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Sebjo89

PMDG, Flight sim labs or IEXG?

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Hi,

 

I need your help deciding.

 

At the moment I both have FSX Steam Edition and Xplane 10/11 (My main sim). Might buy Prepar3d soon.

 

What I wonder is the which aircraft is "best," or top of the list between PMDGs 737/777, FSL A320 X or IEXG 737. These are among the most advanced and well developed as you already know.

 

My options:

 

1. Buy A320-X for FSX Steam edition and just fly, wait for Prepar3d V4 to release and buy upgrade A320-X for P3D.

2. Buy PMDGs 737 for FSX Steam edition and just fly.

3. Buy PMDGs 777 for FSX and just fly.

4. Buy IEXG 737 Classic for X-plane 10/11 and just fly.

5. Wait for PMDG to port their aircrafts for X-plane 11.

 

 

________________

Sebastian Björk

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Depends on what you like more than anything else. Ask yourself these questions...

 

Do you like long or short/medium flights? If long, you'll be wanting the Triple Seven, if short/medium, a 737 or the A320.

 

Next, do you like to hand fly the thing, or do you like to program the living daylights out of an FMC and fly most of the flight on LNAV and VNAV? If you like hand flying, then a 737 is more suited to that than the A320. The Triple Seven probably offers opportunities for both, possibly erring on the side of automated flight a little.

 

Next, do you want something that is all sorted, or something that might still be an early iteration, or at least not finalised in terms of optimisation? Clearly, the PMDG 737 NG is going to be the most trouble free in that regard, since it's been out the longest and had pretty much any trouble ironed out.

 

Next, how obsessed are you with realism and technical simulation of everything? If the answer is that you are a full on 'nerd' where that sort of thing is concerned, then there is little doubt that the FSL A320 is the most nerdy, ultra-realistic simulation of an airliner to date, although that doesn't mean that the other choices are far behind, and much of that attraction will depend upon whether you like to simulate normal operations or whether you like to simulate systems failures. Also consider the learning curves too. These days I think most simmers who've flown plenty of airliners in their sims will have no problem cranking up a 737 or 777, but a realistic simulation of the A320 may require a bit more study on your part.

 

There are some other simulated airlinrs you didn't list which also fall into that category, for example, the iFly 737 NG is more or less on par with the PMDG 737 NG in most respects, sure the PMDG one has a HUD which fully simulates correct collimated parallax, but the HUD on the iFly 737 is still pretty good despite not doing that, and if price is a consideration, then the iFly 737 is not only cheaper, but also includes the full range of NG models, whereas the PMDG one requires you to buy the expansion to get the entire range of jets. This might have a bearing on flexibility if you like the odd long haul flight, since you may want the 737-900ER, which comes very close to the B757 in capabilities albeit with a smaller passenger load owing to the rules on how many seats you can have on a commercial aircraft for a given number of emergency exits.

 

Asking youreslf these question may suggest you also consider a few other ones too, for example the SimCheck A300 is an Airbus, but with a more 'Boeing' feel to how it is operated, so again it offers a variety of flying and flexibility where range is concerned. The iFly 747 is good for very long haul and cheaper than the PMDG 747, whereas the newer PMDG 747 is faily close to release and will doubtless be extremely impressive, with doubtless more system simulation than the iFly 747 has if you wanted to simulate abnormal operations. Then you've also got some decent short haul options too, in things like the Dash 8 from Majestic, which comes in two flavours (pilot and pro editions), although actually the pro edition is still not that expensive in comparison to some of the other study sims out there (i.e. it's comparable to the cost of the iFly 737 and is less than half the cost of the FSL A320), so that's a lot of bang for your bucks if you like turboprops and regional flying, which by definition is often more challenging, since for one thing you'll be at 18,000-24,000 feet and so icing conditions, rough weather and a lot of IMC in the cruise is more likely.

 

Then you  might also consider things like ATC, weather simulation, airport realism, how well the various sims run on your system. There is little doubt that the Steam Version of FSX is going to have more going for it in terms of add-ons than any of the others, for example, there are clearly going to be more payware and freeware airports available for it than for the other sims. Likewise with other utilities and add-ons, at least generally speaking. but on the other hand, there's a good chance X-Plane will have better FPS than either FSX-SE or P3D.

