What's Up With Froogle and MSFS?

[kdfw__ 542]

whenever the topic of the new msfs pops up, it seems like the same choir appears... just sayin'.

[overspeed3 410]

So you would break-up Google or Amazon - How exactly would that work, and who would get the spoils...

[F737MAX 5,601]

12 minutes ago, Paraffin said:

I disagree about the potential for growing the hobby. At least the traditional FS hobby that involves people interested in aviation who will continue flying in the sim, year after year. I think that has always been a niche interest in the wider world of PC "gaming," and it will remain a niche interest.

It's like car racing sim enthusiasts deep into F1 racing. Or people into military tank sims. It's technical, it's nerdy. It's not going to keep anyone interested in the long term who isn't already interested in aviation, just because it's on the new XBox Cloud service (or whatever). 

MS with Flight and DTG with FSW both failed to appreciate how niche this area of interest is. The market they aimed for didn't exist. That's been proven twice now.

That doesn't mean I'm not rooting for the new MSFS to be a success because I am! But if it doesn't appeal to this niche interest, it can't be a commercial success because nobody who isn't already interested in aviation will spend more than a few hours with it.

Not picking on you, just want to elaborate my earlier point by answering yours.

I think as a community we've gone down a rabbit hole of ever-more technical (see FSLabs recreating toilet flushes and effect on weight and balance).

While you, me and several thousand others bang-on about 'study level' aircraft, there's not a lot as it stands in any of the sims to bring in the next generation of simmers.

The 1 million+ simmers are going to be drawn by incredible visuals. Retaining their interest will be through challenges like the Red Bull Air Race of FSX, fire-fighting forest fires, mountain rescue, flying under bridges and through canyons, etc. Stuff that is based on reality, provides a challenge, gives a score (yeah, I know, that's not simming) and drives intrigue into how flying really works to get them looking at the more complex stuff that interests us 'old hands'.

Just my arseh... Sorry, I mean, opinion.

[SolRayz 392]

Everyone needs to breathe and while your at it, do yourself and the world a favor and delete your facebook account.

[rtodepart 761]

6 minutes ago, SolRayz said:

delete your facebook account.

man i deleted mine 2 years ago and my life changed for good lol ...

[irrics 1,517]

8 minutes ago, SolRayz said:

Everyone needs to breathe and while your at it, do yourself and the world a favor and delete your facebook account.

Not even joking, I closed mine in 2009. 

[snglecoil 1,828]

YouTube stars and other social media “influencers” ( 🤮 )

When you are compensated for your opinion...sorry, your opinion is no longer interesting. 

[RamonB 449]

52 minutes ago, SolRayz said:

Everyone needs to breathe and while your at it, do yourself and the world a favor and delete your facebook account.

So far, the best comment on this thread.

Never had one, never will.

Edited June 20, 2019 by RamonB

[LHookins 3,103]

1 hour ago, David Mills said:

The reaction seems bizarre because Froogle's video was bizarre. I too always liked Froogle's videos and value his opinions. But this video was very different from his usual product. It contained no informative commentary at all. It added nothing to our understanding of the forthcoming MSFS. The video was nothing but infantile, pouting snark that a new flight simulator was being introduced.

Thanks.   I'd really like to have seen the video anyway.

Just goes to show that you shouldn't publish anything that wasn't created when you were at the top of your form.  He did mention on Facebook that he was sick.

I like Froogle's videos and I would respect his opinion even if I didn't agree with it.

Hook

[Paraffin 2,197]

1 hour ago, F737NG said:

Not picking on you, just want to elaborate my earlier point by answering yours.

I think as a community we've gone down a rabbit hole of ever-more technical (see FSLabs recreating toilet flushes and effect on weight and balance).

While you, me and several thousand others bang-on about 'study level' aircraft, there's not a lot as it stands in any of the sims to bring in the next generation of simmers.

The 1 million+ simmers are going to be drawn by incredible visuals. Retaining their interest will be through challenges like the Red Bull Air Race of FSX, fire-fighting forest fires, mountain rescue, flying under bridges and through canyons, etc. Stuff that is based on reality, provides a challenge, gives a score (yeah, I know, that's not simming) and drives intrigue into how flying really works to get them looking at the more complex stuff that interests us 'old hands'.

I understand that perspective, I just think it's putting the cart before the horse. 

I'm taking the opposite view, that people who eventually seek out home flight sims and spend years of time in them, are those who get interested in aviation first, and then find a way to simulate it on a PC. Not the other way around.

Maybe their Dad was a pilot, or they have a friend studying to be one. Maybe they just like to see aircraft taking off at the local airport. And then they find out you can simulate this on a home PC. 

