1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

Do you really think that the vast majority of the PMDG customer base limit themselves to only flying real world types on real world routes?

 

Mostly yes. At least the real world types. I doubt the people that fly the A32NX with Southwest liveries will buy the PMDG 737, so yes, PMDG customers do like to fly at least the real world types. The routes, however, don't matter that much I suppose.

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by Fiorentoni

Deleted.

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by Fiorentoni

22 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

customers to spend their 99 dollar credits

this is going to be a problem methinks…

They aren't forcing anyone with credit to buy the 737-700. Where do you get that idea from? The exact quote from the thread does mention you are able to use it in anyway you want. If you DO NOT want the 737-700 - DO NOT BUY IT. It is really simple. Sure there is going to be quite a bit of a wait for those who just want the 737-800 and I get that. But do read what they have actually mentioned. 

Quote

Those customers who qualified for the program (which ran through NOV/DEC 2019) will auotmatically receive $99.99 in credit toward the purchase of the PMDG 737 for Microsoft Flight Simulator product line. You will be able to use it however you see fit, in any combination of purchases that suits your taste. If you elect to purchase a 737 that costs less than your earned credit, you will retain the additional for a future purchase, no questions asked and all handled automatically at PMDG.com. Our goal is to keep it as simple and straight forward for you as possible. I'll have more details on how to use your credit in a future update as we get closer to actual release.

 

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by Zangoose

33 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

As in the title, this is a blatant cash grab in my opinion.

 

WHAT? People will be forced to buy the 600 variant and are not allowed to wait unil the 800 is released?
Big drama.

Holy ... people, just chill. Take the marketing decisions as they are and try to be patient. Or buy if you can't wait, but do not complain that you have been forced by anyone 🙄

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by guenseli

35 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

I just posted that over at the PMDGs forum:

TITLE: It's a disgrace bringing the -600 as the second package
"As in the title, this is a blatant cash grab in my opinion. Trying to entice former customers to spend their 99 dollar credits on the most irrelevant variants is bad, really bad.
I could have lived with the -700, as it has at least SOME real life meaning (thanks Southwest), but the -600 after that is ridiculous. (The -800 is the actual base airplane, so I cannot see any reason for not bringing it first).
I want to state my clear disappointment with this decision. I have always held PMDG in high regards and defended them over at AVSIM for example (where right now people are even more upset than me), but this will now stop."

Yup. They've definitely turned into a CaptainSim type developer.

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by VBHB

2 minutes ago, VBHB said:

They've definitely turned into a CaptainSim type developer.

 

You mean from your insider knowledge that they sell a simple 737 hull and inside there's a standard 747?
🙄

7 minutes ago, Zangoose said:

They aren't forcing anyone with credit to buy the 737-700. Where do you get that idea from? The exact quote from the thread does mention you are able to use it in anyway you want. If you DO NOT want the 737-700 - DO NOT BUY IT. It is really simple. Sure there is going to be quite a bit of a wait for those who just want the 737-800 and I get that. But do read what they have actually mentioned. 

 

I did not write "force", I wrote "entice". In simple words: They are trying to make as many people buy the variants they would not buy otherwise by releasing them first. I am not saying anyone is forced to this; I just despice the intended manipulation. Look I am not saying PMDG is worse than CaptainSim, I just want to state that I clearly thought differently of them. Color me disenchanted, that's why I wrote what I wrote. Now let's move on.

You people simply gotta STOP this nonsense!!! No one - I repeat - NO ONE is forcing you to buy ANYTHING! I seriously fail to see, how this is a Cash grab??? Really? How? Taking into consideration, what has been said so far from PMDG, it's clearly stated, that you're ABSOLUTELY FREE to purchase ANY version of the PMDG 737 for MSFS. No versions is REQUIRED, in order for another to work. Actually this is opposite of "Cash grab", IMO. 

Wether or not, the -700 is the more popular version than the -800 or the opposite, is quite subjective. This behaviour is seriously beyond my comprehension. Why are you SO angry?? You will get all versions within 4-5 months. Patience please. The language and anger directed at PMDG for this decision, is just unfathomable. 

I don't get it...

