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Roadburner426

PMDG Announced Global Flight Operations at FSE 2018

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8 hours ago, scandinavian13 said:

Man, and some people wonder why we don’t tell you all things all the time.

”Hey! Here’s this thing we think you might like that integrates into all of our stuff, other developers’ planes, and brings a bunch of additional features to our entire catalog!” (All while not affecting the aircraft development cycle, mind you. So glad people know how our internal teams operate to the degree they know if one project was developed at the sacrifice of something they’d be more interested in.)

”Why doesn’t PMDG update us?”

This. All of this.

...and no. You can’t teleport airplanes. You won’t need to, but I’m guessing that by the nature of the posts here, it doesn’t seem that those concerned are concerned about being concerned...

I think the issue here is that it takes PMDG upto 3 years to produce an outstanding simulation of an aircraft so when it is mentioned that you have a new product line that has been in the works "on and off' for 10 years it gets the minds of us customers into a frenzy with the mindset of "wow, what can PMDG be working on that has taken so long?"...and so RSR makes the presentation and for those that don't really understand what it is being proposed or the time it takes to develop this product the negative or less than satisfied response are sent in.

 

I guess the question for PMDG, is the subsequent sales going to justify the expense and for us simmers, is the product and it's features considered worth the purchase and will we gain enjoyment in using it.

Edited by YMMB

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As with some payware scenery developers, et al, who offer demos before you choose to purchase, this new product might be a good candidate to be first offered as a demo?    But I seriously doubt PMDG would ever entertain that idea.  Plus, I think it may be incorporated into an updated Operations Center.   

 

 

                                                                        Jerry Neidich

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To all the "Angry folks" Don't buy it if its not worth it  for you. But stop being a winging jerk. Y'all are really annoying cause you sound like entitled idiots.  We are not entitled to anything..  I too wanted something else.. Multi PC set up where I could build a better cockpit. 

Edited by Manny
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Manny

Beta tester for SIMStarter 

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I am signing out a 737 and taking it to the South Pole.   I plan to leave it there and taking a dog sled home.  I will let Kyle fly it back.

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Paul Gugliotta

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16 minutes ago, Manny said:

To all the "Angry folks" Don't buy it if its not worth it  for you. But stop being a winging jerk. Y'all are really annoying.

I really don't think too many people are "angry", simply because they don't share your view. I don't know whether it would be "for me", and I'm not sure I'd want to invest in it to find it wasn't.

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David Porrett

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3 hours ago, kevinh said:

I think this will be too restricting for VA flyers constrained by VA rules. They will need an airframe from their airline’s fleet available to book at an airport that carrier flies from. This will narrow their choice of flight considerably. Especially if there are several VAs simulating that airline.

Some VAs require real time flights so an airframe has to be available at the right place and time.

Think of it not as teleporting but as a repositioning flight that wasn’t recorded. 

RSR didn't really have time to go into all of the protections and details, but - while people seem to be drawing their own conclusions, and assuming we never thought about all kinds of things - we've taken care of this. To be honest, I didn't want to do what we did to handle this, but RSR and the rest of the team thought it would be more useful for VAs to do it in the way we've set it up, so that's how we've set it up. He actually referenced it at one point in the speech, but didn't go into detail, for the sake of time.

The VA aspect is managed, and planes won't be teleporting.

4 hours ago, kingm56 said:

You made several inferences with your points, Anders.  Please point to the part of my post where I stated consumer voices should be denied or that only negative comments should be welcomed?  In point of fact, I stated feedback, in any form (positive or negative), should be welcomed.  Plus, I reject your definition of 'winning.'  Just because you don't agree with a comment doesn't make it winning, disrespectful and/or unnecessary.  