 

In short, and cost aside, which one will you get the most joy out of when you think about the kind of simulated flights you like to make?

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there is little doubt that the FSL A320 is the most nerdy, ultra-realistic simulation of an airliner to date

 

I put my money on the IEXG 737 Classic for X-plane :)

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Having more fun now with XP/IEXG than with the P3D/PMDG 737 NG I was flying before.

Not have to worry about VAS makes a big difference. And I like to use photo-scenery... Don´t know how to do that in P3D.

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My choice of best aircrafts was always simple - does it have FS2Crew or not? (and I know it is a bit different approach than others)

 

That way I made my own list of best immersion-wise aircrafts.

 

1. Q400 (great FS2Crew, fantastic external flight model which some RW pilots state is best in class, 125hz controls)

2. NGX (because it has amazing FS2Crew reboot + failure modeling within FS2Crew, both voice controlled and is, itself a very complex and great to handfly aircraft)

3. Triple 7

4. Aerosoft A320

 

Normally, if FSL would have SDK released and FS2Crew ready I would say they would fall somewhere on Triple 7 level (and if it will have an emergency model, NGX level). I didn't fly it but I read enough to know it's absolutely amazing aircraft. I just have one rule - don't buy planes which you can't fly with voice controlled crew, it's simply killing realism for me.

 

Fortunately, FSL guys already work on SDK!

 

Considering your situation I would not invest a cent in FSX Steam so your best bet if you want to fly now is get FSLabs A320 and when you're ready to go to P3D, do the move and upgrade license, or get P3DV3 with NGX license and count on PMDG to upgrade to 64 bit for free as they mentioned in one of forum posts.

 

When it comes to XP I can't say anything as I don't own it. What I know is it lacks the amount of addons P3D has, for that reason I didn't make a move (also, again, no voice controlled crew and as amazing IXEG looks, flying it by yourself is weird idea for me). So in general treat me as biased towards P3D.

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As someone who has the FSLabs A320, the PMDG 737 both for P3D and the IXEG 737 I can say from a pure immersion and sheer fun point of view, in my opinion the IXEG wins hands down. Its not 100% complete yet but  its has been designed by real world 737 pilots who took more than 5 years to release it. The dedication shows in corner of the 737, the visuals, the sounds and the feeling of flight. There is a major update for XP10 coming and once XP11 is released a free update to that which will include the graphical enhancements that XP11 supports

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FS2crew is a great addon for P3D!

I think I will buy MCE to get something like it for XP.

 

The copilot in Pilot2ATC handles the radio and almost all ATC communications for me now... Works perfect and results in a more reasonable workload for the pilot flying (me).

 

Agree with Jason: There is something special with IXEG. The sounds, the shaking and vibrations, the feeling of flight... Very high immersion-factor!

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Depends on what you like more than anything else. Ask yourself these questions...

 

Do you like long or short/medium flights? If long, you'll be wanting the Triple Seven, if short/medium, a 737 or the A320.

 

Next, do you like to hand fly the thing, or do you like to program the living daylights out of an FMC and fly most of the flight on LNAV and VNAV? If you like hand flying, then a 737 is more suited to that than the A320. The Triple Seven probably offers opportunities for both, possibly erring on the side of automated flight a little.

 

Next, do you want something that is all sorted, or something that might still be an early iteration, or at least not finalised in terms of optimisation? Clearly, the PMDG 737 NG is going to be the most trouble free in that regard, since it's been out the longest and had pretty much any trouble ironed out.

 

Next, how obsessed are you with realism and technical simulation of everything? If the answer is that you are a full on 'nerd' where that sort of thing is concerned, then there is little doubt that the FSL A320 is the most nerdy, ultra-realistic simulation of an airliner to date, although that doesn't mean that the other choices are far behind, and much of that attraction will depend upon whether you like to simulate normal operations or whether you like to simulate systems failures. Also consider the learning curves too. These days I think most simmers who've flown plenty of airliners in their sims will have no problem cranking up a 737 or 777, but a realistic simulation of the A320 may require a bit more study on your part.

