19 minutes ago, honanhal said:

Yeah, this also seems like the obvious call to me, which is why I'm surprised at one developer who has always struck me as fairly savvy (ok, with one glaring exception) has NOT announced development for MSFS. I'm of course talking about FSL. Will be interesting to see where they go, and when. Or, if they don't go for MSFS, how they explain why.

This. FSLabs has always struck me as the cutting edge of FS development. They get a lot of things wrong outside of the sim (spyware, forum etiquette, policies, etc) but they know how to simulate a bird and do it well, so the fact that they haven't announced a stab at MSFS catches me by surprise. he two other devs that come very close to FSLabs in fidelity (FlyTheMaddog, PMDG) are already full steam into MSFS. I'm just as curious as you are to hear FSLab's explanation, if they ever give one.

I was going to hold out until the NG3, but I gave up and don't regret it.  I really like the DC-6, and it got me out of my 737/747/777 comfort zone that I've been in since 2013.  Also, I thought MSFS 2020 plus  PMDG quality airplane would mean me having to get a new system.  I'm happy to report I was wrong.  I made this video of the Washington, D.C. area:

 

3 hours ago, Aristoteles said:

I have been flying "follow the magenta line" planes in sims for 20 years. LNAV, VNAV, full automation. I found myself doing planning,programming and preflight checking them  way longer than actually "flying" them. 5 minute of takeoff procedure+5 minutes of AP off , mostly Autoland landings.

Exactly my point. Once you fly these tube liners for awhile, and get programming the FMC, ( which frankly is not that difficult to learn), there isn't much left to challenge the pilot. Companies like Boeing are even doing research on the idea of having computers conduct the entire flight, without pilots. Many airline pilots will tell you that when they take off, at around 1000 feet or less, they engage the autopilot and they really don't have to touch the controls until they are taxiing back to the ramp. You can't do that with aircraft like the DC6 or Connie. You have to be involved and thinking about what is going on, for the entire flight, from engine startup to arriving at your destination. 

Airbus will do a single pilot certification for their A350.

Karl

Prop liners take you back to the days when pilots were flyers and often depended on judgement and gut feeling based on experience. Like ole Jimmy Stewart said in “Flight of the Phoenix”,”wa ah remember the days when just gettin thar was an accomplishment “.

TV commercial: Lazy couch potato? Hypnotized by magenta line! Wait no more! Join DC-6 program and bring your six pack back! Discover flying without fancy fly by wire system and autothrottle . Now you are going to pump those throttles, mixtures, props and carb heat with you own muscles! No more climbing detents and boring constrains! You can blow your own engines anytime you want!

But wait if you call next few minutes you get AFE absolutely free! Yes, you can use AFE any time you want . Turn him on or off at you will and absolutely at no cost to you! 😃😜

19 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

The interesting part is once the majority of the PMDG products make it into MSFS, whether the final P3D holdouts who mainly fly PMDG planes in P3D, will stick with P3D or jump to MSFS.

FWIW, I'm one of those that will jump ship when a certain addon is released - NG3. Plainly for logistical and time reasons I personally prefer to concentrate on one sim and at this point it's still P3D given my first sentence, but after getting to have a go at the MSFS Alpha last year I'm eagerly awaiting the day I fly that 737 around the skies in MSFS. I have invested a lot into P3D myself and it's still giving me plenty of joy, but I've lost faith a bit in its progression and don't think it will at some point offer a similar experience to MSFS because I can't see LM pulling off the visual stuff that MSFS does. So from the point my aircraft are available for MSFS I can combine the airliner stuff I'm used to from P3D with the visual stuff in MSFS and unless LM surprise big time I don't see anything that would top that experience.

 

1 hour ago, WestAir said:

I'm just as curious as you are to hear FSLab's explanation, if they ever give one.

Last I read was that it's still the MSFS SDK limitations they refer to when asked about what will be happening with regards to MSFS (comment by one of the FSL devs in the sharklet hype thread on their forums recently). I will maintain the same view I did back when more developers were saying this - that we don't know what's under the hood of all the aircraft so one SDK limitation may actually hold back one developer even if it works for the other. It will be interesting nonetheless however to see if/when that changes now that not only AS but also PMDG have put a complex aircraft out there and are following with more rather soon.

My homemade sim rig is made of welded 1 inch square mild steel box tubing from Lowes,  with a racing seat,  flight stick, hotas, and rudder pedals bolted to it. I have two 50 watt tactile transducers bolted under my seat,   under my left and right butt cheeks.         They are hooked to a two channel 150 watt amp.     I use Andre's "Sim Shaker" app to power the transducers,  the app uses telemetry data streamed from the sim to create the correct tactile vibrations.  Each transducer can produce 30 pound feet of force.   Let's just say that rattling old birds like the DC-6 come alive.    I feel everything through my butt,  feet, and hands.   Combined with the sound of the radials and the shaking visual affects of the DC-6 and it's flipping great.

https://simshaker.com/software/general/

This is the amp/transducer combo I have,  and where I got it,   https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-APA150-With-2-Aura-Pro-Bass-Shakers-Bundle-300-9004

This combo has the same shakers,  with a 100 watt amp.   https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-SA100-With-2-Aura-Pro-Bass-Shakers-Bundle-300-9002

Should be more than acceptable since they are the same shakers I have and they are 50 watt.

