11 hours ago, pmplayer said:

Do not go for Intel !!!

Intel is Dead IMO ..

And yet, Jetline systems, the ultimate sim pros, still use Intel for their computers.. 😉

https://jetlinesystems.com/computers/

2 hours ago, GSalden said:

Nowhere near 30 Gb …..

Sure, don’t run at maximum visual quality to stay below 32GB.  I was just letting folks know that if you don’t compromise your settings and add-ons, you can exceed 32GB RAM.

Edited July 21, 2025Jul 21 by SayAgain

2 hours ago, flyingscampi said:

One of my first jobs was to install RAM chips on a stack of AST SixPak's - an exapansion card for IBM PC's. Each card took 6 rows of 9 chips  at 64 KB a row (total 384KB). Added to the 256 KB on the motherboard, you reached the DOS maximum of 640 KB.

I got told off for throwing away a chip I'd bent the legs on, and found out we sold a 64KB kit for £120. You can now work out how much 64 GB RAM would have cost in 1984 🙂

Thanks for the memories. My first PC was an AST Premium/286. I had forgotten about that  lol!  When you mentioned AST i remembered the logo on that massive chassis.

Back to topic.  

11 minutes ago, Maxis said:

My first PC was an AST Premium/286

Outside my budget when I was young, TRS-80 Color computer 32KB with upgraded “bubble RAM” for 64KB.

My first Intel based PC I could afford was Packard Bell 386SX … for work I had a Compaq 286 with a 20MB MFM hard drive (yes 20MB) … I was on top of the world and 13” color CRT.

I’d like to say the good old days … but well, they really weren’t … just simpler times where it took longer to get less done.  But on the plus side, it does make me appreciate what we have today and why I side with top tier hardware … it just keeps impressing me.

Edited July 21, 2025Jul 21 by SayAgain

It cost me under $100 to throw away my 32GB Ram and replace it with new 64GB. It accomplished very little, but also cost very little.

Any CPU will do well as long as it's name ends with: X3D. Better performance, lower power draw, and your MB will be able to upgrade that cpu without buying a new MB for a longer time than with Intel. Possibly better quality control issues too. 

1 hour ago, Bert Pieke said:

And yet, Jetline systems, the ultimate sim pros, still use Intel for their computers.. 😉

https://jetlinesystems.com/computers/

Intel is really dead (for now). The odds of them coming back are not zero, of course, but they are slim. This isn't my opinion:

https://www.xda-developers.com/intel-new-chip-unstable-two-companies-take-over/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/intel-ceo-reportedly-admits-it-is-too-late-for-us-to-catch-ai-leaders-like-nvidia-but-here-s-how-it-could-still-recover/ar-AA1IqJAp

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/bill-gates-says-intel-has-lost-its-way-hints-that-brave-pat-gelsinger-exited-too-soon

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/26/intel-dominated-us-chip-industry-now-struggling-to-stay-relevant.html

https://www.thurrott.com/hardware/314287/intel-is-dead-and-x86-is-next

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/intel-ceo-reportedly-admits-it-is-too-late-for-us-to-catch-ai-leaders-like-nvidia-but-here-s-how-it-could-still-recover/ar-AA1IqJAp

You can find many many other such analysis.

This isn't just a "stock" issue. They have completely missed the boat on multiple tech shifts, and for them to catch up again will be very very hard. 

Of course, this doesn't mean that theirs chips don't work.. they work, and will continue to work, but they are simply behind on process nodes, architecture, and a lot more. So yes, you can buy an Intel chip and run MSFS, but you're getting a worse chip (in pretty much all ways a chip can be worse - power, performance, price, stability..). As long as you go in happy with that, you can get Intel. 

Consider that Jetline may have stock of Intel chips, along with years of training, support, long term deals with motherboard manufactures.. a company may not necessarily be able to switch on a dime. And again, it does work, it's just not as good.

Kinda like AMD used to be in the Bulldozer era.. it worked, but you really didn't want to buy AMD over Intel Core chips.

Naturally I'm not telling you how to spend your money, you do you, but for those who may be remembering Intel from their glory days.. those days are gone. 

54 minutes ago, SayAgain said:

Sure, don’t run at maximum visual quality to stay below 32GB.  I was just letting folks know that if you don’t compromise your settings and add-ons, you can exceed 32GB RAM.

Just tested with eveything at Ultra + tLOD / OLOD at 300. Still below 30 Gb.And 2x 4K..

But I use a VC without panels , so that might have to do with it.

9 minutes ago, JonathanC said:

Intel is really dead (for now). The odds of them coming back are not zero, of course, but they are slim.

