4 hours ago, domkle said:

<sigh> I swore to myself I wouldn't intervene anymore in such a thread but I am weak.

It is a bell curve. 

On one side a tiny minority of positive hysterics  who see the new sim as some kind of messiah of flight simulation and wishing the demise of all existing sims and the developers who contributed to the hobby.   >>> Ignore user list

On the other side, a tiny minority of negative hysterics who cannot really make a difference between firing their beloved sim and going to church (for them the FS messiah is already here) plus those who are naturally bitter/unpleasant anyway whatever the topic. >>> Ignore user list  

In between, a vast majority of decent simmers, glad for what we have now, eagerly looking forward to what the new sim will bring to the table and grateful that MS and Asobo are so open so long in advance, during the design of the sim.

I simplify, of course, but I am not far from the truth. 

 

 

 

Indeed. And as an addition to that:

The number and "loudness" of posts corresponding to that bell curve forms an inverted bell curve, in the sense that those tiny minorities on both sides post a lot and mostly in an inflammatory or missionary way, where as the vast majority of decent simmers rarely or never post.

Unfortunately that makes avsim an unfriendly place sometimes.

 

Fortunately there is the "ignore user" function. By the way you don't really need the avsim ignore user list, you can just use your own brain for that and just silently shrug off these inflammatory posts ... 😉

 

• New products, improved products, innovative products, made possible by the capabilities offered by this new platform.
• A substantial increase of the flight sim user base.
• Talented existing and new individuals, teams, studios, companies competing for a share of the pie.

The above points are common sense and obvious to the vast majority but deserve to be reiterated.

People + Internet = https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

At the risk of stating the obvious or having this post deleted like a similar one was earlier this year, P3D and the new MSFS aren't even for the same markets. P3D is for professional training use only as per the licence conditions and the MSFS is for entertainment use only. That being the case, how can any user of one or the other be upset at the other's existence? For my own part, since I do not qualify to use P3D, I am over the moon that there is a new flight sim coming that I will legally be able to use! And anyone using P3D is of course more than welcome to switch to the new MSFS or indeed use both.

37 minutes ago, RALF9636 said:

I 

Unfortunately that makes avsim an unfriendly place sometimes.

 By the way you don't really need the avsim ignore user list, you can just use your own brain for that and just silently shrug off these inflammatory posts ... 

 

You don't need it but it makes reading the forum a more serene experience. I am  not speaking of the people with whom I disagree but of the narrow-minded, repetitive or unpleasant posters. Ostrich wisdom, the warm feeling of having your head in the sand. 

it will change very soon

23 minutes ago, JonP01 said:

At the risk of stating the obvious or having this post deleted like a similar one was earlier this year, P3D and the new MSFS aren't even for the same markets. P3D is for professional training use only as per the licence conditions and the MSFS is for entertainment use only. That being the case, how can any user of one or the other be upset at the other's existence? For my own part, since I do not qualify to use P3D, I am over the moon that there is a new flight sim coming that I will legally be able to use! And anyone using P3D is of course more than welcome to switch to the new MSFS or indeed use both.

Massive facepalm

12 hours ago, Scottoest said:

Is it just me, or does there seem to be a lot of salt flying around, since the announcement of MSFS?  I've spent some time perusing reactions to MSFS on both other areas of this website, as well as forums for various 3PDs like FSLabs, PMDG, Orbx, etc.  I've noticed a couple of things:

1) A lot of either dismissiveness or outright hostility to MSFS - ranging from the predictable stuff (ie. "it'll be a game, not a sim", "remember MS Flight?"), to more nebulous hostility that seems to stem from the perceived threat it poses to sims like P3D and XP (I guess?).

2) A weird backlash to some third party add-on developers.

As a relative newcomer to the FS community, I guess I just never realized it was so factional?

A great observation, and complete agreement.

