4 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Im not trying to have any long drawn out discussion on this issue but frankly the track record in my opinion isn't good. Update after update there are problems that usually get piled on unless of course there is an uproar and after  one year in im tired of it. Something is rotten in their  process for me. If its working for you great. They have had around 1 year to improve the process.

 Im  hearing a lot of talking and promises but im still looking for that process improvement to bear fruit. God bless the third party developers who have to deal with this type of chaos.

Im done talking on the subject.

Why are you griping at me for Asobo's process? LOL. I don't recall saying Asobo had good development processes.  I merely pointed out they had a deadline on July 27th that was immovable, because they spent a lot of $$$ on advertising that date.

I think you need to relax and chill.  Don't take out your anger with Sim Update 5 on other simmers, especially when those simmers aren't even defending Asobo's development process.

Just now, abrams_tank said:

Why are you griping at me for Asobo's process? LOL. I don't recall saying Asobo had good development processes.  I merely pointed out they had a deadline on July 27th that was immovable, because they spent a lot of $$$ on advertising that date.

I think you need to relax and chill.  Don't take out your anger with Sim Update 5 on other simmers, especially when those simmers aren't even defending Asobo's development process.

Im responding to your post highlighting the date .. you know the one thing you took from my post and responded to ignoring the meat of the post agreeing with Chock about Asobo seeming to have a knack for putting out buggy updates ??

AND  FYI .. I have BARELY posted anything about Sim update 5. How about you check yourself and how you comprehend my posts ?

6 minutes ago, Maxis said:

Im responding to your post highlighting the date .. you know the one thing you took from my post and responded to ignoring the meat of the post agreeing with Chock about Asobo seeming to have a knack for putting out buggy updates ??

AND  FYI .. I have BARELY posted anything about Sim update 5. How about you check yourself and how you comprehend my posts ?

Your original quote that I replied to was "they are being micromanaged from upper management to stick to the almighty deadline."  That's all that I replied to originally.  I did not reply to the rest of the post between you and Chock.  I was simply replying to that one line, "they are being micromanaged from upper management to stick to the almighty deadline."  My reading comprehension is fine, it's your reading comprehension that needs improvement.

That one line you wrote showed a lack of understanding of the business reasons why July 27th was an immovable date.  No duh upper management will tell them to stick to the deadline of July 27th, when they have spent a lot of $$$ advertising July 27th. You would be a really bad executive or upper manager too, if you spend a lot of $$$ advertising a specific date for release, and then try to change the date after you have spent all that $$$ and try to undo the advertising of that date - I don't even know how you can undo the advertising of July 27th, it probably costs 10x more $$$ to undo the advertising of July 27th since you have already embedded that date in the minds of so many people that saw the original advertisement.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by abrams_tank

Rolls eyes ..

Ok your point is made moving right the hell along..

I have neither the time nor the patience to explain to you how objectives are laid out and resources assessed and allocated in conjunction with the developer BEFORE deadlines are set.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by Maxis

Many thanks for the bickering. It's reassuring when nothing changes.

2 minutes ago, Reader said:

Many thanks for the bickering. It's reassuring when nothing changes.

Not a word not allowed thing ..

 

3 minutes ago, Reader said:

Many thanks for the bickering. It's reassuring when nothing changes.

It is not only bickering here. There is a core issue. 

Maxis makes an important point which is behind all this mess. The issue is not to know whether you can ou can’t change a deadline once it is out in the public but that you set it in such a way you don’t have to change it by careful planning and negociation. 

It is the old as the world dialectic between engineering and marketing . Microsoft Game division is mostly a distributor  and has chosen the philosophy dictated by marketing. Better to release something flawed, people will not be happy first but will calm down, even be grateful, after some hot fixes, than to release infrequently. 

5 hours ago, Chock said:

Nope. That's a straw man right there. People were not simply claiming there were changes; what they were doing was claiming that there were deliberate downgrades in the graphics as a result of making the sim XBox compatible as a policy by MS/Asobo. And that's what most others were saying was not the case.

