Those are very impressive numbers for MSFS! I don't think the 2024 are bad at all, especially given the demographic of those taking this survey. I reckon "hardcore" simmers are more prone to prefer specific planes which are not yet ready for 2024 or have other stronger opinions to wait switching over fully. If you add the casual players, those numbers would look much different.

Data clearly shows that MSFS has pretty much done away with the competition, like Mike Tyson did away with his opponents in the first 30 seconds of a fight. 

35 minutes ago, St Mawgan said:

¿Y de qué encuesta proviene esa información? Y, según esa encuesta, ¿cuántos usuarios de MSFS deben tomarse en serio de los millones que lo usan o lo han usado?  

Are you really so naive that you think there are millions of active players in MFS?

Steam's figures tell a different story, and the development of 2024 where they have mainly focused on trying to build loyalty with the more arcade players as well.

2 minutes ago, B777ER said:

Love the people in this thread trying their best with the mental gymnastics of downplaying the poor showing of MS2024. Keep trying cause it ain’t working.

2024 essentially is essentially build on 2020  functionality. The previous gap between last MS sim FSX and FS2020 is tremendous comparing 2020 to 2024. I don't see 2024 as poor showing. Just like when XP11 first came up a lot of people were stull happy with XP10

59 minutes ago, psolk said:

All good dialog! It's proof that it is possible to have a conversation where we don't agree with each other but also don't start calling each other names or being rude either

I am enjoying this quite a bit as well.

I don't think anyone should be surprised at the numbers, either. I mean, the doom and gloom, 2024 never should exist crowd are eating well with this data. I think even with a perfect launch, the numbers would be closer. But 4 months in I think 2020 would still be ahead.

The true test will be next year's results. I can still see 2020 having a strong showing but 2024 should beat it. I don't expect it will be a reversal of the numbers, though.

On the topic of the Stream numbers, yes, I trust their comparison against the 2020 numbers because the data trends are obvious. That said, I also don't put too much stock in both sims seeing a decline right now. I am shocked, shocked I tell you that as the weather gets better gaming time might decrease.

1 hour ago, psolk said:

As it was I became a day 1 pessimist, then an SU1 pessimist, right now an SU2 pessimist and I am willing to bet there are a lot of others who feel very much the same.  I have doubts about 777 stability with the WASM issues around the 350.

This is more of a topic for the SU2 beta thread, but I am right there with you.

2 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

Data clearly shows that MSFS has pretty much done away with the competition, like Mike Tyson did away with his opponents in the first 30 seconds of a fight. 

MSFS alone had 71% of the market last year.  That's massive! Anyone would be happy with 70% market share 🙂

What surprised me is this GEOFS I've never even heard of ranking higher than P3D.  

3 minutes ago, Aglos77 said:

Are you really so naive that you think there are millions of active players in MFS?

Of course not. My point is that the vast percentage of MSFS users don't do surveys so the surveys are useless as indicators of trends. They are a survey of those who do surveys. Nothing more. 

According to Jorg last year, there are millions of active users.

1 hour ago, kerosene31 said:

That's just it, we ultimately don't have numbers on how many people play MSFS.  Could 23k people be a decent sample size?  Possibly, but we don't know the size of the entire population.  

I did see this survey on a lot of vendor social media, discord, etc so my guess is that it gets a decent sample of the serious simmer, but again there's no way to know for sure.  

My guess is that these numbers are reasonable to draw conclusions off of, but polling biases can happen.  

 

I am positive that Asobo knows exactly how many are using 2020 and 2024, and I am also positive that if 2024 showed better results, they would let us know about it. You notice all we hear from them are crickets. 

40 minutes ago, St Mawgan said:

Of course not. My point is that the vast percentage of MSFS users don't do surveys so the surveys are useless as indicators of trends. They are a survey of those who do surveys. Nothing more. 

 

Navigraph Survey potentially the most well know flightsim survey available again with written results is useless

You can't just dismiss away facts you don't like. 

It's no different than people dismissing the Steam numbers but quoting Jorg.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 16, 20251 yr by psolk

4 minutes ago, St Mawgan said:

Of course not. My point is that the vast percentage of MSFS users don't do surveys so the surveys are useless as indicators of trends. They are a survey of those who do surveys. Nothing more. 

You have no idea what the vast percentage of users do, you are just making up stuff. 

18 minutes ago, Ricardo41 said:

Data clearly shows that MSFS has pretty much done away with the competition, like Mike Tyson did away with his opponents in the first 30 seconds of a fight. 

Data since the days of FS9 shows that the competition is alive and healthy, and also had no ‘gaps’ in service. 

Edited April 16, 20251 yr by Ianrivaldosmith

Just now, psolk said:

Yes, Steam numbers are useless indicators (written data accessible to all)

Navigraph Survey potentially the most well know flightsim survey available again with written results is useless

Jorg's comments on a stream though, that's gospel...

 

You can't just dismiss away facts you don't like. 

Huh? I haven't mentioned Steam? 

5 minutes ago, BrammyH said:

According to Jorg last year, there are millions of active users.

According to Jorg in 2022/23, AI and ATC was going to be sorted 🤣

Edited April 16, 20251 yr by Ianrivaldosmith

8 minutes ago, St Mawgan said:

Huh? I haven't mentioned Steam? 

It's a common theme you further enforced which is any data presented that shows 2024 in a poor light is useless and meaningless and immediately dismissed yet the same people routinely reference a statement by Jorg with no data to actually back it up about the millions using 2024. 

 

Edited April 16, 20251 yr by psolk