4 hours ago, simbol said:

I am supper exited for MSFS 2024, but I love thinking outside the box, the old fashion way of flight simulators like FS95 / FSX needs to become a thing of the past, buried deeper than dinosaurs are.. the future of simulators are worlds where you can explore and enjoy "as you wish to do so", what does this mean? of you want to just fly point A to B on airports and nothing else.. fine.. oh you want to simulate bush flying and enjoy the world? sure you can.. oh you want to explore the thrill of pilots firefighting? no problem.. oh you want to explore the thrill of sensitive cargo missions? sure go ahead.. everyone can do as they like without limits.

Anyone failing to see this future, and complaining about why MSFS is doing this is just not willing to understand Microsoft if not narrowing you into an arcade game, it is expanding your horizon into something "more"..  however if anyone is really bothered about it, they can simply put stay behind, install FSX, P3D, etc. and enjoy the old ways.. I will be on MSFS 2024 embracing the future and the change because what is coming is just fantastic and it is only the beginning, I can see already the crazy stuff I will be able to put into my products.. what a wonderful time to be a 3rd party developers for MSFS.

My 2 cents,
Raul

So glad that Raul chimed in on this.  The most important thing is to think out of the box and evolve this product so it continues to live a long life.  That can't happen if nothing changes in our virtual world.

Another "study level" this and that is great, and I see no indication that complexity was removed.  I have "studied" for the last 50 years of my life and there are times when a low-level early morning VFR hop is inspiring.  I also seek to do something more than spawning in the cockpit, taxi, roll out, climb etc.  Again, nothing wrong with that as it's the core of what we do  ...but why limit the experience?  Gone are the days when we loaded software and called libraries into memory and lived in our own client-based CPU/GPU world of solitude, unless invoking "multi-player".  I hope the barriers are lifted and this is the beginning of a world teaming with life.

All just my opinions.  Let's enjoy this great hobby!

 

 

6 minutes ago, lwt1971 said:

they have gone out of their to clarify things at last year's FS Expo and afterwards re: all the core simulation aspects being improved.

Prior to SU15 I watched some footage of a Q&A and also read some threads on here based on "things they said" complete with graphs on FPs timings and some other technical jargon that seemed to be implying that this new update was the holy grail and we will all be getting the performance we craved. Ultimately it was all a load of hogwash and far too general for the myriad of users and all the different types of hardware and software used by the individual. It virtually made no difference to my experience.

I'm just not buying this stuff anymore, not just from Asobo but from any company that makes games/sims. Its ok to be skeptical after 4 years of messing about with mods and God knows what else just to get myself above 35fps because lets be honest here, without 3rd party developers the sim would not be as enjoyable as it is. This sim has provided me with the best hobby I've ever had and for that I'm thankful but its hard for me to get excited at the very moment I've got a stable sim they've gone on Hollywood and released a new trailer. If its as good as the trailer when all is said and done thats brilliant but the jury is well and truly out for me.

I would also like to add that I'm enjoying the sim more than ever at the moment purely because of the flight rotations I have and some recent hardware purchases have stabilised it even further. It would be pointless for me to even think of deleting this and forking out for a new one just because trees, waves and some cloud colours look better. Horses for courses and all that. At least everyone will be happy come November (or is that wishful thinking?)

1 hour ago, El Diablito said:

I'm just not buying this stuff anymore, not just from Asobo but from any company that makes games/sims. Its ok to be skeptical after 4 years of messing about with mods and God knows what else just to get myself above 35fps because lets be honest here, without 3rd party developers the sim would not be as enjoyable as it is. This sim has provided me with the best hobby I've ever had and for that I'm thankful but its hard for me to get excited at the very moment I've got a stable sim they've gone on Hollywood and released a new trailer. If its as good as the trailer when all is said and done thats brilliant but the jury is well and truly out for me.

I would also like to add that I'm enjoying the sim more than ever at the moment purely because of the flight rotations I have and some recent hardware purchases have stabilised it even further. It would be pointless for me to even think of deleting this and forking out for a new one just because trees, waves and some cloud colours look better. Horses for courses and all that. At least everyone will be happy come November (or is that wishful thinking?)

Well nobody is asking you to believe what they're saying, and nobody is asking you to buy it, or be excited by it, etc. You obviously are free to see no value in what's coming and ignore MSFS 2024 and keep using v2020 or whatever other sim.

