2 hours ago, LRBS said:

With all due respect, this is not the case we are discussing, imho it has nothing to do with the reported issue.

There are similarities in that both situations occur when the system is powering up, and both are hard to duplicate for troubleshooting purposes.

In my own case, I run the PMDG 737 about 10 hours per week, (and have been throughout the entire beta 15 process), and have never had the problem.

Nevertheless some users are affected - I’m not saying it is not a real issue. BUT, it can be incredibly difficult for developer to pinpoint the exact cause of such a bug if they can’t duplicate it on their own production systems. It might well be dependent on the specific combination or hardware and software on a particular user’s system, including other add-ons that might be installed.

On my FS computer, I have to disable the FenixBootstrapper.exe process from running when MSFS starts, or I will get stutters when flying PMDG aircraft. Other users may well have no ill effect with the Fenix process running in the background alongside PMDG. 

Mathijs and Jorg from MS are in a dead heat for who can appear the most confused and lost after months of community feedback about a problem and acting surprised about it as if it's the first time hearing about it. 

13 minutes ago, GCBraun said:

Not at home, but I believe the files are before the work folder of each aircraft variant inside the packages folder of MSFS (not on community folder). I’ll be at home tomorrow and could confirm where exactly if needed. 

Thank you. I'll be hitting the road tonight for 3 days and will have my laptop with me so I can work on this. I will definitely try.

25 minutes ago, JRBarrett said:

There are similarities in that both situations occur when the system is powering up, and both are hard to duplicate for troubleshooting purposes.

In my own case, I run the PMDG 737 about 10 hours per week, (and have been throughout the entire beta 15 process), and have never had the problem.

Nevertheless some users are affected - I’m not saying it is not a real issue. BUT, it can be incredibly difficult for developer to pinpoint the exact cause of such a bug if they can’t duplicate it on their own production systems. It might well be dependent on the specific combination or hardware and software on a particular user’s system, including other add-ons that might be installed.

On my FS computer, I have to disable the FenixBootstrapper.exe process from running when MSFS starts, or I will get stutters when flying PMDG aircraft. Other users may well have no ill effect with the Fenix process running in the background alongside PMDG. 

I understand. The problem with them, they advertise of knowing, they do not take into consideration the issue due to the number of how many people see this. I'm not sure what they consider a good number, despite being aware of the problem. They don't even try to troubleshoot; they just hide behind the statement that they can't reproduce the issue on their system. And this is not the first time they've done it. Very tiring their mentality. 

After the disastrous support for the DC6 I will certainly not buy any more of these people's products, especially when reading threads like this one.

I tend to restart sim after each flight . I’ve been doing so pretty much since FSX. if I’m not I usually get intermittent problems, in fact a lot of them . And yes it’s hard to debug something when it’s not happening on your end. 

 I'm pretty sure PMDG eventually will address this issue . So don’t  take the reluctant acknowledgement as absolute dismissal. 

OP please sign your name... oh wait.. 

11 hours ago, StoneDoor said:

Never happened to me before. Since SU15 (yesterday) it happened three times. 

Same to me, after SU15, all times I fly the 737/800, fix it restarting the flight 

"We have never seen this on any of our machines!.

A classic "Kok-ism"!!!!!!!!!!

Just took the PMDG 737 up for a quick spin post Sim Update 15.  My plane was working normally except the yoke was not moving.  I was able to set the auto pilot and engage the AP but again the yoke was frozen.  I don't think the knobs were spinning either!

Will tinker with it in the coming days and see if I can get the yoke working by reloading the aircraft. 

 

Loaded another saved scenario this morning, and had the same "no active screens" problem (and also non functional yoke, although it was centred this time). However, this was the last save that I had made prior to installing SU15, so it could simply be a slight incompatibility between the SU14 save files and the SU15 simulator. We will see what happens with my SU15 saves....