11 hours ago, F737NG said:

Part of the backlash against MSFS seems to originate from a fear of change and the fact that hundreds (if not thousands for some) of £/$/€ that have been spent on 'prettying-up' the current gen sims are all about to be rendered very old and very quickly. Something that costs (at a guess) $60, is going to blow away something that needs $'00s to look vaguely acceptable in 2019.

Tremendously well said,and probably at the heart of the subject...

2 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

Is that any different to basing your "entire financial existence" on selling cakes and jam doughnuts in the local bakery, or mice and keyboards at Currys PC World? It is also worth remembering that those same "trees and water textures" were gratefully received by the flight simulation community until something bigger and shinier (and, dare I say it.....more seductive) appeared.

To be honest, I think the more appropriate comparison would be buggy whip manufacturers when the first motorized cars first appeared. 

Ah the angst of going from the age of props to jets.  

 

For this armchair senior, the new sim will wake up the brain and teach new reactions to flight dynamics.  I am likely a first day buyer and look forward to the new sim as much as any new aircraft, airport for scenery for P3D or FSX in the years past.
 

There is no doubt I will purchase this new MS sim whatever they name it:

But there is almost no completely new product out there in any industry, (esp. as complicated as this software will be) that does not have inherent bugs.  So I'll probably bind my time and give the bugs a chance to show themselves before I buy it...  

10 hours ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

Developers kept the MS platform alive and their/our rewards was a PR campaign that took us all by surprise ... 6 months later and still nothing delivered.  Timing is key.

So MS was supposed to design their campaign in a way to "reward" third party developers and make them happy???  How else would they have gone about this?? Things happen every day in the business world where companies get caught off guard by some new product or tech, why should this be any different?? Oddly enough, the very few developers I have seen that are repeatedly stating this are new P3D developers that have released maybe one or zero products and then claiming they have kept flight simming alive all these years!!🙄

 

Edited December 1, 20196 yr by Flic1

1 hour ago, ganter said:

Wait, it's going to be free?

sigh, i'm sure he meant something else with the word "gift"

for me FS2020 is a gift too, even i have to pay for it, its almost like "the second coming" 😁

I think part of the issue is that so many people, like myself are fed up with incomplete sims and half-working, buggy addons, coupled with developers who string us along for years with teases of major improvements which never really came to fruition.  So, when MSFS showed up, people breathed a huge sigh of relief that someone is listening to the community.  On the other hand, skeptics out there, who have been burned in the past with a lot of hype prior to the release of platforms, have every reason to be concerned that the release of MSFS will produce similar disappointments.

For me, I was with p3d for 3 years, waiting and waiting for environmental programs that promised to enhance weather and the look and feel of the environment to make it more realistic.  Never happened, and the attempts, as well as what we ended up with were laughable at best.  I went over to X-plane earlier this year because at least you can do more with how the sim looks for very little money.  However, X-plane has its own set of limitations that annoy users, and developers have been hesitant to prioritize them, which also frustrated many. 

Why people are loyal to a particular sim is something that I'll never understand.  I've spent an embarrassing fortune on P3D addons, and invested a couple of hundred dollars in X-plane, and both are seriously lacking in many ways.  Maybe it's part of the addiction or perhaps we've settled for what we can get and spent a lot of time trying to make things work, so MSFS threatens that.  I don't know- I don't want to get into the psychology of any of this. 

What I do know, is that everything that we've seen and heard from MSFS developers goes way beyond hype.  It's been backed up by detailed explanations and walkthroughs.  I really believe this will be the real deal upon release.  Sure there will be teething issues and plenty of problems and annoyances will arise, but I think that those will be fixed and this platform will be constantly updated and improved.  The potential for this to go beyond casual simming can produce huge amounts of revenue for Microsoft because that global ecosystem can provide a basis for all kinds of real-world applications.  So this is a very big deal to them, and will be a great benefit to the end user.

 

Edited December 1, 20196 yr by dal330200