I've just been responding to folks who seem to think they know what MS/Asobo is prioritizing and working on, when MS/Asobo themselves are telling and showing what it is they are working on for MSFS 2024. I'll choose to go with the actual source (i.e. MS/Asobo) and what they are actually saying and showing they are doing in MSFS 2024 (i.e. https://youtu.be/VPhScg_FINE?t=507) rather than make sweeping uninformed assumptions based on this one trailer. Given all the information is right there, explicitly said and shown, for all of us to see.. to then still insist that "they've gone Hollywood" and that the only changes are "trees, waves, clouds colors look better"... that is, some take 🙂 
 

Edited June 11, 20241 yr by lwt1971

I’m a flight nurse, excited to be able to try out the medevac missions.

I guess I should turn in my Fenix and pmdg along with navigraph subscription and hundreds of dollars of hardware.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I really really hope the crop dusting missions are well-executed. I'm fascinated by ag aviation, and crop dusters on YouTube are incredible to watch. Such a different way to aviate compared w/ so much of what I usually do in a simulator and quite dangerous if you aren't really on top of what you're doing.

16 minutes ago, Jay Perry said:

I’m a flight nurse, excited to be able to try out the medevac missions.

I guess I should turn in my Fenix and pmdg along with navigraph subscription and hundreds of dollars of hardware.

Also love the idea of having more to do. Such an archaic, counter-productive way of thinking our simulators should be these boring, drab, starved-of-content platforms that can ONLY do super serious flight simming and nothing else, catering to people who live to gate-keep the hobby on what's simulation and what isn't. People who throw a tantrum because their platform is now swiss army knife instead of just a dull butter knife. These dinosaurs are ripe for the meteor at this point. 

 

7 hours ago, Rimshot said:

Well of course not. Deer don't fly. As a matter of fact, neither do carpets 😁

Of course deer CAN fly and carpets, too - as the below real world videos demonstrate 😁.

 

On a more serious note - I'm curious if there will be simulation of: wet/icy runways (i.e. different braking distance), icing not on the cake but on the wings, severe turbulences within thunderstorms, wake turbulences behind other planes, microbursts, damaged flaps at overspeed, hypoxia, freezing windows, blackout/redout at high g-loads, breakaway if e.g. the left brake fails, ... to name a few.

 

On 6/10/2024 at 5:33 AM, Greazer said:

Most Overlooked Feature!

Simmers are Overlooking one of the Greatest improvements here.
To see all the passengers walking down the Jetway to board the aircraft.
And the woman captain is seen outside walking! And then seen sitting in the captain seat in the cockpit.

This is clear evidence of First Person mode in FS2024!

As much as I hope you‘re right, I am still a bit sceptical. The way these scenes are recorded - the same angle, in both trailers - I don‘t know, they might as well just be cutscenes. I‘ll remain cautious until we get further info about this. 

Having said that, I‘d absolutely love a first person mode, if possible with collision detection and all. Imagine if you could do your walk around, climb the stairs, enter the cockpit and sit down in the captain’s seat like in real life. Or better yet, spawn in a briefing room in the airport building, prepare your flight on a computer (connected to Simbrief), and then walk through the airport to the plane - or take a bus. That‘d be super immersive, and, having fully modelled airport interiors would suddenly make a lot of sense. I know that‘s just wishful thinking, but who knows, maybe in MSFS 2028…

Edited June 11, 20241 yr by Shack95

7 minutes ago, flying_carpet said:

On a more serious note - I'm curious if there will be simulation of: wet/icy runways (i.e. different braking distance), icing not on the cake but on the wings, severe turbulences within thunderstorms, wake turbulences behind other planes, microbursts, damaged flaps at overspeed, hypoxia, freezing windows, blackout/redout at high g-loads, breakaway if e.g. the left brake fails, ... to name a few.

I doubt all of these things will be included (if any), but I think X-Plane does, so it's still an option to have these things if you're interested. Nice to have options.

13 minutes ago, Sethos said:

People who throw a tantrum because their platform is now swiss army knife instead of just a dull butter knife. These dinosaurs are ripe for the meteor at this point. 

I've been backing off but this is too much sorry. Could you quote ONE of these dinosaurs? What I have been seeing is those 'old timers' pleading to be allowed to keep their $100 kitchen knife or at least to be able to still buy one instead of having to cope with a $20 Walmart set of 20 blunt knives.

Not ONE 'dinosaur' have I seen ask to deny other people their pleasures. Let's have 20x $100 quality knives in the collection. Or 1x$100 knife and 20 Walmart set IF that's what people want. Just please let me and some others hold on to our VERY sharp favourite knife (that actually does everything we need it to).

