Let's be honest, most developers are running around confused like headless chickens. I mean, a year ago Microsoft was persona non grata in the flight sim community and look at them now.....

See this confused post by Flight1:

http://flight1.com/view.asp?page=fs2020

Tough crowd!

2 hours ago, Milviz said:

The bit about Tigers and Shermans....  It would take 5-6 Shermans to take out one Tiger (Fury was not realistic FYI)....  so yes.. We did win but... the cost... horrors.

Never said Fury was realistic, never mentioned it at all in fact, because it is complete nonsense in almoast every conceivable way. But...

That about it 'taking 5 Shermans to take out a Tiger' is an oft-repeated myth. It too is largely nonsense. It's based on some confirmation bias from a book written many years ago by a guy who wanted to discredit the M4, but it still gets bandied about by people who don't do proper research into things.

Any and every engagement where a Sherman engaged a Tiger, would have involved a minimum of five Shermans, simply because that was the minimum size of any M4 unit deployed. Thus if there was a report of a Tiger in the ETO, typically some tanks would be dispatched to destroy it, and more often than not, that would be a group of five M4 Shermans (one unit leader in a command tank, plus four making up the unit, usually one with a larger gun, aka Firefly or similar). So there was never an instance where they would just send one tank to do such a job, in the same way that they would not scramble one Mustang or one Spitfire to investigate a threat of an enemy aeroplane plane coming over, they'd probably send at least a Squadron with four sections of four aircraft, but that does not mean it would take 16 Mustangs to knock down a bf109 or Fw190, it's just the minimum number in a unit.

The very early Sherman was indeed a design which was liable to brew up before it had wet stowage as a feature and a welded and bolted hull with lots of shot traps, but if you look at the statistics of tank crew survival for the M4, it is not the horror story that myths such as the one above would have us believe.

Edited September 1, 20205 yr by Chock

25 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

Let's be honest, most developers are running around confused like headless chickens. I mean, a year ago Microsoft was persona non grata in the flight sim community and look at them now.....

See this confused post by Flight1:

http://flight1.com/view.asp?page=fs2020

What's confused about this post? And where you get the impression that most developers are running around confused?

48 minutes ago, CJ1045 said:

I can really see Asobo improving the default airplanes to near perfect. Why wouldn't they? It is certainly my expectation. I think there are those on here from other sims that are used to the day one release being it. In the driving sim world the developers are still changing the physics of the cars and the tyre models well over a year after initial release. Same goes for releasing more planes.

CJ

I highly doubt it, why would they? Besides the most critical bugs, there's actually little incentive to start improving them, let alone to near perfection. Casual gamers do not care/notice and more serious simmers are waiting for 3rd party study level add-ons to appear on the marketplace. Therefore there's simply no reason for Asobo to use their resources on "perfecting" default planes.

Edited September 1, 20205 yr by Madscooter

15 minutes ago, DJJose said:

ToughYcrowd!

 

Yes and no. People are dealing with a lot of disappointment, misinformation, and hanging onto wishes, and then you have the incredible range when it comes to age, experience and knowledge.  I get it.  I've been a part of this hobby and community for over 40 years now, and I've seen all of this before several times over. 

I'll say this as a very long time flight simmer.  It's the third party developers who have always pushed out hobby forward from base sims, and that's something everyone should appreciate and be proud of.  It's the individual ingenuity and vision along with a desire to do something new that spurs third party developers into the fray.  Someone wants to stay with default and freeware stuff?  I think that's GREAT!  For those who want more there are third party offerings.  People can do what THEY want.

Now, I'll say this.  People twisted this thread instead of creating their own.  It started off about some very high end aircraft and a wish to see those aircraft right now in MSFS.  Now it's a free for all with some people who have a very narrow view of things and not so much knowledge and understanding of our hobby becoming social media warriors seeking their own version of justice aligned with their very narrow views. That narrow view is fine so long as it's in the confine of what they use our hobby for, not so much when one takes things completely out of context.

Best wishes!

 

9 minutes ago, threegreen said:

What's confused about this post? And where you get the impression that most developers are running around confused?

Quote:

"ow is the best time ever in the world of flight simulation. There are so many options available! From Microsoft Flight Simulator X, Lockheed Martin’s Prepar3D versions 4 and 5, Laminar Research’s X-Plane, and the new FS2020. You can even have all 5 simulators on the same PC and enjoy the best of all worlds! It will take time for our industry to evolve to the FS2020 platform, and Flight1 will take it one step at a time. Please check back often for any news or product releases regarding FS2020."

