15 minutes ago, micstatic said:

that is correct.

See, that is my problem, I just don't like having to pre-load apps before the sim, granted there are ways to do that like using XML.

11 minutes ago, micstatic said:

Carlos.  That seems like an unneeded insult.  I have a somewhat complicated home cockpit and custom build my PC's.  I agree with the premise that the UI is horrible.  Just because people can figure out how to use a UI doesn't mean it's a good one...

It was never meant to be "an insult", I used the word "managing", now I can agree on your point if "understand " was used, which does have a different connotation, but ok, point taken.

Edited May 21, 20251 yr by CarlosF

32 minutes ago, CarlosF said:

It may very well be "beyond ridiculous" for you, but for others like me who have no problems managing complicated stuff, it works, it just needs a bit of polish.

Let me ask you, do you even have 2024 installed to backup every single negative comment?

Bob, I can see you in the future bashing FS20xx and praising 2024...LOL...I bet you a dollar that you will.

 

As of now, I see no reason at all to switch to 2024. Not interested in "complicated stuff ". 😉

Edited May 21, 20251 yr by Bobsk8

17 minutes ago, CarlosF said:

It was never meant to be "an insult", I used the word "managing", now I can agree on your point if "understand " was used, which does have a different connotation, but ok, point taken.

I misread. Shame on me 

51 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

As of now, I see no reason at all to switch to 2024.

You'll be fine as long as you don't start dabbling in 2024 as it has a way of sucking you back once you've sampled it sufficiently.  Two months back when I installed 2024 to get acquainted I spent roughly 50:50 time in each sim for that first 5 weeks or so and over time it's morphed into almost 100% 2024.   2020's a great sim so yes, best avoid 2024 lest you be sucked in as you learn it really works well, better performance, better visuals, etc.  Now that I have Fenix, AS CRJs, and even the Asobo 737 Max is quite good.

Yesterday I opened 2020 to reinstall ChasePlane after a total spring cleaning reinstall of Win 11 23H2 and both sims.  I see the shutdown issue persists in 2020 in fact this morning when fiddling w/ CP setup I could not even get to Task Manager to shut it down and had to hit the power button, again.  I'm not sure but it may well have been doing that previously that corrupted the prior Win 11 install necessitating the spring cleaning.  Fortunately I made a clone just in case.

2 hours ago, Bobsk8 said:

Not so with 2024 control setup which is beyond ridiculous. 

And you know this, how?

1 hour ago, Bobsk8 said:

As of now, I see no reason at all to switch to 2024. Not interested in "complicated stuff ". 😉

You killing Bob ! Everything about aviation is literally complicated stuff! You are in wrong hobby! LOL

On 5/19/2025 at 2:18 PM, UrgentSiesta said:

It didn't confuse me at all...

Many (most?) times UI/UX isn't the self-describing, intuitive journey that could be. Sometimes, we have to poke around, experiment, think, and perhaps even RTFM to understand how things work.

I'm always amazed how critical flight simmers are of sim interfaces while simultaneously taking pride in having taken the time & study to learn multiple FMC's with truly arcane UI's...

You seem to be in the minority, so regardless of how you responded to the interface, many others responded differently and found it a bad experience.  Falling back on RTFM, well good luck with that, in my experience with my users, that < 2% … good or bad, it’s a reality I have to accept and code for or else suffer the support consequences.

I’m critical because I’m both a flight simmer and a long time software engineer and manager and company owner.  But I agree older aircraft FMCs have horrible interfaces (heck the entire ATC system is archaic and has caused many deaths, a topic for another day) … but that doesn’t justify one should continue the trend of creating a bad UI for a game/sim.  Like I said before these < slider > are most likely implemented for the XBOX crowd with XBOX controllers (perhaps majority customer base?).  

There should be two designs as the PC and console are VERY different environments and this compromise seems to exist simply to save time/money and not to service both customer types.  Feedback is provided and one hopes the development team listen and respond to their customers.  What may seem “trivial” to some users is a source of frustration for other users … a good UI can alleviate this issue.

Doesn’t mean Asobo will do anything as the PM usually assigns developer task queues. 

2 hours ago, CarlosF said:

It may very well be "beyond ridiculous" for you, but for others like me who have no problems managing complicated stuff, it works, it just needs a bit of polish.

Let me ask you, do you even have 2024 installed to backup every single negative comment?

Bob, I can see you in the future bashing FS20xx and praising 2024...LOL...I bet you a dollar that you will.

 

I've figured out how to use it as well, and I still think it's an appalling UI

And yes I do own 2024

9 minutes ago, CO2Neutral said:

You seem to be in the minority, so regardless of how you responded to the interface, many others responded differently and found it a bad experience.  Falling back on RTFM, well good luck with that, in my experience with my users, that < 2% … good or bad, it’s a reality I have to accept and code for or else suffer the support consequences.

I’m critical because I’m both a flight simmer and a long time software engineer and manager and company owner.  But I agree older aircraft FMCs have horrible interfaces (heck the entire ATC system is archaic and has caused many deaths, a topic for another day) … but that doesn’t justify one should continue the trend of creating a bad UI for a game/sim.  Like I said before these < slider > are most likely implemented for the XBOX crowd with XBOX controllers (perhaps majority customer base?).  

There should be two designs as the PC and console are VERY different environments and this compromise seems to exist simply to save time/money and not to service both customer types.  Feedback is provided and one hopes the development team listen and respond to their customers.  What may seem “trivial” to some users is a source of frustration for other users … a good UI can alleviate this issue.

Doesn’t mean Asobo will do anything as the PM usually assigns developer task queues. 

justifying terrible modern day game design on the basis that aviation technology, which has to function and be supported for like 30 years after it goes into service, is also terrible.....we're through the looking glass now 😆

52 minutes ago, CO2Neutral said:

There should be two designs as the PC and console are VERY different environments and this compromise seems to exist simply to save time/money and not to service both customer types...

A bit like IniBuilds with their "couldn't give a word not allowed about non PG users" philosophy. Oh, and the "MSFS 2024 only" decision. Nice one, guys

Edited May 21, 20251 yr by Christopher Low

1 hour ago, sd_flyer said:

You killing Bob ! Everything about aviation is literally complicated stuff! You are in wrong hobby! LOL

Not for me, but I have been doing this aviation stuff for almost a half century. 

1 minute ago, Bobsk8 said:

Not for me, but I have been doing this aviation stuff for almost a half century. 

And yet you are complaining! LOL

Just now, sd_flyer said:

And yet you are complaining! LOL

Not complaining, but you are, trying to defend a UI that is bad. 

6 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Not complaining, but you are, trying to defend a UI that is bad. 

I'm no trying to defend UI! But it took me few days to get to use to it. In contrast when switched from DOS to Windows 3.1 it took me forever ! LOL