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PMDG not planning to update LNAV for P3D

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46 minutes ago, DChockey08 said:

Came here to talk about how I understood PMDG's business decision, but seeing the posts of what RR is sending people on his forum....oh my goodness.

This guy reminds me of that scene in The Office "Ok I want a copy of it on my desk before the end of the day or you will receive one FULL DISADULATION!"

This man certainly has an original idea of how to run a company and treat customers. 

I have more faith in the electoral system when I found that when he did run for politics people could see what he was like and did not elect him,

 


Harry Woodrow

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I have just read the posts on their forum and i see none of the PMDG lap dogs(you know the ones your names not down your not coming in etc)are jmping to his defence as they usually do,maybe they agree with the majority.

Gary.

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1 hour ago, mazelda said:

Ok here's my 2 cents on this. I think RSR and his pmdg cronies are worried. They know they have a mediocre product (by what others have said, i don't own it in msfs) and does not meet the same standards of the fenix, madog etc.

Hold on, I wouldn't call the PMDG msfs 737 mediocre.

It lacks some features right now, like an EFB but it is far from mediocre. It is a nice product and personnaly I really enjoy it.

I also own the Fenix, and for sure, it is more complete with a nice EFB, no LNAV fault as much as I see. It is probably better than the PMDG even if I still enjoy more a 737 flight rather than an A320 flight, but this is personal taste. I won't talk about the maddog as I don't own it but it seems far from perfect and I see some critics too.

 

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Whilst there may be good reasons for the anger and resentment shown recently towards PMDG and its CEO, I can't help feeling rather sad that it has come to this. I thoroughly enjoy flying my PMDG 737 NGX and 777 in P3Dv4.5HF2, and I have never considered them to be lacking in any significant way. I appreciate that certain features (like LNAV 2.0 and the EFB) have been eagerly anticipated by the P3D user community, and Robert Randazzo's recent comments regarding these do not appear to be encouraging. However, maybe we have misinterpreted what he has stated where P3D is concerned? I personally feel that we need to take a step back, and try to approach this in a more constructive manner. We know that the 737 for MSFS is the prime directive for PMDG at the moment, so they cannot be blamed for concentrating exclusively on this. In addition, it seems to me that Robert has not specifically stated that P3D has been dumped from the PMDG product line, even though some members of the flight simulation community seem to think otherwise. Bearing that in mind, maybe we should wait and see what happens after all versions of the MSFS 737 have been completed?

Edited by Christopher Low
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Christopher Low

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While this MSFS 2020 is a flight simulator platform with many issues, especially aircraft dynamics, this 737 PMDG release suffers from many challenges (bugs) carried over from previous versions that are still not attended. 
Unfortunately, if a customer happens to point out deficiencies about the PMDG, is met with strong resistance, and most importantly,  if there is a disagreement or misunderstanding that doesn't sit well with the CEO of this company instead of a professional answer you might end up with warnings as such "infractions", "reputation penalties", "you are welcome to show yourself the door" or "I don't want you as a PMDG customer".
Very disappointing and unprofessional.
 
As a side note, I carry in my airplane between 400 and 800 passengers at any time that pay for a service (product), Some are happy and others are not, I wonder what would happen if I would go on PA and start arguing with them (the ones which pay the bills) and show them the door or that I don't want them as a customer?
Edited by LRBS
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1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

Whilst there may be good reasons for the anger and resentment shown recently towards PMDG and its CEO, I can't help feeling rather sad that it has come to this. I thoroughly enjoy flying my PMDG 737 NGX and 777 in P3Dv4.5HF2, and I have never considered them to be lacking in any significant way. I appreciate that certain features (like LNAV 2.0 and the EFB) have been eagerly anticipated by the P3D user community, and Robert Randazzo's recent comments regarding these do not appear to be encouraging. However, maybe we have misinterpreted what he has stated where P3D is concerned? I personally feel that we need to take a step back, and try to approach this in a more constructive manner. We know that the 737 for MSFS is the prime directive for PMDG at the moment, so they cannot be blamed for concentrating exclusively on this. In addition, it seems to me that Robert has not specifically stated that P3D has been dumped from the PMDG product line, even though some members of the flight simulation community seem to think otherwise. Bearing that in mind, maybe we should wait and see what happens after all versions of the MSFS 737 have been completed?

