11 minutes ago, GSalden said:

Surely with a real size home cockpit I knew that it wouldn’t work completely at release, but till the US update I was able to fly around in MSFS with Prosim. 
The moment I installed the US update the CTD’s started with every flight up till today...

I was just watching the Squirrel's CRJ video and it reminded me that MSFS has a long way to go before we can get to where we want to be.

Soon a CRJ will be available, but nothing has been done to make the live weather feature fully functional.

Fortunately it only required the 1.4gb install so not to deadly.

To be fair i knew it would not be without issues, but with updates, it should be getting better not giving us more and more issues with every update.

I think the big issue is the bean counters at microsoft insisting on making the product xbox ready and they are using everyone on pc as their alpha and beta testers to sort out all the issues.

Azure status (IE NOT a sim problem)

status.azure.com

 

SUMMARY OF IMPACT: Starting at approximately 19:15 UTC on 15 Mar 2021, some customers may experience issues authenticating into Microsoft services, including Microsoft Teams, Office, Dynamics, Xbox Live, and the Azure Portal. ... Some customers may continue to see signs of recovery.

7 hours ago, mickatmian said:

I definitely did not pay £110 to be a beta tester!

MIck

and yet here you are

9 hours ago, Dominique_K said:

Reinstalling the sim or worse reinstalling Windows do not make any sense in 99.99% of the time. 

 

Nope.

Been in flight simulation (and gaming) for a very long time and I've never seen such a mess.  No apparent coordination between the design (Asobo), production, Bing, Azure and the communication teams. A frantic patching with no quality control which makes no sense.  No listening to the user base dressed up in a fake transparency  and ludicrous voting process.

This is a great product with an enormous potential. The project just lacks a key component. A boss. An overarching and tough driving project manager. 

My opinion from the start !.. 

10 hours ago, Paladin2005 said:

.so, whoever bought in August 2020 did that under known circumstances.

Right!,  When they said "We finished it a little early", we should have known that they meant "It is nowhere near finished and won't be for months or years--but you can pay us now"

Are these the circumstances that were known?  Really by whom?

Ridiculous comment.

14 hours ago, crimplene said:

As far as I know the Azure servers had a problem, lots of players got the "insert disc" message today. Re-installing the sim seems to be a bit over the top.

Not the Azure servers. The X-Box live servers.

6 hours ago, TASCHMANN said:

Right!,  When they said "We finished it a little early", we should have known that they meant "It is nowhere near finished and won't be for months or years--but you can pay us now"

Are these the circumstances that were known?  Really by whom?

Ridiculous comment.

Unfortunately those of us that participated in the alpha were under a gag order until launch, and are still technically under one in regards to the testing done beforehand. This message would have come across loud and clear if we had the option to express our opinions... 😉

11 hours ago, mazelda said:

To be fair i knew it would not be without issues,

Chery picking here but ....

As I have said before,  

I did not see the original release without issues,

I have yet to see an update without issues,

I have yet to see a world update without issues,

I have yet to see a hotfix without issues.

Surely it would be more correct, at the moment, at least,  to guarantee issues with updates instead of just expecting them.

Fortunately, for me at least, these issues have been minor, but that does not avoid the fact that a large percentage of simmers are experiencing problems.

The issue that perturbs me mostly, is why on earth, are only some people having major issues and these generally are not common, in that people are suffering through quite a few different issues or bugs,

Whether or not, we are considered by the developers as beta testers is irrelevant. We have bought an largely incomplete platform which is still doing the backwards forwards dance (alternative known as the simmers waltz) 

I simply cannot comprehend why MS and Asobo cannot forget about the updates temporarily and just concentrate on fixing the absolutely well known, and well publicised bugs and issues. I also notice that most of the updates are largely new and or better scenery, which is already very acceptable to most people.  I think most people would be very happy to have a full working system before we get World updates (which have to be fixed) 

What about the poor freeware devs who must dread each update with great alacrity and reckless abandon because they have to "fix" a previously well working product. I refer mostly to WorkingTitle and FBW. Robert Young, I think put in some incredibly good work with the Bonanza turbo but has not been heard from for the last two update, having, I believe, given up in sheer frustration.  I was really looking forward to his DA62 Mods but they simply stopped as far as I know. There are lost of other devs of freeware who have remained unmentioned, but I feel for all of them.  