If you think that those can coexist, without MSFS 2020 severely cannibalizing the user base of the other 4, then I cannot help you. MSFS 2020 is currently "the best of all worlds."

I didn't see anything wrong with @DaveCT2003 's post, nor how it caused his behaviour to be questioned..... because of CONTEXT...

The OP begins by wanting TPDs of study level aircraft to step up within a month of this sim being released which is laughable especially when applied to the context of simmers who have deleted their previous software and are wishing they hadn't, not the simmers who are obviously enjoying the new sim and have posted that they are doing so.

4 hours ago, Chock said:

It reminds me of when people bang on about the Tiger tank being vastly superior to the M4 Sherman in WW2.... at least it was actually on the battlefield fighting,..

...and in the case of Oddball, did he get one by the behind! ?

 

Edited September 1, 20205 yr by HighBypass
a type of donkey...

5 minutes ago, DaveCT2003 said:

 People are dealing with a lot of disappointment, misinformation, and hanging onto wishes,

 

Substitute "many addon developers" for "People" and you're spot on.

37 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

See this confused post by Flight1:

http://flight1.com/view.asp?page=fs2020

There is nothing remotely "confused" in that post. They are simply stating a simple truth. Asobo have not developed the new WASM system to support advanced coding techniques yet...

...which is understandable because they haven't even gotten the basic minimums completed yet!

10 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

Quote:

"ow is the best time ever in the world of flight simulation. There are so many options available! From Microsoft Flight Simulator X, Lockheed Martin’s Prepar3D versions 4 and 5, Laminar Research’s X-Plane, and the new FS2020. You can even have all 5 simulators on the same PC and enjoy the best of all worlds! It will take time for our industry to evolve to the FS2020 platform, and Flight1 will take it one step at a time. Please check back often for any news or product releases regarding FS2020."

If you think that those can coexist, without MSFS 2020 severely cannibalizing the user base of the other 4, then I cannot help you. MSFS 2020 is currently "the best of all worlds."

Look, I love the new sim, I’m not going back, and I probably won’t resume my aborted reinstall of all my p3d products (I aborted the reinstall in July, for the record) But MSFS is not currently the best of ALL worlds.  It is potentially that for sure, but not right now.  If you want to fly complex airliners right now, you will be looking elsewhere.  Nothing at all “confused” about flight 1’s stance. It’s calm and rational, as we all should be.  What else are they going to do?

14 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

..and in the case of Oddball, did he get one by the behind! ?

Always with the negative waves man. 🤣

Actually for anyone interested in that stuff, I'd recommend reading better-researched stuff by writers such as Steven Zaloga. He does much to dispel such myths and describes the most famous of all German Tiger commanders - Michael Wittmann  as 'the hero of all N@zi f@nboys' and quite he rightly points out that most if not all successful tank commanders, like most successful fighter pilots, were 'bushwackers'.

This is not to say Wittmann was not a skilled commander, or that the Tiger was not a formidable opponent, when it worked, but it's worth noting that when Wittman was killed in his Tiger, it was by a Sherman crew, who also destroyed two other Tigers from Wittman's squadron during the same engagement, actually blowing the entire turret off Wittmann's tank, the other Tiger in Wittmann's unit being knocked out by another Sherman from the same unit.

Edited September 1, 20205 yr by Chock

13 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

Substitute "many addon developers" for "People" and you're spot on.

And this is based on a 'confused' statement from one developer that isn't actually confused at all?

42 minutes ago, Madscooter said:

I highly doubt it, why would they? Besides the most critical bugs, there's actually little incentive to start improving them, let alone to near perfection. Casual gamers do not care/notice and more serious simmers are waiting for 3rd party study level add-ons to appear on the marketplace. Therefore there's simply no reason for Asobo to use their resources on "perfecting" default planes.

Think you are exactly the flight simmer i was talking about. The huge number of new people coming the MSFS 2020 will expect the game to be fixed as all their other games are fixed. The community here seems to be living in another world where the main developer does not fix their game. I think MS/Asobo will make the changes.

CJ

I'm not so keen on buying warmed over/ported over FSX/P3D addons, so I say let devs take their time and figure out this sim and how to use it to full advantage. How many years was FSX released before truly native aircraft showed up that took full advantage of the platform?