Well I did the jump FSX to the real Cessna172. And from FSX to real world 767 and 737 full motion LevelD sims.

I had no problems with the real Cessna 172. I have done 767 many times and 737 NG once. I did complete flights from cold dark cockpit at gate to landing under bad weather conditions.

 

After flying the LD767 for years, I had no problems landing the full motion sim - and that was doing difficult approached like KLGA 31 Expressway visual and KJFK 13L.

The 737 also went well, but I think the 737 is a bit harded to fly yhan the 767.

 

Let's face it - if you master these sims, you have the knowledge to configure the plane properly and know how to control it. The average smo doesn't have a clue. I had over 50 people try to land a 737 or 767 at my home simlulator (yoke, throttles, pedals etc). I put them on fimal - 5 miles out. Everyone crashed - some completely missed the airport.

 

I stuck all the landings in the full motion sim -despite crosswinds, 1 engine out, difficult approaches, 1/4 mile visibility - I tried all of them.

So I am not a pilot, but I still think I have skills and knowledge to land any Boeing jet. Once the 777 is released, I'll do the same do 2-4 hours on the 777 full motion sim in Miami.

 

If I hit the Powerball, I may rent a 767 and try it for real.

Just a small notice, if you rotate the aircraft in the perfect way, with flaps 1 you have a tail clearance to the ground of just 1 feet in the 800..... now if you don't do it correctly there is a very big chance of smashing your tail on the runway...

 

Hello,

 

Is that correct. I am amazed that the 737-800 has only a one foot margin for correct rotation rate. Are you sure that is not one metre?

 

One foot seems extremly tight. Would imagine there would be many many tail strikes for such a low tolerence.

 

Cheers

 

Neil

I vote plausible.

 

Not believing you until your vote is in the form of a metal plate, worded just so.

Maybe high-quality hardware helps. Obviously, a Saitek yoke or any other desktop yoke is not going to replicate the feel of a real aircraft as well as a motorized column yoke would. Add some external panels and the desktop simulation even better mimics the real thing.

 

My biggest concerns involving piloting a real aircraft in an emergency would be (1) deciding and performing appropriate modifications to the flight plan and (2), in the case of a visual approach, lining up the aircraft correctly with the runway center line. In the simulator, you can fix the runway to a certain part of the glare shield, but in a real aircraft, you don't have the same consistent viewpoint as you do in the simulator.

All the NGX can do is help you be familiar with operational procedures and aircraft systems. It can't teach much you about how the real aircraft feels and handles, no matter how good the hardware is.

 

As for the hypothetical situation, ATC would be giving you vectors, so modifying the flight plan should not be an issue. Similarly they'd no doubt give you a long straight approach. As for a visual approach, I think you'd need proper flight training to accomplish that in real life, FSX/NGX won't help. An auto approach is the only viable way this could be done.

 

What people forget is the overwhelming effect on your nerves in the real situation. I've flown many Level C and D sims and can land them with no difficulty. But I took a trial lesson in a C152 years ago and while my sim experience meant I was able to control the plane easily, easier than the FSX Cessna, when it came to landing seeing the ground rushing up to meet me in the last few feet before touchdown was quite disconcerting. I forgot all my sim technique. I managed it but I had an instructor next to me talking me through it with his hands hovering near the controls, just in case.

 

Overall I think in good conditions (daylight, with no wind or turbulence) it might be possible. Flying in such conditions is easier than in FSX. However bad weather would make it very risky. But if it was the only option it would have to be tried.

All the NGX can do is help you be familiar with operational procedures and aircraft systems. It can't teach much you about how the real aircraft feels and handles, no matter how good the hardware is.

 

As for the hypothetical situation, ATC would be giving you vectors, so modifying the flight plan should not be an issue. Similarly they'd no doubt give you a long straight approach. As for a visual approach, I think you'd need proper flight training to accomplish that in real life, FSX/NGX won't help. An auto approach is the only viable way this could be done.

My point was that good hardware can probably increase one's degree of preparation. Yokes such as the ones produced by Revolution Sim (which I linked in my previous post) appear to be of similar quality as those used in professional simulators, which are more realistic than desktop simulators. While the flight dynamics and immersion factors of aircraft in FSX are going to be less accurate than those of a real simulator, being used to a high-quality, motorized, smooth yoke is going to be better than being used to a plastic toy yoke.