With imagination you can do anything. I am currently creating a video series of me flying a 737/F28 around the Himalayas to all the places I'd never be allowed to in real life. Manual mostly as none of them have even one approach chart. It's crazy fun for me, BECAUSE the planes themselves (the PMDG or F28) are so realistic and the scenery so terrifyingly accurate and the weather (thanks ASFS!) scary enough to make me cuss on mic with shock.

Simming is for EVERYONE.

 

 

1 hour ago, lwt1971 said:

to then still insist that "they've gone Hollywood" and that the only changes are "trees, waves, clouds colors look better"... that is, some take 🙂 

I'm referring to it being a theatrical trailer and the response has been "its amazing". Thats the point I'm making. I worked in the advertising and marketing sector for close to 20 years and it never fails to surprise me how people will react to fancy bells and whistles in a promo. Its perfectly normal and ok to be skeptical of all the things Asobo are "saying" and without flogging a dead horse I'll say it again, the jury is still out. If the sim delivers on all the promises they've made and you've alluded to then thats brilliant and I look forward to jumping in at some point in the future. I'm not trying to argue about it and never was so I hope that makes it clearer.

My opinion in Bold

3 hours ago, Lord Farringdon said:

 

The development team is improving almost every aspect of the simulator.

Really? On this basis I can expect good ATC phraseology and instructions. I mean, it's a flight simulator right? (Not holding my breath).

Acc Jörg they are working on that, but unless they say it was updated I wouldn't expect any changes. It's not ideal, but eventually they will get there. Maybe we will be surprised at the lauch, or not. 

Some examples include: 

Improved multithreading to improve performance 

Faster download, load, and installation speeds 

These two simply improve the user interface experience or at least don't make it worse and as we all know this is based around Xbox requirements. They do not improve on or develop any further a sim activity such as ATC.

Better performance leaves space for the developers to improve the products (first and third party). Also, better user experience is always welcome. Like better physics, more engines, more point of contacts etc.

 

Improved aerodynamics and physics simulation 

There has to be real value to the flight simulator in this area but I suggest it is as a byproduct of the need to create this primarily for the most 'realistic' Career mode. 

I don't get your point here, they are improving physics and aerodynamics in a general sense. Definetely it will improve the experience for everyone, it's not (at all) related to the career mode.

Improved aircraft systems including electrical, pneumatic, fuel, and hydraulics 

Can someone tell me what this actually means? Fenix, PMDG, Leonardo and a number of other developers seem to have delivered very good renditions of these systems in 2020? What is there to improve? I suspect it is responding to developers requirements in the SDK rather than Asobo default aircraft coming with more complex systems which would seem counter intuitive with the audience MS is marketing to.  Put more simply, is this improvement directed at developers of study level aircraft, to make them even more complex? 

SDK developers aren't the same people working on the improvement of system/gauges/etc. Working Title is the group working on most of those improvements and releasing them as Sim Updates. They are doing a great work. And yeah, the SDK team is working to improve the SDK, so the third parties can work on their own products, with new features and general improvements. Like, Jörg said they are assessing the request to provide a better way to implement weather radars for the third party planes.

New failure and wear & tear system 

Again, I suspect this is a by-product of the Career mode rather than area of improvement in flight simulation, although some use can no  doubt be made of it.   

It is, indeed, but saying it's not an improvement of the SIMULATION makes me wonder what would it be. Tear and Failure system is one of the core pillars for flight simulation IMO.

Deeper and wider avionics systems

Now we are talking real aeroplane stuff, but what does this mean? How much wider or deeper can we go? Career mode again?  That FLIR, that tac rail, that specialist piece of electronic equipment required for some mission?  Not bad if it is since this by-product can then be developed into payware offerings. 

You really have a problem with the career mode, don't you. (LOL). They are doind that for the past four years, through the Sim Updates, that's not at all related with career mode. They can as deeper as possible.  Again, look for working title and their work, MS hired them to improve the simulator as whole (systems/gauges/etc related). As an example, they improved a lot of the Garmins in the sim, now some of the third party developers use those gauges in their airplanes because they are good.

Cockpit tablet available by default 

Was always miffed the Wright Flyer didn't have one! 

That's a feature people is asking for a while. An working EFB for all the airplanes. It helps default airplanes and third party developers that want to save some development time.