There is always a chance we misinterpret. I certainly hope they make good on their promises to P3D users, particularly in regard to their 777 customers. But as you say they haven't really covered themselves in glory on the PR front, the slightly casual reference to 'market forces' in the main statement struck me as a bit Aerosofty; it didn't really acknowledge how long many P3D customers waited on the back of their earlier promises even if on a purely finanical basis it's probably a sound statement, I feel it was a little inevitable it would backfire this way.

At the moment I think their primary problem is their initial MSFS release(s) seem to not look so good compared to some of their competitors (though I speak purely as an observer on that front) while P3D users sit and wait over a year for promised features and feel a bit left behind. So neither customer base is entirely happy and PMDG's response is to claim there is no problem and silence any dissent on their forums with rather flimsy justification. Their CEO's attitude to communication doesn't seem to be helping much (though hardly the only example of eccentricity from a major developer in this industry it seems). With a slightly more mature response I'm sure they could have put out the fire fairly easily on this front but they seem to have chosen to fan the flames instead (intentionally or not).

Certainly I'll still buy PMDG in the future if their offerings are what I'm looking for quality-wise, the 747-400 remains my most frequented aircraft, I certainly don't want PMDG gone. I do hope that this at least makes them rethink their PR slighty though.

Edited by SimeonWilbury
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1 hour ago, Christopher Low said:

Whilst there may be good reasons for the anger and resentment shown recently towards PMDG and its CEO, I can't help feeling rather sad that it has come to this. I thoroughly enjoy flying my PMDG 737 NGX and 777 in P3Dv4.5HF2, and I have never considered them to be lacking in any significant way. I appreciate that certain features (like LNAV 2.0 and the EFB) have been eagerly anticipated by the P3D user community, and Robert Randazzo's recent comments regarding these do not appear to be encouraging. However, maybe we have misinterpreted what he has stated where P3D is concerned? I personally feel that we need to take a step back, and try to approach this in a more constructive manner. We know that the 737 for MSFS is the prime directive for PMDG at the moment, so they cannot be blamed for concentrating exclusively on this. In addition, it seems to me that Robert has not specifically stated that P3D has been dumped from the PMDG product line, even though some members of the flight simulation community seem to think otherwise. Bearing that in mind, maybe we should wait and see what happens after all versions of the MSFS 737 have been completed?

It's what he isnt saying about P3D that speaks volumes. We know his history. I already have my crystal ball out and this is what I see....

1. Now that the we have completed the 737 for MSFS the team is now 100% focused on the 777 for MSFS

2. Now that we have completed the 777 the team is now 100% focused on the 747 for MSFS

3. Now that we have completed the 747 the team is now 100% focused on Global ops

4. Now that we have completed Global ops the team is now 100% focused on the 757.

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1 hour ago, Garys said:

It's what he isnt saying about P3D that speaks volumes. We know his history. I already have my crystal ball out and this is what I see....

1. Now that the we have completed the 737 for MSFS the team is now 100% focused on the 777 for MSFS

2. Now that we have completed the 777 the team is now 100% focused on the 747 for MSFS

3. Now that we have completed the 747 the team is now 100% focused on Global ops

4. Now that we have completed Global ops the team is now 100% focused on the 757.

Maybe, we don't know. The good thing is the msfs version also lack the new LNAV. So I assume that once they will update the msfs version with LNAV 2.0, it should be easy to make the same update for P3D as the code might be close.

So, I have no doubt that P3D users will see this update. Maybe once the 777 will appear on msfs, they will be able to use some of these textures to update the VC of the P3D version.. maybe....

But, don't expect the impossible too. It's a fact that P3D is on the way out for most developers. Some simmers will still use it, like they are still users on fsx, but it will be a minority.