I mean, seriously -- who knows what "Red Bull Racing" is, or what aerial fire fighting is, or what mountain rescue is, if they're not already interested in aviation? You can't force an interest if it isn't already there.

This is just anecdotal evidence, but in all my years as a flight sim enthusiast, including helping to run the Compuserve FS forums before there was even such a thing as the World Wide Web and consumer Internet, the user base was people interested in aviation first, and finding a way to simulate it on a PC second.

If I'm right about that, then the good news for Microsoft is that if they can build a good enough simulation, then that niche user base will follow. It always has. And I'll be there too, because I've moved through a heck of a lot of different flight simulation platforms over the years.

This fantasy that a flight sim can get more people interested in aviation who aren't already, with fancier graphics (MS Flight) or a wider platform (FSW on Steam) has already been disproved in the real world, twice now.

[Superdelphinus 718]

If things like farming, car mending and truck driving sims can become massively successful and popular then I’m sure flight simulation can. The element that all of those games have is structure and an overall feeling of making progress, and being relaxed while you’re doing it. 

MSFS can become really popular I think if they really think about how different groups of people might want to use it, and not just create a sandbox. I also think it being part of the game pass bundle so that people don’t have to specifically pay for it could be a really big reason for it to grow. I think huge amounts of people are fascinated by flying, they just need something that’s more accessible and introduces depth logically and in an entertaining way - before unleashing you into a fully hardcore simulation.  

[G-RFRY 1,711]

It`s been said before anyone bringing out a new sim should expect to be slated, and the fact that it`s Microsoft makes worse they are not liked in the flight sim community, if LR put XP on the new Play Station it will be alright it makes sense to cash in.

[simmerhead 885]

1 hour ago, Superdelphinus said:

If things like farming, car mending and truck driving sims can become massively successful and popular then I’m sure flight simulation can. The element that all of those games have is structure and an overall feeling of making progress, and being relaxed while you’re doing it. 

MSFS can become really popular I think if they really think about how different groups of people might want to use it, and not just create a sandbox. I also think it being part of the game pass bundle so that people don’t have to specifically pay for it could be a really big reason for it to grow. I think huge amounts of people are fascinated by flying, they just need something that’s more accessible and introduces depth logically and in an entertaining way - before unleashing you into a fully hardcore simulation.  

I think you're on to something. 

As for me personally I would be thrilled if it was "just" a game, as long as it was a good and entertaining one. I really liked the FSX missions (some better than others of course), and if hey could build and a expand on that concept without dumbing it down to chasing aerocaches, like with a  personal pilot profile, career mode, reward system, easter eggs, hidden gems etc. I think many would find it fun and entertaining. The best thing about having the whole Earth modeled is the endless possibilities it provides for discovery and learning, not just about aviation, but about geography, politics and nature. 

For those who seek serious simulation, P3D and X-Plane is still there. 

[Pastaiolo 1,688]

This is what Froogle wrote on facebook:

"OK Ok. Ive taken the MSFS video down. At the opening of the video I made a mistake in saying that it was XBOX only. Seems a MASSIVE bunch of you didn't get past that and ignored the rest of the video. I'll reshoot it without that error.

All good? (For those that did watch it, yes my views still stand - I am NOT excited or looking forward to a new sim from Microsoft - there are far more established and better options available )"

I remember that for a period he started trying X-plane aircrafts and helicopters too and enjoyed them. Then he went back to a somewhat P3D-centric type of channel and now he is reporting news for both. Still, the impression i always had was that he was mostly reporting and trying addons for a simulator i wasn't interested in. And now said simulator and its addon developers might be in a worse condition with the incoming MS sim..

Then again, you cannot open the video saying that it is a Xbox game only. That means you really didn't pay attention at all nor did you inform yourself enough and just tried to get a video out to catch those famous youtube views..

Either way i am curious about the far more estabilished and better options available he mentions. It can't be Xplane nor AeroflyFS2 since he barely covers them, and that leaves P3D. Now, in 2019 considering P3D a far more estabilished and better option sim compared to a newly developed one sounds pretty funny to me..
 

[ca_metal 2,020]

I don't buy his arguments. He had more than a week to collect data and he didn't even know it will come to PC first? And he thinks his opinion will worth a thing after that? Really? 🤣

It's his channel, he can post whatever he wants there, but the viewers are free to dislike it. If I had my investments on this market, I would be defensive also (not saying he has put money on developing anything, but he advertises a lot of products on his channel).

Edited June 20, 2019 by ca_metal