EDITED. I really cannot be bothered.

Edited July 16, 2025Jul 16 by Christopher Low

8 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

Was that really necessary? Why are some of you triggered by even the slightest suggestion that MSFS 2024 might not be perfect?

And why did you feel the need to be negative in a thread about a product you know nothing about because it only works in a simulator you couldn't run even if you wanted to? You seem to be constantly looking for little ways to tell us that you don't think 2024 is very good when you really have no clue. Why?

See reply above.

6 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

"Technology moves on" is all very well, provided that everything in the new version is at least as good as that in the previous version. I cannot comment since I do not have MSFS 2024, but I have seen plenty of comments to suggest that certain features of the new simulator are inferior to those of MSFS 2020 (the night lighting being one example).

I guess that’s A way to look at it. 
 

the flip side of the coin is that SO MANY things in 2024 are not only as good as they were in 2020, but significantly BETTER than before. I simply can’t imagine going back to 2020. 

7 hours ago, MrBitstFlyer said:

If you are happy with two sims, why do you state something like you are being abandoned?  Technology moves on and we have to pay to go with it. No developer is going to support an older sim forever, so if you want new aircraft, you must purchase the newer sims.

It is not them that have abandoned you, it is you who have abandoned them.

Never said anything about being abandoned, please check my post!

If I have a CD player (high quality of course) that sounds great and my fave band says we only releasing albums on Spotify/itunes from now on cos you know bigger profits/less overheads etc then I'll stop buying their music, plenty of great music out there still on CD (and VINYL!!).

Not being abandoned, just not spending money moving to a new platform when my current ones work great thanks!

 

12 minutes ago, sloppysmusic said:

Never said anything about being abandoned, please check my post!

If I have a CD player (high quality of course) that sounds great and my fave band says we only releasing albums on Spotify/itunes from now on cos you know bigger profits/less overheads etc then I'll stop buying their music, plenty of great music out there still on CD (and VINYL!!).

Not being abandoned, just not spending money moving to a new platform when my current ones work great thanks!

 

Wow. Really. So if a new movie comes out on Blue-ray or streamed you will refuse to see it because you want it on VHS.

What about your old 78 records. Or all the 8 tracks when I was young. The list can get very long.

Does not seem logical to me, but it is your choice after all.

 

 

7 minutes ago, Ron Lefebvre said:

Wow. Really. So if a new movie comes out on Blue-ray or streamed you will refuse to see it because you want it on VHS.

What about your old 78 records. Or all the 8 tracks when I was young. The list can get very long.

Does not seem logical to me, but it is your choice after all.

 

 

Poor example sorry! BluRay is better than VHS, so I WOULD use it and do. But STREAMING movies is MUCH lower quality so I prefer to buy my movies that way. Plus they change the movies with censorship over ooo bad words and politically incorrect characters etc. My Blu Rays are original cuts, never to be messed with in this way.

Im talking about LOWER quality mediums for profit not quality here, and as mentioned STREAMING services NOT hard copies.

Hard copy please every time!

EDIT: Downloads (high quality) are also good. I use Bandcamp for smaller bands which lets me download complete WAV files from my chosen artists 44.1/16 bit, none of this 192k mp3/aac rot thanks!

Edited July 16, 2025Jul 16 by sloppysmusic
downloads

2 hours ago, sloppysmusic said:

EDIT: Downloads (high quality) are also good. I use Bandcamp for smaller bands which lets me download complete WAV files from my chosen artists 44.1/16 bit, none of this 192k mp3/aac rot thanks!

Another less than ideal example.  There are streaming music services out there with huge catalogs encompassing just about every genre on the planet who offer 44/16 lossless (and higher if you believe it makes a difference!) quality.  Shortly after moving to one of these I shut down my (100% lossless) music server as I simply wasn't using it any more.  The sound quality was equivalent, and the streaming experience was simply superior without the hassles of constantly updating music and maintaining the server.

And yes, compression rates on most video streaming services are generally higher than on BluRay causing noticeable artifacts if you're particular about such things (and I am), but it really only matters to me if the subject matter warrants it.  Streaming suffices for middling titles AFAIC, and, again, I AM picky.

Circling back to simming (oh, thank goodness!), I'm still on 2020 for reasons not germane to the discussion, but am completely convinced that I'll be happier with the new than I was with the old once I make the switch.

 

Scott

16 minutes ago, tttocs said:

There are streaming music services out there with huge catalogs encompassing just about every genre on the planet who offer 44/16 lossless (and higher if you believe it makes a difference!) quality

Well yes, but that's NOT streaming then which was my point! Like if a sim let you stream AND/OR download the data you wanted offline that would be a major selling point for me. I think we're on the same page here, or at least the same book but maybe different pages.

Turbulence and the Aerostar: feels pretty good to me.  I'm not sure if I've ever flown an Aerostar - seems like I must have at some point - but I've spent too much time in many other similar twins.  You'll see less rolling moment during turbulence because of the inertia of the weight of a big engine on each wing - they move less than a single with the same force.  But also, turbulence in MSFS - especially 2020 - is pretty ridiculous and SHOULDN'T feel anything like it does in other airplanes.  Especially if you've got it set to realistic, which is anything but. 

