They said a few years ago that Working Title would work on ATC after finishing working on some of the aircraft, but I'm guessing working 2024 got in the way.

Asobo have said they'll work on the ATC post launch, as they want the new flight planning system to be solid first, since that's probably what the ATC will use.

I'm theorizing Working Title was too busy with other 2024 stuff (like said new flight planner) to work on ATC for launch

Edited November 8, 20241 yr by Tuskin38

A big difference between today and just a few years ago is the rise of LLM's and AI, and Microsoft being a leader in this space is going to help a lot with MSFS IMHO. ATC communications are publicly available, Microsoft just needs to feed them into their LLM (if they haven't already) and they'll have the first half of the problem solved: realistic communication from ATC. The second piece of the puzzle is the logic within MSFS to apply the communications and route the traffic. I can imagine the live traffic makes this more difficult, as they have to integrate data they have no control over.

I have a hunch they've been silent on this because they have something in the works that they aren't allowed to make public yet, but we'll see.

Who cares about ATC!

 

They added the ability to walk around, drive cars and even go fishing and bird watching!

 

Why even bother with ATC in a word not allowed flight sim!

On 11/8/2024 at 1:36 AM, MarcG said:

There's "plans" to improve it, when that happens nobody knows.

Same as the plans to improve it in 2020 😂

To make modern ATC work properly, AI may be the key, as shown by BATC and SI. This costs money on an ongoing basis as it is still relatively expensive but is decreasing. So, without adding cost to the sim upfront or by subscription, we put up with the in-sim ATC, go with a non-AI alternative (FSHud, etc.), or reach into our pockets for an AI ATC program.

For the level of immersion that I get from BATC and SI, it is well worth it for me. I started with BATC but drifted over to SI and have been quite happy despite having to pay extra. Not all will want to go this route.

3 hours ago, ricka47 said:

For the level of immersion that I get from BATC and SI, it is well worth it for me.

I'm one who always still uses default ATC even though I've always seen it as a placeholder for further development.  For how I use the sim ATC of this type is its own kind of immersion, as it's kind of background for me.  Some basics in it still serve this purpose fairly well, if your standards for it are not toohigh: 

• It correctly identifies the live traffic, and does the choreography well for outbound flights correctly giving instruction to hold for incoming traffic, line up and wait until cleared, etc.
• It's much better than it was with regard to yo-yoing up and down in mountainous areas and I fly in those most often.
• I've selected the least obnoxious voicings offered

So I am in staunch support of MS/A further developing it to a better level, not really one that competes fully with the standalone options, but one that gets the fairly basic things done better and adds ATC speech using LLM/AI to replicate actual ATC speech.  And I may be a bellwether for other non real world pilot simmers which would presumably be the large majority of all simmers in MSFS.  So in this regard I'm thinking it would be well worth MS/A working on, and it may well be what they refer to when they say it's in the works.

My immersion comes from the sim and the wonderful planes I use, from using the awesome Self Loading Cargo which is in further development and will work in 2024, and I run LiveATC in the region I'm for that piece.

Edited November 9, 20241 yr by Noel

5 hours ago, Kilo60 said:

drive cars and even go fishing

No they didn’t 🙄

On 11/8/2024 at 7:27 AM, Ray Proudfoot said:

and in my humble opinion none have bettered Radar Contact v4 for IFR flights.

Totally agree, Ray. I've been using it for, what, 20 years?? Still my go-to in X-plane!!

 

Russ

On 11/8/2024 at 8:05 AM, Ray Proudfoot said:

Experience has taught me to be very sceptical this will happen.

I think you understand the Microsoft mentality and priorities a lot better than most people in this forum and others.  I share your skepticism.  Even if there is an effort to enhance ATC, I doubt the extent of the effort will be anywhere near the expectations of the serious aviator (a minority group compared to the gamers).  This is one case where I would love to be wrong.

This is sad news. Last I played the sim, add-on ATC apps suffered from some combination of bad UI from trying to do too much, poor voice synthesis, an inability to assign an approach and runway on arrival, or a lack of integration with live traffic and/or very poor live traffic behaviour. None of them were very good and not worth paying for. Has Beyond ATC solved these issues?

I’m not in a rush to get back into flight simming until ATC has improved. I’m of the mind that it’s misleading to call it a “flight simulator” with ATC as bad as it is. In the real world, ATC is so fundamental to flying, it’s hard for me to understand why it has been so neglected for so long. 

Edited November 10, 20241 yr by Virtual-Chris

1 hour ago, Virtual-Chris said:

it’s hard for me to understand why it has been so neglected for so long. 

Not having decent ATC doesn't stop the majority of people using and enjoying MSFS.

How the sim looks, sounds, flies and performs is much more important. Get those elements right and the developers can spend time on ATC at a later date. Get those wrong, and you end up with MS Flight or DTG Flight Sim World – neither of which had a long shelf life.

And that's before you get to how incredibly difficult it is to program for a highly dynamic scenario, while factoring in various civil aviation regulator variances, local airport quirks for managing airspace, and weather effects/restrictions, all while trying to keep a complex sim performing well on the majority of people's PCs.

We'll get good ATC eventually. Improved computing capability and multiple different dev teams are making this much more likely than ever before. But given the choice between an enjoyable flight sim experience with poor ATC and a clunky sim with excellent ATC, the market has shown where Asobo's efforts should be (and have rightly been) focused.

MS/Asobo chose various "core" sim areas to focus on for the initial 2024 release (ground handling, flight dynamics and other physics, atmospheric lighting engine, weather & clouds, avionics, performance and multi-threading, client-side footprint, flight planning, more complex default aircraft and systems, default wear & tear, etc).. and also other areas that some like to trivialize so let's call them "non-core sim features" like visual fidelity of the digital twin earth, aviation activities/missions, seasons, biomes, 4000x ground details, aircraft walk-arounds, etc. Just because they haven't addressed some other core aspects (yet) like ATC then some come out with the predictable and always laughable claims like "oMg tHeY aRe nOT FoCuSsInG oN sImMeRs!!"

If given a choice between the areas they've focused on for the initial release of 2024 versus one or more of those being set aside for default ATC improvements then that's an easy answer for me.. I'd much rather they focused on what they did. For proper ATC it's always been a 3rd party solution for all sims for as long as I can remember.. would I welcome default ATC improvements? of course, but lack thereof is just a big meh 🤷‍♂️, I'll live.
 

Edited November 10, 20241 yr by lwt1971

7 hours ago, Virtual-Chris said:

This is sad news. Last I played the sim, add-on ATC apps suffered from some combination of bad UI from trying to do too much, poor voice synthesis, an inability to assign an approach and runway on arrival, or a lack of integration with live traffic and/or very poor live traffic behaviour. None of them were very good and not worth paying for. Has Beyond ATC solved these issues?

I’m not in a rush to get back into flight simming until ATC has improved. I’m of the mind that it’s misleading to call it a “flight simulator” with ATC as bad as it is. In the real world, ATC is so fundamental to flying, it’s hard for me to understand why it has been so neglected for so long. 

BeyondATC hasn’t solved all the issues you mentioned but it is still pretty good.  And it has traffic injection now, although it’s in a early alpha type phase.

Edited November 10, 20241 yr by abrams_tank

7 hours ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I’m of the mind that it’s misleading to call it a “flight simulator” with ATC as bad as it is.

Hmm...what would you call it?   

I am happy with BATC now, use it on every flight,  and will stick with it. I don't care about the AI traffic part of it, and might not even use it, don't know yet. 

Edited November 10, 20241 yr by Bobsk8