For what it's worth to the group that have participated in this thread so far, I did see the MD-11 working at Expo.  Critically, TFDi did not limit users to just touching one particular aspect of the plane either.  I also spoke at length with two of the developers, and they are ready willing and able to talk about is working and not quite there yet with the systems, etc.  Dedication to the project is not an issue from what I could tell -- and this only reinforces their extensive communication on their Discord.  No product is perfect.  I'm sure they'll be some issues.  Still, for those that did participate in the presale (including me), it does look to be more or less on track and very promising indeed.  

 

57 minutes ago, Iadbound said:

For what it's worth to the group that have participated in this thread so far, I did see the MD-11 working at Expo.  Critically, TFDi did not limit users to just touching one particular aspect of the plane either.  I also spoke at length with two of the developers, and they are ready willing and able to talk about is working and not quite there yet with the systems, etc.  Dedication to the project is not an issue from what I could tell -- and this only reinforces their extensive communication on their Discord.  No product is perfect.  I'm sure they'll be some issues.  Still, for those that did participate in the presale (including me), it does look to be more or less on track and very promising indeed.  

 

Been reading this thread, and feel as though this is one of few actually useful points. Somebody who has seen the product and has some insight into its development. Thanks for sharing!

According to MS, FS2020 has 3,000,000 'hardcore' users .. not 3 thousand .. 3 million. And overall sales of 12 million (so maybe some of the hardcore simmers are using xbox...)

I say they are shooting themselves in the foot but hey, they can charge whatever they want and 'let the market decide' if it is correct price or not.

1 hour ago, Freq_flyer44 said:

And overall sales of 12 million

No, not sales. Users. The vast majority of them are XBOX game pass users, so actual sales might only be those 3 million "hardcore" users. And this also tells you what he understands as "hardcore": using MSFS more than casually (e.g. every day). But don't confuse this with harcore simmers, this is a whole different category and is maybe 10000 to 20000 at max. All in all his focus is definitely not hard harcore simmers, which - from an economic point of view - is understandable seeing that only a very small portion of the userbase falls into that category.

12 minutes ago, Fiorentoni said:

But don't confuse this with harcore simmers, this is a whole different category and is maybe 10000 to 20000 at max

Where did you get that figure from? 

You're saying that of the entire current userbase of MSFS, only 0.16 % are hardcore users?   (Those who purchase hardware, use charts, use VATSIM etc).  Highly doubtful. Even if you base it on 3m instead or 12m,  I doubt that.

VATSIM has 110,000 active users

 

Edited June 27, 20232 yr by ErichB

1 hour ago, ErichB said:

Where did you get that figure from? 

You're saying that of the entire current userbase of MSFS, only 0.16 % are hardcore users?   (Those who purchase hardware, use charts, use VATSIM etc).  Highly doubtful. Even if you base it on 3m instead or 12m,  I doubt that.

VATSIM has 110,000 active users

 

No I don't consider someone who buys a yoke or uses charts a "hardcore simmer". Those are (advanced) "hardcore users" which fall under the 3 million.
I mean e.g. those here on Avsim (and even here they are not a majority), that care about correct flight dynamics, cirrus clouds, historical weather, ground physics, as-high-fidelity-as-possible aircraft etc. Those that rather would see base/core improvements on MSFS before any other content is added. You get the point.
Those are certainty a small minority among the hardcore users, which use MSFS every day.
 

2 hours ago, Freq_flyer44 said:

According to MS, FS2020 has 3,000,000 'hardcore' users .. not 3 thousand .. 3 million. And overall sales of 12 million (so maybe some of the hardcore simmers are using xbox...)

I say they are shooting themselves in the foot but hey, they can charge whatever they want and 'let the market decide' if it is correct price or not.

******* that's absurd. Okay, I'll shut up and get in the corner now about not catering to the XBox audience. 

I have a feeling we ivory tower P3D/XP/etc. exiles to MSFS are significantly dwarved by the new entrants in the community who don't engage with any of the communities at all, or who are on the fs.com forum. I can certainly imagine a ton of people who get MSFS, get engaged by the community stuff, multiplayer, the marketplace, and never realize something like AVSIM or a heritage of the simulator exist, because it wasn't part of their initial experience.

Lots of potential for this hobby to grow exponentially with numbers like that. 

8 minutes ago, mspencer said:

******* that's absurd. Okay, I'll shut up and get in the corner now about not catering to the XBox audience. 

I have a feeling we ivory tower P3D/XP/etc. exiles to MSFS are significantly dwarved by the new entrants in the community who don't engage with any of the communities at all, or who are on the fs.com forum. I can certainly imagine a ton of people who get MSFS, get engaged by the community stuff, multiplayer, the marketplace, and never realize something like AVSIM or a heritage of the simulator exist, because it wasn't part of their initial experience.

Lots of potential for this hobby to grow exponentially with numbers like that. 

When I first started flightsimming in 1998, I didn't realise there were addons for FS98 until about a year later.  And only after that, I discovered the forum community.  I was hooked from day 1 of FS98 and considered myself 'hardcore' then - I was obsessed with it and my Microsoft Sidewinder joystick.   I dreamed about having a flightsim like FS2020 and here we are.

I'm naturally cautious about pre-ordering anything, but I will definitely be getting the MD-11 once it's 100% done. I love that aircraft, still in service, and a nice change from all the twin-jets.

 

Just wanted to post this quick interview with FSElite that may be worth a watch

 

On 6/26/2023 at 1:56 PM, Peter Z KCLE_EDDN said:

Alright, enough. One more personal attack and this gets locked!

Why do the rest of us have to suffer?  Just ban the offenders and remove their posts.

1 hour ago, ryanbatc said:

Why do the rest of us have to suffer?  Just ban the offenders and remove their posts.

I agree - mods are becoming too quick to lock an entire thread because of a few bad apples. Give them a day off from the forums and let the rest of us chat.

Edited June 29, 20232 yr by Keirtt

My philosophy is pretty simple. Never pre-order. It's the same for video games. 

Sure. if I pre-order I get a $10 discount, but considering what we spend in add-ons, is that really worth being locked into a purchase of a relatively expensive product that may or may not be good?

Mind you, nothing wrong with the developer trying that route. Pre-orders are certainly helpful to their side (and I have much less appreciation for their likely intentionally FOMO-inducing limited package with the "rare" variant). I simply don't fall for it, and if you're not sure you're going to like this aircraft, you probably should consider just waiting as well. 

Edited June 30, 20232 yr by Abriael

In the interview posted, he said they will be releasing some demo vids to show the level of where the plane is at in development. Sounds promising but I don't think I'm going to put down the $ yet. Want to see finished product. Actually more excited about the 717 eventually because I do short hops and it is a unique and quirky plane.

I was ok kicking them some dough to help fund the project.  I like the TFDi guys and I was happy with the 717.  I've seen many of their previews for this MD-11.  It looks far better than their work on the 717.   I get that not everybody is comfortable with it.  But I was going to buy it anyway...

They also have videos from FSexpo actually showing it flying.  Obviously not with all systems a go.