4 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I just don’t see the point in having an immersive study-level airliner with a laughable frustrating ATC and flight plan solution. 

This is why there are third-party ATC and flight plan add-ons for all the major flight sims. MSFS is not too different from any of the others in this respect, in fact it's actually better than most others because at least you can put SIDs, STARs and transitions in a default flight plan in MSFS. So by your argument, it's not worth having a fancy airliner in FSX or P3D either.

IMHO, the most interesting part of their reveals would be their potentially very different pricing strategies.

I have a feeling that $200 would cover both in total sufficiently but the allocation may be very uneven 

Edited August 7, 20214 yr by MegaRiceBall

9 minutes ago, Chock said:

This is why there are third-party ATC and flight plan add-ons for all the major flight sims. MSFS is not too different from any of the others in this respect, in fact it's actually better than most others because at least you can put SIDs, STARs and transitions in a default flight plan in MSFS. So by your argument, it's not worth having a fancy airliner in FSX or P3D either.

I never tried the other simulators, but you’re right, if they are as bad as this, then no point having an immersive aircraft there either.

For me, the immersion is only as good as the weakest link. And in this simulator, that’s definitely the comical ATC and the buggy Nav. I mean maybe you guys are happy that the seat belt switch works on the over head panel as ATC flys you into a mountain or your aircraft is suddenly turning away from your destination for no reason, but I’m not.

Sure, you can get better ATC for even more money, but I’m not aware of any solution to the U-turn when entering an approach after its assigned by ATC on arrival.
 

So is MSFS just providing the basic terrain, and you buy everything else separately… Planes, ATC, Flight Planners, Scenery, Airports. It’s pretty bad when you start thinking about it. 

Edited August 7, 20214 yr by Virtual-Chris

2 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I never tried the other simulators, but you’re right, if they are as bad as this, then no point having an immersive aircraft there either.

For me, the immersion is only as good as the weakest link. And in this simulator, that’s definitely the comical ATC and the buggy Nav. I mean maybe you guys are happy that the seat belt switch works on the over head panel as ATC flys you into a mountain or your aircraft is suddenly turning away from your destination for no reason, but I’m not.

Sure, you can get better ATC for even more money, but I’m not aware of any solution to the U-turn when entering an approach after its assigned by ATC on arrival.
 

So is MSFS just providing the basic terrain, and you buy everything else separately… Planes, ATC, Flight Planners, Scenery, Airports. It’s pretty bad when you start thinking about it. 

This is why things like VATSIM exist.

17 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I just don’t see the point in having an immersive study-level airliner with a laughable frustrating ATC and flight plan solution. 

You are more than welcome joining us on VATSIM. If you need any assistance please don't hesitate contacting me 🙂 If you fly an immersive study level aircraft, best place flying it with immersive study level ATC is online.

My wallet is all in on AMC....

I am very much looking forward to the 737 and the A320 though. I uninstalled my 700GB+ P3D V4 install the other day as I just cannot stomach going back to such a dull unrealistic simulator regardless of what airframes I have in that sim. 

MSFS 2020 is just an outstandingly incredible flight simulator and I am thoroughly looking forward to the next 5 years with the simulator.

35 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I never tried the other simulators, but you’re right, if they are as bad as this, then no point having an immersive aircraft there either.

For me, the immersion is only as good as the weakest link. And in this simulator, that’s definitely the comical ATC and the buggy Nav. I mean maybe you guys are happy that the seat belt switch works on the over head panel as ATC flys you into a mountain or your aircraft is suddenly turning away from your destination for no reason, but I’m not.

Sure, you can get better ATC for even more money, but I’m not aware of any solution to the U-turn when entering an approach after its assigned by ATC on arrival.
 

So is MSFS just providing the basic terrain, and you buy everything else separately… Planes, ATC, Flight Planners, Scenery, Airports. It’s pretty bad when you start thinking about it. 