 

There are some other simulated airlinrs you didn't list which also fall into that category, for example, the iFly 737 NG is more or less on par with the PMDG 737 NG in most respects, sure the PMDG one has a HUD which fully simulates correct collimated parallax, but the HUD on the iFly 737 is still pretty good despite not doing that, and if price is a consideration, then the iFly 737 is not only cheaper, but also includes the full range of NG models, whereas the PMDG one requires you to buy the expansion to get the entire range of jets. This might have a bearing on flexibility if you like the odd long haul flight, since you may want the 737-900ER, which comes very close to the B757 in capabilities albeit with a smaller passenger load owing to the rules on how many seats you can have on a commercial aircraft for a given number of emergency exits.

 

Asking youreslf these question may suggest you also consider a few other ones too, for example the SimCheck A300 is an Airbus, but with a more 'Boeing' feel to how it is operated, so again it offers a variety of flying and flexibility where range is concerned. The iFly 747 is good for very long haul and cheaper than the PMDG 747, whereas the newer PMDG 747 is faily close to release and will doubtless be extremely impressive, with doubtless more system simulation than the iFly 747 has if you wanted to simulate abnormal operations. Then you've also got some decent short haul options too, in things like the Dash 8 from Majestic, which comes in two flavours (pilot and pro editions), although actually the pro edition is still not that expensive in comparison to some of the other study sims out there (i.e. it's comparable to the cost of the iFly 737 and is less than half the cost of the FSL A320), so that's a lot of bang for your bucks if you like turboprops and regional flying, which by definition is often more challenging, since for one thing you'll be at 18,000-24,000 feet and so icing conditions, rough weather and a lot of IMC in the cruise is more likely.

 

Then you  might also consider things like ATC, weather simulation, airport realism, how well the various sims run on your system. There is little doubt that the Steam Version of FSX is going to have more going for it in terms of add-ons than any of the others, for example, there are clearly going to be more payware and freeware airports available for it than for the other sims. Likewise with other utilities and add-ons, at least generally speaking. but on the other hand, there's a good chance X-Plane will have better FPS than either FSX-SE or P3D.

 

In short, and cost aside, which one will you get the most joy out of when you think about the kind of simulated flights you like to make?

 

Thanks Chock for the advices!

 

I like long flight more then short, so the PMDG 777 would in that case be a good choice.

Handflying, not so much. The automated stuff is more to my liking.

 

I do enjoy study level aircrafts more, because it gives a challenge and better training, I think. So the A320 or the IEXG 737 is then the choice in that case. But the PMDGs I learned thru forums and videos is tested and granted by real Boeings pilots and therefore study level too,

but I will wait for pmdgs to (eventually) release their aircrafts for X-plane and buy it then.

 

It all comes down to which platform i use the most, and that is X-plane. So the choice would then be IEXG 737. 

 
But I think that the FSL A320 will be more fun in the long term, because it´s a newer plane and most airliners uses it. So maybe I buy it for FSX Steam and then upgrade it for P3D v4 (hoping V4 will be in same visuals as XP 11).

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Having used the IXEG i'm reluctant to buy the FSlabs a320 or any PMDG bird because i'm afraid the limited flight dynamics of P3D are going to disappoint.

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FSL A320, and maybe the upcoming PMDG 744 v3

 

For me always on FSX:SE, until P3D goes P4D or 64 bit :-) whichever represents more bits .....

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IXEG for sure, can't beat the total immersion factor this bird provides, awesome attention to detail, once you hear the engines rev up, you are hooked.

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IXEG is fantastic, love it. It still is missing a few small things to really make it perfect, but luckily they are being addressed.

 

All the PMDG stuff is great, if you haven't tried any of them, there simply isn't a wrong choice in their stable.  If you like long haul and are happy with FSX for the foreseeable future, buy the brand new 747.  Sadly, they don't offer a FSX-> P3D upgrade path, and buying both P3D and the 747 is a quite expensive purchase. 

 

For 737, I'd go IXEG over PMDG NG.  Both are awesome, but somehow the IXEG just "feels" better and more alive when flying.

