52 minutes ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

Agree, me too ... this is an $80 bargain, should be priced around $100 considering the quality level ... maybe Milviz can offer a detailed manual version for $120?  But I'm more than happy with my $80 expenditure.

Are some of these negative comments coming from those who worked closely with competitor products?  I have no connection to Milviz at all, but some of the comments seem a tad harsh ... go buy Foreflight Pro Plus, you'll have all the performance data you need and it'll do the fuel calcs for you and you get access to all these aicraft: https://foreflight.com/products/performance-directory/#/_/?_k=6ww5l4   (takes some time for the web page to load, that many aircraft).

Cheers, Rob.

Agree on all points here, especially the Foreflight mention. Absolutely love this, particularly the Jepp charts and the Routes function. Flew from KPSP to KSAN yesterday in the Dash 8 that took place three hours before!

I need to look at the Plus version, sounds cool!

23 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

So, asking for a manual to study this aircraft's systems and procedures, which are advertised as being beyond study-level, is me being entitled???????

I wasn't really directing the entitled part at you per se.  Sorry, I should have specified that.  I was being more general with that comment and mostly just pointing out that a dev is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

With that being said, I do agree with you, mostly.  But, I guess I'd ask this.  Would you be happy waiting another 4 months let's say just so you could have the manual with it?  Or would you rather have the plane now, albeit with having to learn it in a harder and/or not preferred manner?

9 minutes ago, klamal said:

Would you be happy waiting another 4 months let's say just so you could have the manual with it?

Sure, speaking in generalities since I don’t have the 350 yet (waiting for feedback from some 350 drivers I know).  For me, yes.  Especially in-depth manuals, written stand-alone tutorials, and charts for an in-depth aircraft.  Certainly, there are OEM copyright considerations but thorough documentation for a complex add-on is usually my first stop and speaks to the robustness of the product.

7 minutes ago, CaptKornDog said:

Sure, speaking in generalities since I don’t have the 350 yet (waiting for feedback from some 350 drivers I know).  For me, yes.  Especially in-depth manuals, written stand-alone tutorials, and charts for an in-depth aircraft.  Certainly, there are OEM copyright considerations but thorough documentation for a complex add-on is usually my first stop and speaks to the robustness of the product.

Fair enough.  But it still proves the point I was trying to empathize with the dev on, they are damned if they do, damned if they don't.  For you, it would be preferred to wait.  For others, they'd have chewed the dev a new one if they knew they were just waiting for documentation.  Either way, the dev loses with someone.

Anyway, I think we're beating a dead horse here I think.  🙂

6 hours ago, Milviz said:

Boggles the mind that someone (see above) thinks that 80$ is worth spending a HUGE amount of time on doing a manual that NO ONE WILL READ.... Instead, they will ask us to PLEASE do videos cause those are easier to understand...  Can't win.  Really. Cannot win.

We will do the videos because they are easier to do and understand. As far as Chuck's Guides are concerned, we would PAY him to do said videos. We're not THAT cheap.

 

I just don't understand all the fuss with not having a full, detailed manual with this plane at the release of this plane. It is so easy to look up the information on line. I'm so glad you went ahead and released the plane instead of holding on to it until you could get one made for it. Instead, we have a beautiful, very fly-able airplane that we can enjoy, just before Christmas. I, for one, would certainly prefer to get the plane now, without a manual, then to wait who knows how long for it with a complete manual. Within minutes after downloading it, I had it installed and flying it, with a manual I found on line that took me only a few more minutes to find. Not that difficult. And even without the manual, this plane is WELL worth the price. Nowhere else will you find a more detailed Proline21 in any sim than you have here. It is a simulation in itself. Even though I am very familiar with the KingAir, I really enjoy the videos. They are well done and easy to understand. It seems I'm one of a few people who is totally enjoying all the effort you have put in to this wonderful aircraft. And I appreciate even more just how hard you are trying to accommodate everyone. I truly hope you had an enjoyable and much deserved break during the holidays without worrying too much about so much of the negativity I've seen here in forums. I couldn't be more happy with this release and am enjoying flying it everyday. Thank You, Milviz, from the bottom of my heart, for another outstanding product. I'm really looking forward to you next release.