Now we have Aerosoft, allegedly, one of the original MS partners and they have released, after such a long work in progress, and much the same publicity as the original MSFS2020 pre-release, which has bugs mostly related to MSFS lack of, or bugged systems.  This does not relate well with the next and subsequent "up-setback-dates in my opinion.

Finally, I have to say that I just love this sim, but when I want some sanity, I go to P3D and XPlane (nearly every day) in order to calm down and, I  note that they too are not with out minor issues.  

People are saying generally that we have to accept this situation, but I believe that there has to be a limit to patience, frustration and the sincere wish to "accept" a finished relatively bug free product.

Regards

Tony

7 minutes ago, himmelhorse said:

People are saying generally that we have to accept this situation, but I believe that there has to be a limit to patience, frustration and the sincere wish to "accept" a finished relatively bug free product.

The thing that occurs to me, is that the sims that you go back to, each have had a decade (or more) of development, spanning multiple versions.

Which is being compared to approximately 7 months from release of what is probably, arguably, an insanely more complex endeavor, considering all of the things MSFS is doing at the same time, and the different sources its streaming and combining data from, even as Asobo is (still) frantically working on the internals and the SDK and the imminent XBOX release as well as working with multiple partners.

In fact, it's even worse than that, really, because FSX is based on its older forebears, and that practically takes that sims history back through what amounts to multiple decades of incremental development.

Sure, there's eventually going to come a time to say enough is enough, but to me, a fair time for that is probably in a couple of years.

Even the much smaller developers of DTG sim asked for that much.

1 hour ago, HiFlyer said:

The thing that occurs to me, is that the sims that you go back to, each have had a decade (or more) of development, spanning multiple versions.

At release, common wisdom was like ‘wait 6 months or maybe a year for the dust to settle’. Now it is a couple of years  ? Or even a decade  😸 ?

Asobo said once that they begun to work on it some three years before the announcement so the project is already four to five years in the making. And to say they still work frantically on its innards is conjecture. The only thing that Neuman said is that they were working full steam on the console version. My own conjecture, at that time, is that they work marginally on the PC version except for the WU. Look at the last SU release notes.

 We are ready to accompany the product and accept its imperfections if we see real progresses : in the simulation (flight, aircraft motoring, avionics), in methodology (quality control of the patches, no saying that a problem is solved when it is not, no downgrade of the product as a palliative to something wrong ). We don’t. Except for the WU, the product core is not better than it was at release and in some regards it is worse.

I do like the product a lot, even as is,  I do not like how it is managed at all by MS because I see how much better it could be and because it puts in question its perennity on the long run. 

I just wonder what kind of testing they do if any?

my understanding (not being a Software Engineer myself) is Regression testing should be carried out to see what’s broken after an update is implemented.

that way you soon get to see what works and what doesn’t. Clearly this is not what Asobo does. They add code, then ship it straight out, we then do the regression testing. Great! I’ve racked up quite a good few hours of my expensive time. Who do I bill?

joking aside, I love the new sim and will never go back to P3D, but guys.... come on! Pleeeese...

This sim reminds me of a car I had in the 80s. A Jeep Cherokee. A great and iconic car. My wife and I loved it. But it was in the repair shop way too often. An abysmal quality control at manufacturing does that to a car. Or a sim 😏.

 

 

Edited March 17, 20215 yr by Dominique_K

15 hours ago, EmaRacing said:

22 hours ago, mickatmian said:

I definitely did not pay £110 to be a beta tester!

MIck

and yet here you are

Actually I'm not, I just popped in to see if the latest update was an improvement but have now gone back to X-plane. 

Why are updates mandatory? in the main, for me at least, they almost always have an adverse effect on my previously working sim.

Mick

1 hour ago, mickatmian said:

 

Why are updates mandatory?  

It comes with the territory, I suppose. Difficult to imagine a streaming distribution without having all the clients at the same level.