"If you can't tolerate critics, don't do anything new or interesting" - Jeff Bazos, CEO, Amazon

There's a very big difference between a critic, and someone who is simply out there to misrepresent things and stir up drama. A critic is reasoned. The 'joker' type is the type in here saying "this product is glorified [x]," or "they stole this idea from [y]," when the reality is vastly different. An Aerowinx sim had a similar feature back in the day? Yes, sure...but it wasn't in FSX, or P3D. The real plane has it too, so...what's the point trying to be made here? We aren't saying we invented a new, never-before-seen widget. We said we're bringing some pretty awesome things into the arena in which we operate. FSEconomy is similar in its tracking of hours (and maybe persistence/location, or something - people never actually specified, because again...just here to start fires instead of offer actual criticism)? Great. That's one of the smallest functions of this simulation. This other site does mapping? Yes, I know. I used VATAWARE and Vattastic back when they were super basic (and before one of those went down and then got re-branded). Tons of other places do it, too. It's simply a window into the world that we've created.

People are conveniently forgetting, or simply not asking for clarification and assuming, all of the other things like ACARS and CPDLC, persistence (managed, and automatic, by the way - you load the plane and it's already how it needs to be - no loading of panel states, setting up the flight, or anything), third party integration (airplanes, weather engines, planners), and so on.

I saw someone else mention that they don't want to deal with the "extra" time that this would cause. Honestly, in some ways, I think this would end up saving people a lot of time. Need weather? ACARS your METAR/TAF. Need to plan your flight as part of checking the plane out? Anyone notice the SimBrief credentials on the one screenshot? Yes, we haven't given you all, all the details yet, but again...there's critical, and then there's what a lot of what we're seeing here: assumptions in order to stir up rage. I welcome criticism. I actually do. I won't stand for facts being ignored. Sorry.

 

...and it's Bezos, btw...if we're being critical.

49 minutes ago, paulyg123 said:

I am signing out a 737 and taking it to the South Pole.   I plan to leave it there and taking a dog sled home.  I will let Kyle fly it back.

You're welcome to spend the time. I'd highly suggest not trying to game, or grief the system, however.

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Kyle Rodgers

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Hello guys when is the PMDG update gonna come online and how do we download it? Really excited for the update.

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4 hours ago, DavidP said:

I really don't think too many people are "angry", simply because they don't share your view. I don't know whether it would be "for me", and I'm not sure I'd want to invest in it to find it wasn't.

This has nothing to do with "people don't share you view".

"Don't get angry or annoyed, just because I/they don't share your view...!"
Why are we always returning to that argument?! Again, no one is restricting anyone's ability to express their opinion! I don't mind constructed criticism, but in this case, there's a long way between the posts, which fulfills this criteria. 
Criticism and well-thought arguments are the core of any debate, which I don't mind at all. In fact, I condone it and it's needed - and it's a much needed activity in here. Most posts, which are negative (not critical) and are simply nay-sayers, without any constructed argument. It's either just negative or nay-sayers - or it's simply about spreading and distributing false and undocumented, made-up facts about this software. Or a combination of both.

As far as I can see, this has nothing to do with someone being angry, because one doesn't share the view of the another. Personally I get angry and disappointed, when reading through these threads and other forum/comment sections, because it mainly consists of people who sound whining and angry, just because an announced software isn't what they expected or because it doesn't do, look or sound the way that they want it to be! Furthermore, they go on, and spread undocumented and personal assumptions about what this software does and don't. 

Why not just try the software - and make up your mind then?

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Best regards,
--Anders Bermann--
____________________
Scandinavian VA

Pilot-ID: SAS2471

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43 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

As far as I can see, this has nothing to do with someone being angry, because one doesn't share the view of the another.

Manny called out people as being "angry folks" to which David replied.

