I notice that absolutely no one has mentioned Aerofly FS 2 and their 240+ FPS sim that is also in early access. They DO have an SDK and it enables users to create their own scenery. 

1 hour ago, TheFlightSimGuy said:

Not to mention us "pre-paying" for our PMDG heavies at increased costs from the FSX versions we already bought. Makes you wonder how many other products we prepaid for in those cycles. 

I think Robert's comment that was stated at the beginning of the video is most telling. It is hard to deny who the guardian of innovation for this platform is. And I would have much rather paid for my PMDG plane in FSW than have wasted money on their birds in v4 which I was never intended to be a user of to begin with. But no EULA discussions, means they sold you the plane at full price, knowing you werent conforming to the terms to begin with. Just shameful that we were led to think v4 was so great, when indeed it has turned out to be inferior. 

Not to mention no SDK at all in Flight School - the total failure of year one, and still no SDK for FSW in year two. 

Remember folks, FSW has not yet succeeded, so banging them victory drums prematurely could get embarrassing.

Very nice video.  Thank you for posting it.  I have it, but am not using it yet, but I'm keeping my eye on it.

Im not sure I'm ready to trust a company that has a track record like DTG when it comes to "putting consumers first".

Ask a train sim user how happy they are with the base sim cost after the thousands in DLC they shoved down people's throats. 

***DELETED***

i have repented of my ways

After that post, I can't wait to see how long it will take before this thread is locked.

DTG could still drop the ball, but at present they have picked it up and are running with it, and it's looking promising, which at the very least, now has less people doubting their sincerity when they can see the early results and the speed at which they are forthcoming. Six months ago, it was easy to be skeptical concerning DTG's bold statements about their the desire to move things along and push the boundaries of flight sims, but with every community update for FSW which tips up, they seem to be demonstrating that it was indeed more than mere words. Certainly they did the same with their train sim, CSX Heavy Haul, which does genuinely try to move things along in that genre and for the most part succeeds in doing so, not in every respect, but it was again a genuine attempt to do more than simply give the same sim platform a bit of a polish.

However, there's clearly still a long way to go with FSW and in the interim there's not really much doubt that presently, P3D V4 is the obvious choice if you want something which you can enjoy as comparitively complete without problems, at least for the more immediate future, and providing you manage to pilot your way through the socked in IMC which is LM's nebulous elephant in the room EULA.

But the clock is ticking for LM, the inclusion of trueSkies in FSW has well and truly nailed DTG's colours to the mast. Notwithstanding its early implimentation and the need for some tweaking to it, it already makes the clouds in other flight sims look like a joke in comparison, even when you throw an expensive TPD weather engine at them. And trueSkies is far from being alone in terms of features which have pushed things, as evidenced by FSW's interactive checklist feature, updated nav aids and ATC, the inclusion of much better default terrain and much better default aeroplane handling; if DTG keep that kind of thing up, I absolutely could see FSW becoming the sim of choice at some point, but it is an optimistic notion in the extreme to imagine it crossing the finish line by Christmas, even at the prodigious rate which DTG are adding updates to FSW.

Of course there is XPlane too, but I suspect even the most ardent XP fan would be forced to admit that we've been waiting far too long for some features to be in it, and all whilst we are subject to the whims of Austin. This has manifested itself in the conspicuous absence of the really high-end TPDs jumping onto a commitment to develop for XP in earnest, and this in spite of Laminar having up until relatively recently enjoyed a six-year period where ESP-based platforms were effectively dead in the water, yet failing to capitalise on that. As a result, I use XPlane 11 as though it too were an Early Access product lol.

Not forgetting AeroFly FS2 of course, but in comparison to the rate at which DTG have been pushing out features for the similarly early access FSW, FS2's early access rate of change looks almost as tectonic as that of Laminar.

But quite apart from all such speculation, I really don't understand why anyone has to get partisan about it. If you like flight sims, the more of them there are, the happier you should be in having a choice, after all, you can use more than one if you like, and none of them are compulsory either, if you have a preference.

This thread is like deja vu all over again.

 

1 minute ago, mwilk said:

This thread is like deja vu all over again.

 

thats a hell of a good movie .. have you seen it ?

1 minute ago, mwilk said:

This thread is like deja vu all over again.

 

 

It's the weekly Groundhog Day post.

You guys are right. This thread is going nowhere but it is interesting to see how passionate people are about their sims. 

Wouldn't 'deja vu all over again' be deja-deja vu-vu?

cmon guys lets all respect each others opinion and get along . AVSIM its lika a fun bar where everyone thinks their beer is the best , the end result its always the same  we all get drunk together . 

I should clarify I hope that FSW is successful but I am very skeptical, based on history. 

1 hour ago, JYW said:

  I'd say it was probably 50/50 between free/low cost upgrades, and significantly priced upgrades!

What is a major add-on to you? I have a full and complete experience now with V4. I have the planes (A2A w/GTN, PMDG w/FS2Crew), scenery (Orbx full Global), weather ( ASP4 ASCA Evntex), ATC (RCv4 FSUIPC Make runways), AI Traffic (Ultimate Traffic Live), planners/utilities, FS Aerodata, Navigraph w/ simlink, PFPX, Topcat, GSX, Super Traffic Board, FS Real Time. I paid less than $100 to have all this available in V4 now. V4 came out a couple of months ago and this is several hundreds of dollars in software. The only ones that I had to pay anything for were FSUIPC (the only full price upgrade), FS2 Crew (huge discount) , and the GTN (huge discount). I think your 50/50 assumption is way off.

Yes I have FSW, and no the FSW experience has nothing on my P3Dv4 experience. Now that I have an Oculus, AeroFly 2 blows FSW out of the water easy, and now that I'm "in the know" of how wonderful VR is in flight simming, I realize how huge of a mistake DTG is making by leaving VR out of the mix; they should have done their research.

I agree that there is room for FSW in the flight simming market, I just disagree how DTG is going about it, even to the point of doubting success at all, considering the whole market, historical facts, and present success so far.  

With a 664 all time player peak and only about 100 people (out of hundreds of thousands of flight simmers) of playing a day, there is not much fanfare at all, but Flight School did better with a 760 all time peak.

Of course we will give DTG all the time it needs, but all the while LM, LR, IPACS, and DCS are advancing too.