..

Kinda like AMD used to be in the Bulldozer era.. it worked, but you really didn't want to buy AMD over Intel Core chips.

Naturally I'm not telling you how to spend your money, you do you, but for those who may be remembering Intel from their glory days.. those days are gone. 

Still sounds like a Ford vs Chevy topic to me.. 😉

He has a 10.5 Gb VRAM graphics card

1 hour ago, GSalden said:

Just tested with eveything at Ultra + tLOD / OLOD at 300. Still below 30 Gb.And 2x 4K..

But I use a VC without panels , so that might have to do with it.

Someone on the official forums mentioned that Windows doesn’t wait until your ram is absolutely full to the limit before it starts paging stuff out to disk. They suggested this can start happening much earlier and increases the closer you get to the limit. I have no idea if there’s any truth to this but thought it might be worth a consideration for anyone close to 32GB 🙂

Edited July 21, 2025Jul 21 by Virtual-Chris

2 hours ago, SayAgain said:

Outside my budget when I was young, TRS-80 Color computer 32KB with upgraded “bubble RAM” for 64KB.

My first Intel based PC I could afford was Packard Bell 386SX … for work I had a Compaq 286 with a 20MB MFM hard drive (yes 20MB) … I was on top of the world and 13” color CRT.

I’d like to say the good old days … but well, they really weren’t … just simpler times where it took longer to get less done.  But on the plus side, it does make me appreciate what we have today and why I side with top tier hardware … it just keeps impressing me.

Completely agree, my first PC was a 386SX25, a cast off from my old man's work.  Cut my teeth on that beast 🤣

First upgrade was then to a 386DX40 🤣

30 years ago the notion that I could fly a simulator at home like I can today was pure science fiction.  The good new days...

1 hour ago, GSalden said:

He has a 10.5 Gb VRAM graphics card

Looks like a lot of work was put into that video, but my observations:

1.  Not every DLC was tested

2.  Airport location and vendor will have a significant impact on RAM and VRAM

3.  Weather was used, this will have impact on RAM, VRAM, and FPS

4.  Other DLC scenery within LOD will impact RAM, VRAM, FPS 

5.  Setting were all modified while on the ground in the same location (no actual flight)

6.  The AI traffic varied in density during testing

7.  No testing was done at night or dawn/dusk

8.  The view was static, no 360 pan after each setting change so objects weren’t being loaded in memory

Rob.

Edited July 21, 2025Jul 21 by SayAgain

2 hours ago, JonathanC said:

Intel is really dead (for now).

Not sure if I’d say “dead”, but they are certainly in a restructuring phase.  Where I live (Portland OR), they have laid off almost 1000 Intel employees from the Intel campus, but wasn’t as bad as the predicted 10,000 layoffs.  I hope Intel come back stronger, it will be good for all if they do.

In most testing AMD have the advantage for server, workstation, gaming on the CPU side.  But like I suggested before, for MSFS 2024, so long as you have a reasonably recent CPU be it Intel or AMD, the GPU does most of the work (as it should for such graphically intensive simulation).

28 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

Completely agree, my first PC was a 386SX25, a cast off from my old man's work.  Cut my teeth on that beast 🤣

First upgrade was then to a 386DX40 🤣

30 years ago the notion that I could fly a simulator at home like I can today was pure science fiction.  The good new days...

OMG !! same progression .. !!! I lived in Jamaica at the time so this stuff was not cheap but luckily my neighbor was big into PC's and fixed them for a living. I convinced my parents to purchase the AST at a substantial discount from him and up until i left the island for college my neighbor would be my go to in getting upgrades at cost. So literally the next PC i got from him was a Cyrix 386SX and the mythical 386DX 40 (That was a substantial upgrade over the 386SX) He also taught me how to identify and assemble the components. So it never was just about getting the PC .. it was also about learning everything about it. (A little DOS, A little Qbasic .. dabble in a bit of Unix) Worked out pretty handy for A Levels and CXC exams.

Coming from those days does indeed give one a bit of perspective .. I remember how impressed i was with FS 4.00 lol.

Edited July 21, 2025Jul 21 by Maxis

1 hour ago, JonathanC said:

Intel is really dead (for now). The odds of them coming back are not zero, of course, but they are slim.

Many of your articles are from last year. Their latest mobile chips are competitive (they benchmark similar to the M4 Pro in quite a few synthetic tests), but they won't have a competitive desktop chip until at least Q3/Q4 2026. Mobile is where it's at though... Intel would certainly be dead if they focused on their desktop chips first.