 

Good point about ATC vectors. That would certainly make things a lot less stressful.

 

Not believing you until your vote is in the form of a metal plate, worded just so.

Ha ha.

Hello,

 

Is that correct. I am amazed that the 737-800 has only a one foot margin for correct rotation rate. Are you sure that is not one metre?

 

One foot seems extremly tight. Would imagine there would be many many tail strikes for such a low tolerence.

 

Cheers

 

Neil

 

 

Yes, it actually is correct. Check ur FCTM manual, should be chapter 3 and there is a tail clearance table for different 737 models with different flap settings.

 

 

That is why a flap 1 take off is a captains only take off in our company.

pilot the NGX 737 cold and dark to cold and dark perfectly ?

 

if no tell me why

 

Ha Easy!!

Surely the question should be, could a real 737 pilot fly the mightily complex FS9/X, or my VESPA scooter.

Well could they ?,

Ha! I doubt it Sir

:Cuppa:

Andy

Yes, it actually is correct. Check ur FCTM manual, should be chapter 3 and there is a tail clearance table for different 737 models with different flap settings.

 

 

That is why a flap 1 take off is a captains only take off in our company.

 

Hi Patrik,

 

Thats very interesting. I had no idea it was that close. Good info on the Captain only requirement, again I had never heard of that for a flap 1 takeoff. Amazing what you can learn on these forums.

 

Cheers

 

Neil

I am not sure about this, but I think that if the cockpit crew was unfit in whatever way, the head flight attendant might have some emergency training and be guided by ATC. That said if no one else available I echo the other comments on here, provided conditions are optimal, and you set it all up for autoland like we can do in the NGX. Fly it manually, most likely not. The nerves , anticipation, and life on the line for something you havnt done in real life, might get the better of you if you havnt experienced it before.

 

I was in a DC 10 simulator years and years ago, I saw RW pilots who really sweated and were really on edge, granted they were extreme circumstances, as in landing with no left main gear, landing in zero visibility and then finding that the runway is occupied by error, but it takes a great amount of experience to calm and control your nerves in an emergency situation and know what to do in a calm fashion. Something FSX cant give you.

If you were called to land the NGX that would be an emergency situation, and yes you will know your way around the cockpit, and how to use the MCP and set the ILS frequency, and press VOR/LOC and APP, but Im pretty sure your heart would be racing a mile a minute, and in those situations, we dont always think straight unless we have the proper training. As a commercial pilot that is years and years of training and experience.

 

That said , we would have a much better chance than another anonymous passenger. We can only thank PMDG for having such a complex simulator that is as close to the real thing as possible minus the physical effects, to give any chance of getting the bird down in a crisis situation.

_{Another good example; I flew RL F-16 sims while in the USAF, and flew Falcon 4.0 for many years, and fly A-10 DCS as well. I also have real-life F-16B, D, and DJ, and F-4C, D, and E stick time taxiing, 2 takeoffs (shhhh) from the back seat, and flight at cruise and various alts. Never cold and dark to cold and dark except when I was doing an engine run. I can operate all of the F-16 avionics and systems and have real-life experience with all of them, but even though I can act as a stick actuator in the air, and I can land in the sim, I'd rather eject and live than auger in and die even in an aircraft that I know from head to toe. So my short answer is that you could probably get it off of the ground (theoretically speaking and not encouraging you), but you would probably end up as a smokin' hole in the ground on approach.}

 

_Cheers.

As a real life pilot I should say that growing up with Flight Sim was a big plus in avionics and systems training.

 

IFR work can be done with FSX/FS9 but then you don't need a joystick and will use the auto pilot.

 

I have no time on a 737 but have quite a lot on the Beechcraft 90/200 family and cessna citation family and I can tell you that, yes, you can recognize stuff but once you get up there, hand flying, actual IFR , I give you 3 minutes before you loose control.

 

Flying " in the system " in Europe is very demanding, even more in winter, let alone night flying IMC.

 

FSX is a game and can be considered a system/IFR training support at best.

