fundamentally agree, though, so I won't belabor the point too much.  🙂  Just wanted to clarify my parsing there.

Edited June 17, 20214 yr by kaosfere

Whose on first....

Despite the nuances of language and what each reads into the others words that may not be there, the essence is:

1. the update process does not touch any files in the Community folder

2. after an update, it is a lottery to see what, if anything in the Community folder now does not work.

3. there have been occasions when existing addons have been broken by a change made to the simulator that should not have happened and was then corrected,

the .cgl file debacle being one such instance.

4. generally however, it is for the third party developers to accommodate the changes made to the simulator as it develops with each update.