That's why, once the complete 737, 777 and 747 line will be released for msfs (we talk about 2024 at the earliest), if P3D doesn't evolve itself, I wouldn't expect the PMDG 737 MAX or the 757 to ever be released for P3D. At that time, P3D will be less than a niche simulator. It probably won't please everybody here but we have to be realistic.

Fortunately, Ifly will release a 737 MAX so the MAX will be on P3D, and even before being on msfs. I'm just curious how many copies they would be able to sell on P3D if they release it at the end of 2022. Of course, they would have a monopoly but the market won't be huge.

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16 hours ago, anzac1977 said:

Just checked my PMDG forum account and got the same message because I agreed with Ray and Rudy.

Not like I post much there anyway.

Can he cancel your product licenses is he wants to?

Pretty sure no. I haven't studied their EULA or terms of conditions or whatever but I would be very surprised (shocked) if there was a legal clause in general that in the software industry, you could just take away what someone paid for (without any refund, too), unless perhaps for reasons like illegal redistribution (especially for money). Although, even then you still have legally obtained the product, so any means taken against that individual for any illegal action would probably have to be of legal nature other than taking away what was part of the rightful contract between seller and buyer at the time of the execution of that contract (buying the product). I'm no lawyer though and not in the software industry.

In any case, no one will be taking away your product license, no matter the discord between developer and customer right now.

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2 hours ago, threegreen said:

Pretty sure no. I haven't studied their EULA or terms of conditions or whatever but I would be very surprised (shocked) if there was a legal clause in general that in the software industry, you could just take away what someone paid for (without any refund, too), unless perhaps for reasons like illegal redistribution (especially for money). Although, even then you still have legally obtained the product, so any means taken against that individual for any illegal action would probably have to be of legal nature other than taking away what was part of the rightful contract between seller and buyer at the time of the execution of that contract (buying the product). I'm no lawyer though and not in the software industry.

In any case, no one will be taking away your product license, no matter the discord between developer and customer right now.

Thanks.

I was not sure and at this point (US laws, etc) I would not put past them showing their petty vindictive nature at times.

Just a simple farmer in NZ trying to enjoy my love of aviation.

I can not understand why there has to be such a big division in the flight sim community of what sim you should fly and if developers should or should not be developing for that platform.

Guess it is just a micro version of how the world currently seems to be, to me at least.

Edited by anzac1977
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On 6/5/2022 at 6:14 PM, Dreamflight767 said:

I think this is their way of saying their are exiting the PMDG market.  They’ll support it for a few more years but nothing new anymore. 

Sorry!  I meant to say: I think this is their way of exiting the "P3D market."

Thanks


Aaron Ortega

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I can see it now, some time in the not so distant future, I told my customers not to buy my products and showed them the way out..  Now why is my company going under, it's a great mystery.

Edited by Sabre57
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This is by no means a sim vs sim thread. It’s all about not being straight with customers by the CEO of one of the formally most leading addon aircraft producers since the foundation of the flight sim hobby. New customers of whichever sim they prefer should be informed of the way older customers have been misled through misleading innuendo if not direct falsehood. It’s really concerning the entire community regardless of sim choices.

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Vic green

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Does anything pmdg says really surprises anyone? They are following the money, not the good customer's that have spent a fortune on p3d products. I won't be moving to MSFS. I  will stay on p3d until it dies. I am also an X-plane user, i am pretty excited what Lamar is working on. As far as PMDG goes, Just don't buy anymore of their products. Alot of other good developers out their, that deserve our hard earned cash. I honestly expect MSFS to be another FSX, i think eventually it will drown somewhere in the middle of development when the money starts falling off those expensive servers, wait and see.

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1 hour ago, Patriot3810 said:

I honestly expect MSFS to be another FSX, i think eventually it will drown somewhere in the middle of development when the money starts falling off those expensive servers, wait and see.

Hum... I don't think so...

I know this is niche but I would say that MSFS was (is) a sales success.

But about that: what would happen "if"? same thing would happen if OrbX stops supporting Prepar3D (via OrbX Central) or even PMDG with their activation system.

Edited by Juliet Alpha
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