Its been an interesting discussion so  far and clearly two camps. Those who want to stay with a free roam 'flight' simulator and those who want to move forward with a career mode 'world' simulator based around flight (...for the meantime anyway). As Raul says "the old fashion way of flight simulators like FS95 / FSX needs to become a thing of the past, buried deeper than dinosaurs are......" You must stop sugar coating things Raul! 😁) . As a respected commercial developer who sees opportunities, Raul's comment would suggest the battle for the latter is already won and indeed most of what I have mentioned  above simply confirms the old type of flight simulator is pretty well on its way out even though no one is saying that too loudly at Asobo. Unless you subscribe to the conversation that Raul had with Sebastion which seems to confirm a liking for the concept of switching vehicles like in GTA. On that basis Raul, may I be your beta tester for the B727. I will swap out to my parachute vehicle and jump out the aft air stair. But please, if you ever do get this B727 underway, don't make it like the aircraft in GTA!!  

QUOTE from Raul:

I specifically asked Sebastian from Asobo face to face last year at FSExpo Houston to enable this feature, and the words I used and he used were "like GTA?".. and I said yes, like GTA. now you might think immediately into arcade, you might think this is gamish.. but that is just because you are failing to see the bigger picture, having the opportunity to switch vehicles like GTA does, open the gates of MSFS to a world full of features, with the SDK expanding its capabilities beyond it current limits.

 

Finally, bring on MSFS 2024 and lets see if by end of that cycle, we have finally reached space flight. After chasing herds of wild Wildebeest over the veld in my balloon, I will feel the need, the need for speed in one of Elon Musk's tin cans to Mars.  And while I sit there for three years (with TOD on pause in case I miss the important part), without a Magenta line you might think I would be bored silly. But no. I will of course be preoccupied with that fluctuating 400 hz and why ETOPS doesn't seem to apply between Earth and Mars. 

 

Cheers

Terry

I mean, they are working on features for everyone, I still fail to see why you sound so defeated as an "old simmer". I think the features are there for you, maybe you are a bit out of the loop of info. But if you would like them to 100% focus on the core features and/or remove other features you dislike, then, maybe, I guess I understand it, but it is a single minded way to look at it. 

14 minutes ago, El Diablito said:

I'm referring to it being a theatrical trailer and the response has been "its amazing". Thats the point I'm making. I worked in the advertising and marketing sector for close to 20 years and it never fails to surprise me how people will react to fancy bells and whistles in a promo. Its perfectly normal and ok to be skeptical of all the things Asobo are "saying" and without flogging a dead horse I'll say it again, the jury is still out. If the sim delivers on all the promises they've made and you've alluded to then thats brilliant and I look forward to jumping in at some point in the future. I'm not trying to argue about it and never was so I hope that makes it clearer.

Of course people will find the trailer amazing, because it is. I don't know if you know, but the showcase is meant to showcase what's is coming for the XBOX, and they showed 30 titles, that needed to be squeezed in an 1 hour presentation. You have two minutes to present your product, to a very wide audience. They can't record Matt from working title showing the new garmins in the trailer or Sebastien showcasing the new physics or aerodynamics. As always if you are really interested to know the details and new features, just wait for the interviews and/or developer updates. But of course, if you don't trust on what they say, there's not much we can say to you. 

P.S.: They are delivering the promisses, but again, it's F flight simulator. As complex as it gets. Cartering a huge audience with different systems, so it won't always work as intended, delays will happen. But in the general scheme of things, it's going well IMO.|

Cheers,

Edited June 11, 20241 yr by ca_metal

39 minutes ago, sloppysmusic said:

What I have been seeing is those 'old timers' pleading to be allowed to keep their $100 kitchen knife or at least to be able to still buy one instead of having to cope with a $20 Walmart set of 20 blunt knives.

Simming is for EVERYONE.

And there is no evidence *whatsoever* that the $100 kitchen knife is being taken away, or blunted, or reduced. And there is also no evidence that you still won't be able to buy one instead of coping with something lesser. In fact, there is only evidence to the contrary... because umm, they have explicitly said so and shown so.

And before anyone says well that's just them saying it (or worse that they are lying).. then all I can say is *both* the trailer(s) and other info they gave/showed at FS Expo'23 are all their words and communications (without anything else concrete for us to go by) .. so choosing to make silly assumptions based on a 2 minute trailer with no details versus not believing the many words said/stated in https://youtu.be/VPhScg_FINE?t=507 or https://www.flightsimulator.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2024-faq/ , that takes a new level of willful obtuseness.

And of course yes, simming is for EVERYONE.
 

Edited June 11, 20241 yr by lwt1971

Somebody mentioned earlier that the clouds look amazing in the trailer, maybe I'm taking crazy pills but the clouds looked like that 2 years ago in the sim, something that was discussed in length in the ActiveSky thread. 

Hype is a powerful aphrodisiac for some. I hope I'm wrong but I'll be the one smugly grinning over here when the complaints start on week one over in the MSFS2024 forum.