I am having the same issue with the 737 from time to time. Not sure if that was related to SU15 (I am in the Beta). My best guess is that this is some kind of online validation mechanism that is failing - just like the "insert the disk of doom" message of MSFS itself (had that one yestereday). Which doesn't come as a surprise IMHO, MSFS is massively dependent on the Internet and a large part of the MSFS internals use web technology too. Plus, there are so many things in MSFS addons now that also rely on the IP stack (like full blown web servers running inside addons). So it stands to reason (for me, being an "old-er"  programmer) that parts of all that complexity will stand on each other's toes and fail from time to time.

10 hours ago, LRBS said:

They don't even try to troubleshoot; they just hide behind the statement that they can't reproduce the issue on their system.

Reproducing the issue on a development system is the first step in troubleshooting. From my perspective, this sounds like they actually did investigate it, but the problem did not materialize for them. And they were unable to provide a "blind" fix (or in this case at least not one that wouldn't compromise their online copy protection mechanism?). All that they can do is keep an eye on it, hoping that more people will report more detailed data, so that ultimately a pattern emerges that points at a specific piece of code or module. Depending on what kind of issue it is, this can take weeks or even months. Some things you can never figure out (like my own MSFS on which I've never completed a full flight. It always runs into a CTD, has been doing so since the Alpha and on three different devel computers over 4 years. I must assume that MSFS just hates me 🙂).

If it is the online validation failing, that can potentially have any number of reasons, that are unrelated to the sim. Like stolen credentials, shortages on the server providing the clearance, connections troubles.

Edited May 25, 20242 yr by Lorby_SI

11 hours ago, LRBS said:

how many people see this. I'm not sure what they consider a good number

That is actually a very tricky question. The general principle is applied throughout all of software development, it is not specific to PMDG. How you classify an incident report (=light, severe, critical, whatever) in a large part depends on how many of your customers report it - and how many of those customers there actually are. If you have 100000 customers of which three report a problem, that doesn't warrant halting all development and everybody jumping to and trying to figure out what is going on. With that limited number of reports that might not even be possible, it might just be "bad user experience". But if it is 100 or 1000 reports (or if you only have 10 customers), that would be more critical - obviously. 

And of course it depends on the type of software that you make and what kind of environment it runs in. Incident reports for an enterprise level application, running on its own dedicated hardware in a controlled production environment, will be treated differently than those made by people who use end user client software, that runs on a multitude of chaotic conglomerations of hardware, frameworks and OS settings. I sometimes marvel at the fact that our home PCs are still running at all, what with all the stuff that is going on in Windows alone these days, let alone all the apps, drivers, optimizers, helpers, word not allowed tools that are stacked on top of it.

I haven't really touched the PMDG for a few weeks.  The last few flights were marred by freezes on final.  I don't have time for that.  This was on SU14, no beta or additional add-ons.  Just FSLTL and Navigraph.  It's a problem that seems to be tied to the AI traffic, from what I've seen.  I will get a RA from TCAS and it'll freeze shortly thereafter.  Between the ridiculous LNAV behavior, poor ground handling, and now freezes, it's a wonder I don't just uninstall it.  It's gotta be the worst performing aircraft I use.  All the Black Square, Fenix, HJet, A2A, and a couple defaults (Longitude, CJ4) fly so well and bring much more enjoyment, simply because I can complete a flight with minimal or no issue. 

At this point, you gotta be crazy to even want their 777.  How can anyone be expecting a clean product when the 737 is dodgy?  Even if the freezing didn't occur, the pathetic LNAV and ground handling kinda ruins the immersion.  Those are basic aspects of an aircraft. 

12 hours ago, LRBS said:

Thank you. I'll be hitting the road tonight for 3 days and will have my laptop with me so I can work on this. I will definitely try.

The files that need to be deleted are in the AppData/Local/Packages/Microsoft.FlightSimulator_XXXXXX/LocalState/Packages/pmdg-aircraft-73X folder, as seen below:

Deleting those files in red before each sim launch solves the problem for me. Hope it works for you as well.