Welcome to Flightsimming. 
Stop crying - go to VATSIM. Install PFPX. Or use Simbrief. 
 

Problems solved 🙂

54 minutes ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I never tried the other simulators, but you’re right, if they are as bad as this, then no point having an immersive aircraft there either.

For me, the immersion is only as good as the weakest link. And in this simulator, that’s definitely the comical ATC and the buggy Nav. I mean maybe you guys are happy that the seat belt switch works on the over head panel as ATC flys you into a mountain or your aircraft is suddenly turning away from your destination for no reason, but I’m not.

Sure, you can get better ATC for even more money, but I’m not aware of any solution to the U-turn when entering an approach after its assigned by ATC on arrival.
 

So is MSFS just providing the basic terrain, and you buy everything else separately… Planes, ATC, Flight Planners, Scenery, Airports. It’s pretty bad when you start thinking about it. 

Why don’t you just use VATSIM.  No matter how good they make ATC, it still won’t be as good as VATSIM. It’s weird that you are griping about ATC but a better version of it, VATSIM or Pilot Edge, exist and can be used with MSFS.

ATC does the job for me.  VATSIM for others but I'm sensitive and don't like to dealing with live bodies.

Regards

bs

Edited August 7, 20214 yr by bean_sprout

PMDG 737 and 777 day ones for me probably. Fenix maybe but I prefer Boeing. 
 

Would LOVE a 757 and/or 737CL (like the IXEG offering in x-plane). Fingers crossed. I won’t buy a captainsim product again now after my experiences in P3D.

52 minutes ago, bean_sprout said:

ATC does the job for me.  VATSIM for others but I don't like to deal with live bodies.

Regards

bs

As soon as I hear a 10 year old boy on Vatsim,the immersion is destroyed.

13 minutes ago, BIGSKY said:

As soon as I hear a 10 year old boy on Vatsim,the immersion is destroyed.

100% agree. but that could easily be avoided if one could choose only controllers based on:

age/hours served as Vatsim controller etc.

do they not have such a feature?

I agree that sometimes Vatsim can be occasionally be inhabited by immature sorts.  That said, some of those 10 year olds do a very professional job, and it's just the voice that grates.  There's always the ancient pedantic prig....

Some will probably grow up to be the FO on a future flight you're on.  I try and give them the benefit of the doubt.  That said, sometimes, I do disconnect 😉

C

3 hours ago, Virtual-Chris said:

I never tried the other simulators, but you’re right, if they are as bad as this, then no point having an immersive aircraft there either.

For me, the immersion is only as good as the weakest link. And in this simulator, that’s definitely the comical ATC and the buggy Nav. I mean maybe you guys are happy that the seat belt switch works on the over head panel as ATC flys you into a mountain or your aircraft is suddenly turning away from your destination for no reason, but I’m not.

Sure, you can get better ATC for even more money, but I’m not aware of any solution to the U-turn when entering an approach after its assigned by ATC on arrival.
 

So is MSFS just providing the basic terrain, and you buy everything else separately… Planes, ATC, Flight Planners, Scenery, Airports. It’s pretty bad when you start thinking about it. 

Spend a couple of dollars and get a good ATC program. I have had PF3 for years now, probably cost me less than a penny a day at most. 

19 minutes ago, cavaricooper said:

I agree that sometimes Vatsim can be occasionally be inhabited by immature sorts.  That said, some of those 10 year olds do a very professional job, and it's just the voice that grates.  There's always the ancient pedantic prig....

Some will probably grow up to be the FO on a future flight you're on.  I try and give them the benefit of the doubt.  That said, sometimes, I do disconnect 😉

C

The thing that made me quit Vatsim years ago, is there never is any controllers when and  where I want to fly. This is really bad with MSFS, because you  can  fly anywhere in the world. Who needs to fly talking to yourself on Unicom? 

Edited August 7, 20214 yr by Bobsk8