7 hours ago, Ricardo41 said:

Addon developers release an $80 addon, then think a few hastily put together YT-videos will substitute for a manual, instead hoping that the community will step in and do the job that is theirs to begin with.

Boggles the mind.

 

I smell a business opportunity here. Write a manual. Sell it online as an add-on to an add-on.  Make a gazillion dollars! 🤗

44 minutes ago, monica6211 said:

I just don't understand all the fuss with not having a full, detailed manual with this plane at the release of this plane. It is so easy to look up the information on line. I'm so glad you went ahead and released the plane instead of holding on to it until you could get one made for it. Instead, we have a beautiful, very fly-able airplane that we can enjoy, just before Christmas. I, for one, would certainly prefer to get the plane now, without a manual, then to wait who knows how long for it with a complete manual. Within minutes after downloading it, I had it installed and flying it, with a manual I found on line that took me only a few more minutes to find. Not that difficult. And even without the manual, this plane is WELL worth the price. Nowhere else will you find a more detailed Proline21 in any sim than you have here. It is a simulation in itself. Even though I am very familiar with the KingAir, I really enjoy the videos. They are well done and easy to understand. It seems I'm one of a few people who is totally enjoying all the effort you have put in to this wonderful aircraft. And I appreciate even more just how hard you are trying to accommodate everyone. I truly hope you had an enjoyable and much deserved break during the holidays without worrying too much about so much of the negativity I've seen here in forums. I couldn't be more happy with this release and am enjoying flying it everyday. Thank You, Milviz, from the bottom of my heart, for another outstanding product. I'm really looking forward to you next release.

excellent post - answers all my questions.  Super excited to buy this addon soon. 

3 hours ago, Ricardo41 said:

So, asking for a manual to study this aircraft's systems and procedures, which are advertised as being beyond study-level, is me being entitled???????

Agree and I’m trying to think of a quality add-on that HASN'T included a well put together manual?
That is usually the first question asked after Installation - what folder is the manual in?
And I’m not sure why it would be damned if you do since I know zero people who don’t want a manual included with a ‘Study level’ add-on. 
 

Perhaps just rushed to get it out before MS2020 is released which will spell the end of all other sims anyways. 

 

7 minutes ago, Doug47 said:

Perhaps just rushed to get it out before MS2020 is released which will spell the end of all other sims anyways. 

Is it "Study Level" I Ask cause I don't know?

1 minute ago, Adrian123 said:

Is it "Study Level" I Ask cause I don't know?

The master caution and warning lights don’t work half the time, but sure, this is a super-duper-ultra-beyond-study-level-unprecedented-masterpiece 

10 hours ago, Milviz said:

There are now several videos available on our YT channel.  There will be no further documentation.  Only videos.

Wow that’s very very disappointing for the cost of the product. Even cheap products come with better documentation and you guys have had 5 years to prepare it..... Hardly better than study level if you can’t do the study.....

somebody suggested looking it up online, I would gladly accept links to the information that is sorely missing.

Your product is nice albeit with some bugs to iron out but an $80USD is not cheap and the level of documentation is disgraceful to be honest....

Edited January 2, 20206 yr by barramundilure

This situation is really weird. A manual doesn’t have to be hundreds of pages long. 
I don’t understand why a dev would create such a quality and complex aircraft for so long and not be eager to describe all about it in a manual. 

19 minutes ago, Doug47 said:

Perhaps just rushed to get it out before MS2020 is released which will spell the end of all other sims anyways.

Nonsense!  Just more distraction.

Greg

1 hour ago, Doug47 said:

Perhaps just rushed to get it out before MS2020 is released which will spell the end of all other sims anyways. 

Oh, I did not know that! Would you please post where you see that on the X-pain and Prepar3d web sites or post the text or email from those Dev's saying that their programs will not work or will not be available upon release of the new MS product. And here sits stupid me thinking we would still have the option to choose which one we wanted to use.

All right, let's not go there.  Back to topic, please...the B350i.