/I've considered buying that second setup, so I can add two more transducers.  One under my left foot,  one under my right.   Four channels.  

//This is awesome for race sims too.   You can feel each corner of the car with a 4 shaker setup like that.

Side note,  Andre has another app that works with War Thunder aircraft,   which is one of my other pass times.

EDIT:  Hold the phone.   I think the SA100 is a one channel amp,  not two channels like the APA150.         On a side note,   anyone could just use an old home theater receiver.   The app supports up to 6 transducers,   so any old 50 watt RMS per channel 5.1 receiver would be perfect.

Edited June 28, 20214 yr by Waldo Pepper

25 minutes ago, threegreen said:

but I've lost faith a bit in its progression and don't think it will at some point offer a similar experience to MSFS because I can't see LM pulling off the visual stuff that MSFS does. So from 

 

I don't think LM will put too much money into improving P3D for the consumer home market.  Any money LM puts into P3D will probably be mostly focused on the commercial market.  And even for the commercial market, if MSFS keeps improving, MSFS has a real opportunity in entering the commercial market itself.

Remember that LM entered the X-Plane/FSX flight simulator market after Microsoft abandoned FSX.  And even to enter the X-Plane/FSX flight simulator market, LM purchased the base FSX code from Microsoft in order to make P3D.  My guess is, LM never really intended to fight against Microsoft because software/games isn't really LM's specialty.  While LM is a big aerospace company, they are not a big software company.  LM doesn't have the servers to stream real time satellite/photogrammetry the way Microsoft does with Azure.  LM doesn't have world wide satellite/photogrammetry data for consumer use that Microsoft does (perhaps LM has that data but it's restricted for commercial/military use only).  LM is so many steps behind Microsoft with P3D, LM's best bet is to abandon the consumer flight simulator market and just focus on its commercial customers (and hope Microsoft doesn't enter the commercial market down the road).

5 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

Yup.  Diversification is always the smart choice.  I mean, if another flight simulator for the home market is to come out in the next few years, and this upcoming flight simulator looks like it's more sophisticated and advanced than MSFS, a smart developer would look into potentially developing for that upcoming flight simulator too, rather than only focusing on MSFS.

Exactly :)

 

5 hours ago, abrams_tank said:

Compared to Blackberry developers, P3D & XPlane developers had plenty of advanced notice.

Over 4 to 5 years P3D and X-plane where on a totally different trajectory from that of MSFS since it was absent. Both were on a different time table with development priorities each with their respected roadmaps. You also have to remember that FSW was still in the picture at that time. They were trying to find its place in the scheme of things, part of that time until the plug was pull on them. Most of LR improvement where mostly under the hood and technical to address performance issue that was solve by going to Vulkan api. They are now able to address the visual improvements, now that transition is behind them.  

2 hours ago, BobFS88 said:

Exactly 🙂

 

Over 4 to 5 years P3D and X-plane where on a totally different trajectory from that of MSFS since it was absent. Both were on a different time table with development priorities each with their respected roadmaps. You also have to remember that FSW was still in the picture at that time. They were trying to find its place in the scheme of things, part of that time until the plug was pull on them. Most of LR improvement where mostly under the hood and technical to address performance issue that was solve by going to Vulkan api. They are now able to address the visual improvements, now that transition is behind them.  

Quite true X-Plane has been here for many years,it’s not going away. Quite honestly I still fly heavy metal on it,because my system really struggles with the glass cockpits in MSFS. I’ve been spoiled and having less than a consistent 30fps is a no go for me. So for now GA and the DC-6 on MSFS and heavy jets on X-PLANE-11

22 hours ago, Bobsk8 said:

Most aircraft I have flown like PMDG and A2A, in other sims, I have flown for many years. Same as flying in real life, I enjoy flying an aircraft that I like. No need to switch. You sound like the type of person that gets easily bored with what you are flying, not me. 

I do not get easily bored.  What I am is the type of person that likes realism and I struggle with how to make a plane that stopped production in 1958 fit into today's realism.   So after a little research today the aircraft is only used for military and wildfire fighting.   So I don't simulate those scenarios in my simming.  I will end with, you sound like a person that is quick to jump to conclusions. 

@Tierborn

FWIW the Six still earns her keep flying boxes in Alaska- daily. The Red Bull Six attends shows around the world, and so almost any routing is conceivable.

I do understand your viewpoint, and she’s not for everyone. If you change your mind, you may find she’s pretty darn good, and a trifle endearing to boot.

Best- C

22 hours ago, GCBraun said:

PMDG´s DC-6 for MSFS is legendary already. People will remember it years from now just like simming icons such as the Level-D 767 and Dreamfleet´s 727.

Not disagreeing here but why wasn't this the case when it was released for P3D?

24 minutes ago, Tierborn said:

I do not get easily bored.  What I am is the type of person that likes realism and I struggle with how to make a plane that stopped production in 1958 fit into today's realism.   So after a little research today the aircraft is only used for military and wildfire fighting.   So I don't simulate those scenarios in my simming.  I will end with, you sound like a person that is quick to jump to conclusions. 

The most active 6's are actually Cargo birds in Alaska "I believe."  Everts air at one time had almost 12 of them with their C46's I think.   Not sure what date of production has to do with anything.  Date of retirement from service is far more relevant than date of production.  Lot's of old birds still out there but to each their own if you have no desire to fly this one in the sim.  

Edited June 29, 20214 yr by psolk