So are we getting an update tomorrow or not? 

5 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

I believe they ask for this if you run into problems after an update..

Bert,

With all DUE respect, We now have MSFS providing issues and problems with every update (without exception) to some simmers.  Surely, this procedure should be precautionary at least. 

Given your expertise and a proven record for helping people on this and other AVSIM forae, I am more than happy to follow your advice, but I have to say, it would be with some trepidation, if I am honest with myself.

For me, it just seems to be a drama for something mandatory that I do not want LOL

Regards

Tony  

3 hours ago, cobalt said:

Placing files in Community (or removing files from it) has no effect whatever on the basic MSFS program operations. Therefore it is not necessary to do anything with Community prior to updates. Moreover, if you use Add-on Linker (highly recommended), no files at all are ever placed in Community, as only links to files are put there. I will add that Updates to MSFS have no effect on Community.

Good luck with that message. Once embedded, urban myths are devilishly difficult to dislodge.

Like some others I could mention...

3 hours ago, cobalt said:

Placing files in Community (or removing files from it) has no effect whatever on the basic MSFS program operations. Therefore it is not necessary to do anything with Community prior to updates. Moreover, if you use Add-on Linker (highly recommended), no files at all are ever placed in Community, as only links to files are put there. I will add that Updates to MSFS have no effect on Community.

That's simply not true, and shows a complete lack of understanding of how the Virtual File System in MSFS works.

ANY add-on, regardless if it's physically placed in the Community folder or "just" linked, CAN surely affect any program operations, sometimes at its deepest level, and this because of the way the file system is Virtualized in MSFS and yes, it is an intended effect to allow easy modability without actually overwriting anything, but the net effect IS exactly like an overwrite, although it's more easily reversed ( just remove the package in case of problems ).

Let's do a simple example of what a Virtualized file system means, using the G3000 from WT as an example.

Inside the package, named workingtitle-g3000, we can find this file, for example:

Community\workingtitle-g3000\html_ui\InGamePanels\GameVFRMap.html

This path, which starts AFTER the package name itself, will be MERGED with the same path found in any of the default packages, which means (depending on loading order, usually the last package loaded is used, if more than one use the same file ), which will result in an OVERWRITE of the default file of the same path/filename, to be found here:
 

Official\OneStore\fs-base-ingamepanels-vfrmap\html_ui\InGamePanels\GameVFRMap.html

This was just an example, the same package includes lots of other overwrites using the same method, and this is the intended result, which allowed WT to redefine the default G3000 without having to overwrite any default files, but basically achieving the same effect, because the simulator won't EVER use the default file anymore, as long the add-on package is there.

Now, when there's an update, any of one of these overwrites which might rely on other default files of the PREVIOUS version, which might have been changed with the update ( less likely if it's just a World Update, but that's not the point here ) and some of these changes might cause the whole simulator to malfunction, because as long the add-on package is there, the simulator will still use a file which was modded from the previous version of the sim. That's why so many times those add-ons required an update, to catch up with the simulator updates and offer *new* modded versions based on the *current* version of the stock file.

Now, not every add-on requires to do something like that. Some simply *add* new files, and these are usually harmless because, even if the simulator update had changes which broke compatibility with that add-on ( that add-on might have added new files, not overwrites, which were still relying on other stock files ), the worse it could happen would be that add-on (only) might not work correctly.

But anything that does a "virtual" override of a stock file CAN potentially break the sim ( or parts of it ), because it's actually replacing stock files with modded versions based on the previous version of the sim.

So yes, suggesting to at least temporarily disable all your Community add-ons before an upgrade IS good practice, especially if you have many of them, and you might not be sure which files they have might have "virtually" overwritten.

Now, regarding the next update, which is a World Update, MS/Asobo said from now on World Updates should ONLY contains scenery, and actual simulator functions should be added or changed only through Sim updates. Assuming this will be valid for tomorrow's update, it less likely an add-on in the Community folder might break the sim and, I realize that now that WT is working closed with Asobo, it might be more unlikely to happen even with a future Sim update, but mine was just an EXAMPLE, to possibly let people understand how the VFS works, which is a great idea, but one must be aware of the potential pitfalls.

Edited June 16, 20214 yr by virtuali

9 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

I believe they ask for this if you run into problems after an update..

I think you right it is not needed to clear the community folder there nothing gets touched but could be possible some kind of mods or Scenery in the community do not work anymore

but this dosen`t keeps MSFS from working.

But the affected scenery or mod has to be updated from the responsible Devs.

 

But if you changed something in the Official\OneStore\  folder it would be better to reset it back before the update..

 

cheers 😉

Just a little clarification, @virtuali, if you please: If you leave the addons in the community folder or link them, the sim will still update the core files, even though your sim will not use it at launch because it will use the version in the community folder first, right? So whatever you do, you will not end up failing the download, right?

Im not saying that removing the community folder isn't best practice, but just asking the "what if" question 🙂

Just now, Andreas Stangenes said:

If you leave the addons in the community folder or link them, the sim will still update the core files, even though your sim will not use it at launch because it will use the version in the community folder first, right? So whatever you do, you will not end up failing the download, right?

Sure, the simulator will still install and download all the files, but as long the add-on that made a "Virtual override" of any stock file is present, the simulator will still use the modded file.

That's why I said this is easily fixed and no real harm is done, because it will be enough to disable/remove the add-on, and the sim will be back using all its new files.

We can safely say no add-on in the Community would prevent a successful installation of the update. However, they surely can prevent the sim from working correctly but again, it requires both the following conditions:

- the add-on must have "virtually overridden" a stock file.
- the simulator updated that file, and the new update was required for the sim to work correctly.

If both of these are true, the simulator will update just fine, but it won't work correctly until the add-on is disabled, waiting for the developer to supply a *new* modded version based on the updated stock file.

Naturally excited about having another beautiful part of the world being updated but as this seems to be just the scenery and no sim update I’m not looking forward to what the lower tree LODs at more northerly latitudes are going to do to the look of the forests.

So... is tomorrow or the 27th update day?

I live in Sweden and fly in the Nordics to 90%, so this is the most important update for me so far, I really hope they have done something to fix the tree distance lod as it is horrible in the Nordic countrys.

The tree distance is afaik the same all over the world. We do have a lot of forests up here in the north so perhaps thats what you mean. That it makes it more visible. 
 

i look forward to see if the nordic update fixes the very bad scenery tiles that is all washed out and full of baked in clouds. 

28 minutes ago, cavaricooper said:

So... is tomorrow or the 27th update day?

It supposed to be tomorrow now.

4 minutes ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

The tree distance is afaik the same all over the world.

@Bijan has demonstrated that the LOD diminishes the further away from the equator you get. This is certainly my experience with, for example, the UK update where I was going from south to north and had to give up by the time I got to Carlisle because the shrinking LOD looked awful.

God knows what it’s going to look like in the Nordics if they haven’t done anything with it.

1 hour ago, himmelhorse said:

For me, it just seems to be a drama for something mandatory that I do not want LOL

Actually, no... it is drama that does not actually accomplish anything... and is not mandatory. 😀

1 hour ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

The tree distance is afaik the same all over the world. We do have a lot of forests up here in the north so perhaps thats what you mean. That it makes it more visible. 
 

i look forward to see if the nordic update fixes the very bad scenery tiles that is all washed out and full of baked in clouds. 

The closer the poles on you are flying, the worse the tree lod distance is, it is about 5nm in the middle of Sweden where I live, it was 10nm before when the tree lod fix was working.