 

Nothing will prepare you to real flying but real flying, even a LVL-D sim is not the same as the real deal. Let me tell you that when I prefly my little beast and start the turbine, the clicking sound followed by the fuel ignition is a real treat, you got the smell the rumble in the seat ... it is a different world.

 

I suggest you go take a lesson in a C152 or C172 and do just a local VFR flight. You will see how different ( and better ^^ ) it is to any FSX you may have done.

 

I think it is dangerous to think you can land a 737 safely after playing around with the NGX, it is a great system trainer, that's for sure, but again , it is 80 dollars. A real type rating is around 40 000 dollars.

 

AFL581

Simple answer - NO!

 

However, if you combine GA flying experience with your knowledge from the NGX, you are more likely to manage a landing than an ordinary passenger with no experience.

I am not sure about this, but I think that if the cockpit crew was unfit in whatever way, the head flight attendant might have some emergency training and be guided by ATC. That said if no one else available I echo the other comments on here, provided conditions are optimal, and you set it all up for autoland like we can do in the NGX. Fly it manually, most likely not. The nerves , anticipation, and life on the line for something you havnt done in real life, might get the better of you if you havnt experienced it before.

 

I was in a DC 10 simulator years and years ago, I saw RW pilots who really sweated and were really on edge, granted they were extreme circumstances, as in landing with no left main gear, landing in zero visibility and then finding that the runway is occupied by error, but it takes a great amount of experience to calm and control your nerves in an emergency situation and know what to do in a calm fashion. Something FSX cant give you.

If you were called to land the NGX that would be an emergency situation, and yes you will know your way around the cockpit, and how to use the MCP and set the ILS frequency, and press VOR/LOC and APP, but Im pretty sure your heart would be racing a mile a minute, and in those situations, we dont always think straight unless we have the proper training. As a commercial pilot that is years and years of training and experience.

 

That said , we would have a much better chance than another anonymous passenger. We can only thank PMDG for having such a complex simulator that is as close to the real thing as possible minus the physical effects, to give any chance of getting the bird down in a crisis situation.

 

Best post yet... It's funny how some people claim to be able to do it because they have 2 hours of sim time on a real Level D simulator. One thing is to shoot a CAT III ILS with FSX through a 24" monitor in the comfort of your basement while sipping on some hot cocoa with marshmallows and another thing is to do the same in RL where the minimum requirements to even be considered for an interview is thousands of hours of real world, multi-engine experience, preferably with turbines. Like someone said, yes, wishful thinking, but to even think of comparing your skills to a professionally trained pilot, is ludicrous.

 

This reminds me of those that go to the shooting range and just because they are able to shoot a group of rounds in a tight group, they now think they can take on the world. Reality is, targets at the range don't shoot back at you. I've seen too many people be sharpshooters at the range but when the poopoo hits the fan in the streets, they can't hit the broadside of a barn with a softball.

Best post yet... It's funny how some people claim to be able to do it because they have 2 hours of sim time on a real Level D simulator. One thing is to shoot a CAT III ILS with FSX through a 24" monitor in the comfort of your basement while sipping on some hot cocoa with marshmallows and another thing is to do the same in RL where the minimum requirements to even be considered for an interview is thousands of hours of real world, multi-engine experience, preferably with turbines. Like someone said, yes, wishful thinking, but to even think of comparing your skills to a professionally trained pilot, is ludicrous.

 

This reminds me of those that go to the shooting range and just because they are able to shoot a group of rounds in a tight group, they now think they can take on the world. Reality is, targets at the range don't shoot back at you. I've seen too many people be sharpshooters at the range but when the poopoo hits the fan in the streets, they can't hit the broadside of a barn with a softball.

I don't see anyone claiming to be able to do that. Or comparing their home grown skill to that of a professional pilot. The question was can it be done. And even the post you quote says it could, in optimal conditions.

I am not sure about this, but I think that if the cockpit crew was unfit in whatever way, the head flight attendant might have some emergency training and be guided by ATC.

 

That actually happened in a RW 737 and the flight attendant even held a commercial pilot's license and was on track to be a pilot himself with his airline, but hypoxia and other issues such as both engines flamming out worked agasint him and he wasn't successful.