Edited April 9, 20224 yr by anden145

PMDG initially intended to release the aircraft in their real world production order: 737, then 738, 736, then the 739. That's changed, but we don't know why. It could be they want 100 or so more purchases from people with low self control. It could also be that the 738 development fell behind the 736, or their 736 test pilots were more available than their 738 test pilots. No one knows.

In any case, people comparing the decision to release the 736 a month and a half before the 738, to Captain Sim releasing a 777 with a 747 cockpit, are for lack of a better word ridiculous.

FWIW, from someone who has flown and/or currently flies the -400, -700, -800, -900, -900ER, and -9Max, this angst/obsession with simulating specific variants of the 737 seems strange. Sure there are meaningful differences between the classics, NGs, and MAXs... but within the NG family? They honestly aren't that different.  The -700 climbs a little better, and the numbers are different in terms of weights and speeds.  But in the end, it's not like anyone is going to work thinking "boy I hope I'm taking an ER to LAX today instead of a -700."  No one actually cares.  You fly the plane that's on the release, and it's all about the same. 

I'll be buying the PMDG -700 because I guess I'll need the work airplane in the sim, and the -700 is the most versatile of the NGs anyway.  It can go anywhere and do anything any of the others can - and it does.  Doubt I'll buy another variant until the Max, because... well, it's all the same cockpit, and in the end that's what simming is - operating the cockpit.

A business can release products in any order they wish. Customers can buy those products or not, as they wish.  This mentality that PMDG ought to somehow feel bad about choosing the release schedule they've chosen is... bizarre. 

4 minutes ago, Stearmandriver said:

 Customers can buy those products or not, as they wish.

It's not that easy. There are many psychological mechanisms at work, trust me I know that from my profession. A big part of marketing and advertising is making people buy your product that would not have bought your product if they made a free decision on the base of pure information and rational for-against-arguments. I'm not saying this is "evil" per se and surely some people are more resilient to this than others, but the "free customer" is a myth. I do believe that customers should still be held responsible for their purchase decisions in the end, however, so maybe we can agree on that last part.

9 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

It's not that easy. There are many psychological mechanisms at work, trust me I know that from my profession. A big part of marketing and advertising is making people buy your product that would not have bought your product if they made a free decision on the base of pure information and rational for-against-arguments. I'm not saying this is "evil" per se and surely some people are more resilient to this than others, but the "free customer" is a myth. I do believe that customers should still be held responsible for their purchase decisions in the end, however, so maybe we can agree on that last part.

Are you then trying to say you're angry at, or disenfranchised with, PMDG for being good at marketing?  Why?  I mean, the free customer is NOT a myth, it's a literal fact.  If a business convinces someone to purchase their product, aren't they just doing their job? 

I doubt there's an airport served by commercial jets anywhere on the planet that a 737-700 hasn't flown into, so I'm not understanding the angst from a realism aspect either...

The diffrence with this release is there "forcing" you to buy the 700, FSX and P3D the base was the 800/900. The ones most people want, you then could buy the 600/700 as an addon.

This time, and the first time you have to buy the base 700 then wait and buy the 800 as on addon. So before you could just buy the base and be happy becasue you have the most common used 73, no, now you have to ( well you dont have to) buy the base and an addon just to get where you was with just the base within FSX/P3D. 

PMDG....🙄

 

Just now, Stearmandriver said:

 If a business convinces someone to purchase their product, aren't they just doing their job?

If they do it by the superiority of their product (depending on the price, of course) in comparison to the competition, yes. That's the ideal free market: Always improving products and productivity and efficiency due to the competition.
But that's not how reality goes. In reality people don't pay hundreds of dollars for digital cards in a Madden or 2K sports game, because it's a superior product, but because they are being psychologically manipulated. Sure they have fun, but only because they are satisfying a need that was only created by the product itself - that's the definition of an addiction, actually.

Let me put it another way:
Would you consider a drug dealer a good business maker in a free market, just because his customers always come back for more and even increase their purchase "amount" over time? In the end he fits your definition of "convincing someone to purchase their product", too.

Disclaimer: I do absolutely not compare any flightsim dev to drug dealers. I was just explaining the psychological backgrounds of advertising and human decision making.