Where I agree MSFS doesn't render turbulence well is in convection or cumulus clouds, but at the same time it's perfectly reasonable to be in thick stratus clouds with a glass smooth ride.  Wind over terrain seems to create pretty realistic mechanical turbulence.  Overall, I really REALLY like the Aerostar's flight model and hope they don't screw with it.  It really gives some sense of flying an airplane.

2020 vs 2024:  my position is just my own, but at the same time the points I'll make really aren't subjective, but objective realities: 

1.  Performance.  With TAA, frame gen, and NVIDIA CP forcing VSync on, I can remain locked at 60fps in any scenario I've found.  iFly Max, huge airport, messy complex weather, ton of Vatsim traffic, 60fps no problem with everything at high or ultra.  Zero stutters or tearing of any kind.  With a 3070.  Now, I'm only running 1080p which is certainly a factor, but this would not be even CLOSE to possible in 2020.  Performance is not even in the same ballpark. 

2.  Visuals.  I don't much care compared to point one and especially point three, but yeah.  It's better.  Terrain textures, sky textures and atmospherics, lighting etc.  Large improvement.  I even like the night lighting better and have trouble understanding what others are seeing (minus a nit-pick about too much bloom around runway lights).  Some of this one might be subjective, but I think most of it is objective too.  

3.  Physics.  This is the one that matters most to me and there are large improvements in crosswind physics and ground handling.  LARGE improvements, using the same aircraft in each sim to compare.  Aircraft with their own flight modeling like the iFly and the CAS Cub perform a LOT better when interacting with the base physics of 2024 vs 2020 and that's telling.  This one would be awful hard to give up.  I don't think crosswind landings have felt better in any sim I've tried, to include XP or DCS.

Now that at least one favorite airplane for each type of flying I like to do are working in 2024 (for me that's the CAS J-3, the Comanche and now Aerostar, the Milviz Porter, and the iFly Max), I really think I'll be uninstalling 2020 soon to free up space.  I waited to try it until it was stable and airplanes I cared about were available so I missed most of the early headaches, but at this point I see advantages and no negatives when comparing it to 2020.  But certainly, everyone should fly what they like and I don't see why you'd care about anyone else's choice.

5 minutes ago, sloppysmusic said:

Well yes, but that's NOT streaming then which was my point! Like if a sim let you stream AND/OR download the data you wanted offline that would be a major selling point for me. I think we're on the same page here, or at least the same book but maybe different pages.

Should probably move this offline, but just wanted to make it clear that I'm not talking about services who make their catalogs available for offline download listening, I'm talking about lossless streaming services who's entire catalog is available at no less than 44/16 lossless with many titles available up to 24/192 TO STREAM.  Not to download. 

See for example Tidal, which I've use for years now, who currently boast over 110 Million titles lossless at 44/16 or greater for streaming.  And while they were one of the first to embrace hi-res streaming they're no longer alone.  They also have some full Dolby Atmos titles as well.

 

Scott

I'm planning on switching sims with SU3 as I believe the niggles I have with SU2 will be fixed.

My GPU is working harder in 2024, and this significantly boosts the fps compared to the same flight in 2020. FSR3 is also better than Lossless Scaling.

The FSL neo and Aerostar will keep me busy until PMDG release the updated 737. Once that happens, farewell 2020, you served me well 💕

1 hour ago, Stearmandriver said:

Turbulence and the Aerostar: feels pretty good to me.  I'm not sure if I've ever seen flown an Aerostar - seems like I must have at some point - but I've spent too much time in many other similar twins.  You'll see less rolling moment during turbulence because of the inertia of the weight of a big engine on each wing - they move less than a single with the same force.  But also, turbulence in MSFS - especially 2020 - is pretty ridiculous and SHOULDN'T feel anything like it does in other airplanes.  Especially if you've got it set to realistic, which is anything but. 

 

Are you using SU2 or SU3 Beta? I agree with you about the CAS J3 Cub being a wonderful plane to fly. One of my short list favorites too. But I picked up the Starship last night and it’s incredible in every way. Not enough superlatives in the English language to describe it. And that flight model is incredible and weather does impact it as you would expect.

Edited July 16, 2025Jul 16 by Gulf76

1 hour ago, tttocs said:

Should probably move this offline, but just wanted to make it clear that I'm not talking about services who make their catalogs available for offline download listening, I'm talking about lossless streaming services who's entire catalog is available at no less than 44/16 lossless with many titles available up to 24/192 TO STREAM.  Not to download. 

See for example Tidal, which I've use for years now, who currently boast over 110 Million titles lossless at 44/16 or greater for streaming.  And while they were one of the first to embrace hi-res streaming they're no longer alone.  They also have some full Dolby Atmos titles as well.

 

Scott

Thanks for the info. I shall definitely look into Tidal for a start. My UK Internet can definitely cope with hi res AUDIO streaming. As long as we don't get up to 32bit float that is lol. 

Once again, another thread degenerates into a 2020 vs 2024 argument !

Back to subject, the new update for the aerostar works great. The new instrument glass looks the part now and the autopilot is also working fine. The remaining issues appear to be minor and in no way take away the experience of flying the aerostar. Good work !

Looking forward to the full manual being released.