 

I haven't tried the FSL A320, and honestly probably won't.  I bought their Concorde P3D version and struggled with VAS issues that were documented here, and honestly I just stopped flying her.  Plus, I just struggle to pay their asking price when the IXEG is less than half the price simply on principle.

 

Not to add another kink in your dilemma, but I'm also loving the FlightFactor 757v2.  Great aircraft, and can do long or short haul.  I don't want to go too far into XP territory here, but check it out too if you haven't.  Lots of awesome features and details, and a blast to fly.

 

Good luck!

 

TL:DR - Buy the PMDG 747 or IXEG is my vote.  Also consider the FF757v2.

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Good as the IXEG is (apparently) the big problem is that Xplane has a hard time providing a well rounded Airline flying environment, by that I mean good ATC, Ai ect. Yes i know its possible to set up some convincing Ai in Xplane but it's far from being easy, in other words more work than most folk want to go through.

The available ATC also leaves a lot to be desired and that's being kind..

 

So if you are happy flying single pilot through empty sky's with no ATC then it may be a good choice, but for a more immersive airline environment you are probably better sticking to FSX/P3D.

 

NGX would always be my choice.

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IXEG 737 by a long shot. And you'll be on a platform with a future.

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I own the IXEG and its great but would buy NGX in a minute - if it goes XP some day hope they dont forget the VC rain - its pretty sweet in the IXEG

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The biggest problem with the PMDG 777 and NGX is the totally unrealistic asymmetric thrust physics...

 

When you operate on single engine, on any of these aircraft, with YD and all FBW suposedly turned off in the 777 you have absolutely no feel of an engine failure regarding the yawing and rolling moments that would affect their real world counterparts ... I  hope they can make it more realistic with the 7474v3...

 

In X-Plane due to the more correct modeling of these aspects of the flight dynamics model, flying the 737 must feel a lot closer to RW under such circumstances.... plus, the pitching moments due to thrust, which again X-Plane does better overall than MSFS.

 

When it comes to detail of systems modelling, the FSLabs A320 has recently set a new Max ...

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The biggest problem with the PMDG 777 and NGX is the totally unrealistic asymmetric thrust physics...

 

Is the FSLabs better in this respect?

 

Marcel

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Is the FSLabs better in this respect?

 

Marcel

 

I don't know yet, but I was told it is indeed. Actually a user who is also a rw airbus driver told me it was very very truth to real in this particular respect.

Of course the A320 is usually operated in a FBW mode that softens the effects of an engine failure even under critical situations, but the systems can be disengaged ... and also in the FSLabs A320 this can be done, and then a noticeable difference in handling under asymmetric thrust is evident, as I was told.

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Ok thanks Jose. 

This helps me in deciding whether to buy or not.

 

Marcel

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Remember FSX (whatever vesion) has the eyepoint bug. That's a killer for me, especially on large aircraft. It's been corrected since P3D 3.2, when I moved from the old FSX to P3D, and will never come back.

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Remember FSX (whatever vesion) has the eyepoint bug. That's a killer for me, especially on large aircraft. It's been corrected since P3D 3.2, when I moved from the old FSX to P3D, and will never come back.

 

Can you describe - wasn't aware of it ?

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Good as the IXEG is (apparently) the big problem is that Xplane has a hard time providing a well rounded Airline flying environment, by that I mean good ATC, Ai ect. Yes i know its possible to set up some convincing Ai in Xplane but it's far from being easy, in other words more work than most folk want to go through.

The available ATC also leaves a lot to be desired and that's being kind..

 

So if you are happy flying single pilot through empty sky's with no ATC then it may be a good choice, but for a more immersive airline environment you are probably better sticking to FSX/P3D.

 

NGX would always be my choice.

 

What if you fly online? Much more immersive than any ATC/AI software.

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What if you fly online? Much more immersive than any ATC/AI software.

 

Not as immersive on Xplane as it is on FSX/P3D at least on Vatsim due to XSquawkbox's inability to correctly model match more than 10 aircraft and even those will not show the correct liveries.

On P3D vPilot picks up all of the Mytraffic X aircraft on my system and shows the correct models and liveries for other players on the network.

There is really not a lot wrong with Xplane but the experience is always let down by the supporting software.

Vatsim is simply better on FSX/P3D

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