48 minutes ago, DJJose said:

The new doctor killer is now... drum roll... the sr22.

Although it’s more a “Geek Killer” as it’s the Silicon Valley types falling victim to the SR22...

2 hours ago, Cmcollazo71 said:

Although it’s more a “Geek Killer” as it’s the Silicon Valley types falling victim to the SR22...

The Cirrus is inline to far surpass the Bonanza crash record.  The ease of flying with the pilot override of the controls to return to level flight from steep turns and unusual attitudes, plus the parachute just waiting to take over gives the casual and rich pilot an easy path to disaster.
 

Cirrus flew a new SR22 Turbo from Peachtree, GA to Gulfport MS for me to demo. The preflight was maybe 5 minutes with the check pilot saying, “You have the plane, I have the radio“ We were ready for an intersection takeoff. This was my first look at synthetic vision and my first flight in the Turbo SR22.

I was impressed with the smoothness although the cabin did seem a little small, but, I was told I could write a check for 10% down and I would be the owner. That came to be a down payment of $75,000. Ouch.

40 minutes ago, raymar said:

The Cirrus is inline to far surpass the Bonanza crash record.

Indeed, although since Cirrus stepped up its new-owner training things have got better. But what is surprising is how GA accidents are not really declining, either here in Europe or the US. So what are all those TCAS, GPS, Glass cockpits, Parachutes, multiple screens, ipads, instant terrain readouts, weather reports, and the eye watering and escalating prices of aircraft and avionics achieving? Absolutely nothing!

Granted there are more GA pilots, but that doesn't altogether explain it. My first cross country (PPL training) was in 1973. I was given a sectional map, an analogue calculator, and a tail dragger (a delightful Rollason Condor that is still flying). I had no radio - they were not obligatory out of the airways. I flew from Biggin to Stapleford, a very busy grass airfield just north of London. I was allowed to cross London just east of Tower Bridge. I did the old WWII trick and followed a railway line to the right.

Circled Stapleford looking for traffic and set down without a radio call. This was perfectly normal then. No GPS, no ipad, no foreflight, no gizmos. It was the same for nearly all other GA pilots I knew. 

So what are all these safety features, hi-tech equipment and procedural regulations actually achieving? For some who are diligent, quite a lot. For those who are not well trained or complacent, they are of little use, apparently, because the most common accidents are still loss of control, controlled flight into terrain, flying into IMC, or mechanical failure.

We haven't come very far, despite the fact that GA aircraft are three times the price, even in real terms.

 

Edited October 19, 20205 yr by robert young

1 hour ago, robert young said:

So what are all these safety features, hi-tech equipment and procedural regulations actually achieving? For some who are diligent, quite a lot. For those who are not well trained or complacent, they are of little use, apparently, because the most common accidents are still loss of control, controlled flight into terrain, flying into IMC, or mechanical failure.

If a pilot relies too much on the automation and too little on basic flying skills stuff will happen. The number of times I've seen reports of professional pilots allowing the aircraft to get into a stall or worse while diddling with the automation is amazing. My instructor use to say - fly the airplane first, figure out what's wrong second. So just the addition of all those pretty bells and whistles can only be helpful if the pilot uses them as another tool and not a crutch.

I also remember one of the AOPA Safety guys saying these new faster aircraft will also get you to the scene of the crash faster. Meaning many of these pilots with plenty of money, but, not much free time are usually behind the airplane.

I remember having a 3 hour orientation of the early Lear 20 series. I was about a mile behind the Lear anytime the gear was up.

2 hours ago, raymar said:

I was told I could write a check for 10% down and I would be the owner. That came to be a down payment of $75,000. Ouch.

And hence I sim!!!😜

1 hour ago, robert young said:

So what are all these safety features, hi-tech equipment and procedural regulations actually achieving? For some who are diligent, quite a lot. For those who are not well trained or complacent, they are of little use, apparently, because the most common accidents are still loss of control, controlled flight into terrain, flying into IMC, or mechanical failure.

It’s the “Children of the Magenta” but in GA vs. the airlines it seems to me.

ATTN: Robert Young.  First Off, Thank You for your hard work on this Bonanza Mod.

She's flies beautifully.  Secondly, I just wanted to make sure you are receiving your donations OK.

I clicked on your donation link, hope you got it OK.  It indicates via my PayPal, it sent OK.

Let me know if you didn't receive it. I'll look into it for you.

Best,

David

PS Tried to PM this to you to not clutter up the threads, but you don't receive them. Hence this post.

Thank You again.

 

Re the Cirrus.  I had a friend of mine on takeoff, loose the hinge bolt on the left aileron.   The only way he survived, a moment of ground effect,

allowed him to push the nose over and dig the wing into the ground to stop him.  Miraculously, he survived with just a few scratches. Pretty amazing.

I'll stick to my Aerostar, Thank You very much!

Best,

David

17 hours ago, vgbaron said:

If a pilot relies too much on the automation and too little on basic flying skills stuff will happen. The number of times I've seen reports of professional pilots allowing the aircraft to get into a stall or worse while diddling with the automation is amazing. My instructor use to say - fly the airplane first, figure out what's wrong second. So just the addition of all those pretty bells and whistles can only be helpful if the pilot uses them as another tool and not a crutch.

Always fly the airplane first and foremost. That includes telling the ATC to get lost if necessary.

This Cirrus accident report is worth taking the time to watch right through and quite sobering.

 

 

Edited October 20, 20205 yr by Glenn Fitzpatrick

3 hours ago, David B said:

ATTN: Robert Young.  First Off, Thank You for your hard work on this Bonanza Mod.I clicked on your donation link, hope you got it OK.  It indicates via my PayPal, it sent OK.

Let me know if you didn't receive it. I'll look into it for you. PS Tried to PM this to you to not clutter up the threads, but you don't receive them. Hence this post.

 

Hi David, I was probably asleep. We're probably in different time zones. It's best to message for something like this. I am receiving messages but there isn't one from you. Are you sure it was sent?I will send you a PM.

4 hours ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

Always fly the airplane first and foremost. That includes telling the ATC to get lost if necessary.

This Cirrus accident report is worth taking the time to watch right through and quite sobering.

 

 

So sad.

A pilot is always learning is the adage that comes to mind, but there was so much that went wrong, that we also need to place blame to the ATCs. I agree with the conclusions.

If anyone is interested in adding repaints, here's the answer to your prayers:

 

Good information, but I believe @robert young is also working on some additional liveries for v3 of this amazing mod.

C

7 hours ago, Glenn Fitzpatrick said:

Always fly the airplane first and foremost. That includes telling the ATC to get lost if necessary.

This Cirrus accident report is worth taking the time to watch right through and quite sobering.

 

 

This one was just terrible.  I'm an ATCer and the tower guys not only did a complete public disservice, I also feel they were a part of that fatal accident.  At those airports where airliners mix with GA - ATC is inclined to give airliners the right of way - that's simply not how to work traffic.  The approach controller was responsible for sequencing the SWA and SR22 to the airport....even if tower is providing visual separation.  The way the tower spoke to the cirrus over and over and over was just REDICULOUS.  As a controller and I'm very blessed to also be a pilot.  I've worked traffic for over a decade at the TRACON level and tower level.... and having my pilot's license has been incredibly important for these situations.  I'm able to actively think about what I'm saying as I say it, while deciding if I'm giving an instruction that would be unsafe from the pilot side.  Many controllers are not pilots unfortunately - and cannot discern if something they are saying could be inherently dangerous on the pilot side of the mic.

Sorry for the off topic rant!