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The only way this sorts itself out, is an actual detailed featured list and a video demonstration of what it actually does and how it benefits the average simmer.  Most of us have been simming for years , even decades, yet this type of thing hasnt been seen or used to any extent whatsoever (other than a limited standalone FSeconomy) and unless your a real world pilot for an airliner, theres not much knowledge to use these tools at all. Its never been implemented,and ACARS at best with VAs is very rudimentary at best. In my lead ramp agent  days, I saw its use quickly while giving a loadsheet to the captain. Thats the only experience I have with it and nothing more despite simming for 30 years now. The negativity is not justified nor does it show respect for the project. So It still comes down to a lack of understanding of how these tools and functions work with an airliner pilot. How can we be excited about  it when theres such a disconnect about its purpose as a simmer? Need something to relate to.... like the upcoming 748. Now that was something to be excited about because we could relate to it. 

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Dave Seminchuk  CYVR LSZH 

http://f9ixu0-2.png
 

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48 minutes ago, HighTowers said:

The only way this sorts itself out, is an actual detailed featured list and a video demonstration of what it actually does and how it benefits the average simmer. 

Yes that would be a good managment.
Most of the (me known) listed feature (except ACARS and Livery Manager) already exist in some Freeware project(Flytheworld or FSE).
Where is the businesscase for PMDG?
Who will pay for software which you can use (in parts) for free.

Maybe its really a burner with a unique selling point. But i can`t see this.

A good project management would release some smaple or demonstration Video`s in time with the announcement.
But i can`t find any information here or at Youtube...

 

Edited by McFly08151

Detlef Krüger

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3 hours ago, Anders Bermann said:

This has nothing to do with "people don't share you view".

"Don't get angry or annoyed, just because I/they don't share your view...!"
Why are we always returning to that argument?! Again, no one is restricting anyone's ability to express their opinion! I don't mind constructed criticism, but in this case, there's a long way between the posts, which fulfills this criteria. 
Criticism and well-thought arguments are the core of any debate, which I don't mind at all. In fact, I condone it and it's needed - and it's a much needed activity in here. Most posts, which are negative (not critical) and are simply nay-sayers, without any constructed argument. It's either just negative or nay-sayers - or it's simply about spreading and distributing false and undocumented, made-up facts about this software. Or a combination of both.

As far as I can see, this has nothing to do with someone being angry, because one doesn't share the view of the another. Personally I get angry and disappointed, when reading through these threads and other forum/comment sections, because it mainly consists of people who sound whining and angry, just because an announced software isn't what they expected or because it doesn't do, look or sound the way that they want it to be! Furthermore, they go on, and spread undocumented and personal assumptions about what this software does and don't. 

Why not just try the software - and make up your mind then?

Glad you got that off your chest. I hope you feel better now.


David Porrett

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My bet is many folks will see the list of features and demo videos after its released, then get curious buy it and like it.

Hope it’s got MELs and CDLs.

IM

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9 hours ago, scandinavian13 said:

 I'd highly suggest not trying to game, or grief the system, however.

So, clearly there will be people trying this on just for laughs - and because trolls are a fact of life in this community.  What controls will be in place to expel people from the system who leave aircraft in completely ridiculous places repeatedly or completely, and unreasonably  mis-configure the aircraft.

If this system is all about realism, then it is also realistic to revoke or suspend usage for unreasonable operations.

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Just reading through this and....wow, never thought people would get so wound up about a flightsim addon/tool. Nobody is forcing you to buy it or use it. Like it? Good. Don't like it? Fine too. Also, why should anyone take any of this personal? It has already reached some sort of "religious" level. Just because it's different from what we've used to seing from PMDG doesn't mean it won't be good. Like come on, it's currently only in alpha....

Now, I have two questions for the PMDG devs: Will customers who own the 747, 777 etc. get basic ACARS functions such as METAR/TAF and arrival ATIS info for free? Will PDC/CPDLC work via the MFD/ECL interface as it should in the real airplane? And will the DC-6 cover these "persistent" state-sharing options as well? That one would be really fun to share with your friends, since it has to be flown properly and taken good care of (maintained properly). And while we're at it, doesnt all this data-sharing lay a good foundation for some sort of shared cockpit? 


 

With kind regards, Bogdan Misko.

 

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