It's not "we" though, I have no control of what others claim. Just because if one person is on the same side of the argument doesn't mean you are responsible for the actions of everyone on the same side of the argument. I gave people a hard time on both sides for making silly claims.

So, it's not a straw man because i carry no personal responsibility for what people claim on a forum, irregardless if they may just happen to agree with one thing I said. The Xbox was partly the cause indirectly, but it wasn't a blackhat marketing scheme to cripple the PC intentionally as some claim, that was obvious.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by Alpine Scenery

32 minutes ago, Maxis said:

I have neither the time nor the patience to explain to you how objectives are laid out and resources assessed and allocated in conjunction with the developer BEFORE deadlines are set.

You don't have to.  I am also a professional software developer that has worked on many large projects, LOL.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by abrams_tank

Meanwhile, this is what MSFS looks like for me in supposedly it's "worst" state. I would love a true A/B test between the current version of SU5 and after the hotfix. Folks, please start taking screenshots and documenting the exact location, weather and time of day. There will be people who will say the graphics are worse then FS9 at the pace we're going in hyperbole. 

 

15 minutes ago, Slides said:

Meanwhile, this is what MSFS looks like for me in supposedly it's "worst" state. I would love a true A/B test between the current version of SU5 and after the hotfix. Folks, please start taking screenshots and documenting the exact location, weather and time of day. There will be people who will say the graphics are worse then FS9 at the pace we're going in hyperbole. 

 

Almost noone went to such an extent in their "hyperbole" argumentation. Come on. Many people said SU5 was looking WORSE and were confronted by the typical "Mine looks as good as ever".  Legit downgrade screenshots were taken, explained, comparison videos were made. And those "it must be you" posts kept repeating. And eventually, Asobo acknowledged:

Quote

 

- Missing volumetric lighting

- Low-resolution ground textures

- LOD popping and stutter when the camera is panning.

- Washed out graphics and cloud appearance.

 

Asobo. Not any whinner hyperbolistic user. What else do you need? Thats arguing with conclusive presumptions.

 

 

 

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by Aristoteles

good news then with the upcoming hotfix - fingers crossed no new issues are introduced though.

However the main issue for me is stutters on final - when will Asobo address this as it completely ruins the enjoyment for me.

also bring on the new LOD implementation - hopefully in SU6.

3 minutes ago, Aristoteles said:

What else do you need? 

No one was willing or able to provide true A/B screenshots for days and the ones provided had way too many variables to justify the hyperventilating (and yes there was plenty of this).

Why don't you do an A/B test now before the hotfix hits?

 

 

16 minutes ago, Slides said:

There will be people who will say the graphics are worse then FS9 at the pace we're going in hyperbole.

Lol, somebody already beat you to that point a few months ago..

11 minutes ago, Aristoteles said:

Almost noone went to such an extent in their "hyperbole" argumentation. Come on. Many people said SU5 was looking WORSE and were confronted by the typical "Mine looks as good as ever".  Legit downgrade screenshots were taken, explained, comparison videos were made. And those "it must be you" posts kept repeating. And eventually, Asobo acknowledged:

- Missing volumetric lighting

- Low-resolution ground textures

- LOD popping and stutter when the camera is panning.

- Washed out graphics and cloud appearance.

Asobo. Not any whinner hyperbolistic user. What else do you need? 

You made the point better than I did. There were people on both sides of the argument turning it into a MAJOR drama, but it wasn't the majority. The drama queens were using the loudest and most foul language, so it is just easier to remember those posts. Their posts just stick in our heads more. As far as updates go though, this was overall the worst update if you look at all sides (not from the user experience, in that case it was probably 2nd or 3rd worse). However, if you include DEV mode issues, yah they have never had an update with this many issues before.

The issues many see are just a speckle compared to the number of issues they introduced to the developer side.

Edited August 5, 20214 yr by Alpine Scenery