Perhaps the misunderstanding in the start-up procedure in the mind of some may be coming from the sequence:

1/ Pre-start (cold engine): Prime the engine with fuel on fuller tank, full throttle, full mixture, fuel pump on, then after 6 s, reduce throttle above idle, shut mixture,

2/ Engine start: Crank engine, when it starts to wake-up, bring mixture to full

You would do the Pre-start with lean mixture only if you make a hot start.

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by Bernard Ducret

9 hours ago, UrgentSiesta said:

This is always what tempts me with a new BS addon. He’s materially improving his fidelity with each successive addon.

But he’s so prolific that while he does patch bugs, (AFAIK) he doesn’t seem to do much feature backporting (tho I stand to be corrected)

Nick is constantly adding features to his old products. The TBM didn't even have a tablet when it was released.

25 minutes ago, Bernard Ducret said:

You would do the Pre-start with lean mixture only if you make a hot start.

Not according to this manual:

https://manualzz.com/doc/29709762/lycoming-o-540--a---b---e---g---h---f---j---l--io-540--a-...?utm_source=chatgpt.com&p=28

Also, check here, where the developer is chiming in:

Just Flight Community

Is it maybe possible that the startup procedure is incorr...

Is it possible that the startup procedure is incorrect? In all the Commander 114 checklists I could find online, it states that—typical for Lycoming engines—...

Edited 15 hours ago15 hr by Rimshot

I've just tried it in the sim, and if you turn the key (with the mixture to cut off), then slowly bring the mixture up, it feels pretty convincing.

I mean it won't start until there's some mixture, but AFAIK all piston addons in MSFS are like that - except the A2A Aerostar, which has custom coding for this procedure.

The difference between the real approach and the simulated approach here, is about 3mm of mixture movement, to get the engine to catch.

It won't stop me enjoying this fantastic plane 😎

PS... I made an error in a previous post, where I said that the COWS DA-42XLS does not simulate the fuel-injected Lycoming start procedure correctly. I note from comments in the Just Flight forum that it does indeed.

Edited 11 hours ago11 hr by JYW

4 hours ago, Rimshot said:

Oh bummer. I really don't like this. It seems A2A is the only developer doing it right... I probably wouldn't have purchased the plane if I had known this before, no matter how good it is besides this. I'm just a sucker for realism.

Different strokes I guess. Would I like this to be completely correct? Sure. Does it ruin the plane for me? Absolutely not, as there's so much here that he gets right that others get wrong, and as @JYW points out, you can follow the proper procedure - almost. You just can't wait for the engine to fire before you start to advance mixture. The engine model doesn't allow it, and Nick discusses the drawbacks of some proposed workarounds in the Just Flight forum.

A2A are the only ones I know of who model this precisely - something they're able to do because they completely bypass the MSFS engine modeling, substituting their own.

Scott

Yeah, its disappointing because getting it to start is an important part of a piston plane.

At the same time, its only a small part and apart from A2A I don't think (I could be wrong) I have seen anybody else to it properly. Most cheat.

I was able to start it following proper procedure. Its pretty close to the real thing.
I have also started it with the mixture all the way up.
Just not sure if it will start no matter what you do.

Edited 10 hours ago10 hr by Ron Lefebvre

57 minutes ago, tttocs said:

Different strokes I guess. Would I like this to be completely correct? Sure. Does it ruin the plane for me? Absolutely not, as there's so much here that he gets right that others get wrong, and as @JYW points out, you can follow the proper procedure - almost. You just can't wait for the engine to fire before you start to advance mixture. The engine model doesn't allow it, and Nick discusses the drawbacks of some proposed workarounds in the Just Flight forum.

You are right, it is a fantastic addon. Nick is even considering adding the extra realism as you may have read at the Justflight forums. So who knows? For now I might take up the advice of @JYW 👍

My policy of never buying aircraft immediately after release has paid off this week, I avoided the poor 220 debut and now this. We all have different things that break realism for us, different things we are more easily able to accept compromise on, but this one would have really bothered me, especially because A2A has it correct. So I will hold off until this is corrected -- but there go my long-weekend, civic holiday plans!

This said, the aircraft has rightfully received nothing but positive comments all around and is a stellar addition to our hobby. Every aircraft we fly has things that are not fully correct -- just look at virtually every PMDG post and someone will chirp in with how some things are not modeled correctly like the real thing -- the aim is a convincing illusion of aircraft operations and flight and here Blacksquare has certainly hit the ball out of the park. And my, likely unreasonable, compunction about something like realistic starting aside.

It is kind of the consequence of modeling things with so much fidelity, small things begin to stand out even more.

20 minutes ago, Rimshot said:

Nick is even considering adding the extra realism as you may have read at the Justflight forums.

Which is great! I hope he can come up with a solid mechanism to do so. The guy is simply amazing in my book.

And following up on something I'd written earlier - I did break down and put my TDS 750/650 pairing in the plane just to do a test. Did a fairly extended flight from 7S3 (Bill Womack's beautiful rendition of Stark's Twin Oaks) to KSUN on a GPS flight plan making extensive use of the autopilot.

I did not see a single disengagement of the AP in NAV mode the entire flight. Whatever is going on is restricted to NAV mode tracking a VOR radial. And again, to be clear I know what to do (and not do) using NAV mode tracking a radial.

It's not a big deal, but a curiosity and as noted earlier, this may well be something the RW unit is prone to. I also have to note that for this particular plane, I had much more fun using the vintage avionics. I love and appreciate modern avionics, but... nostalgia and all that. For multiple reasons, I think this will become my go-to plane when I want to revert to the spirit of my early flying days.

Scott

5 hours ago, tttocs said:

Which is great! I hope he can come up with a solid mechanism to do so. The guy is simply amazing in my book.

And following up on something I'd written earlier - I did break down and put my TDS 750/650 pairing in the plane just to do a test. Did a fairly extended flight from 7S3 (Bill Womack's beautiful rendition of Stark's Twin Oaks) to KSUN on a GPS flight plan making extensive use of the autopilot.

I did not see a single disengagement of the AP in NAV mode the entire flight. Whatever is going on is restricted to NAV mode tracking a VOR radial. And again, to be clear I know what to do (and not do) using NAV mode tracking a radial.

It's not a big deal, but a curiosity and as noted earlier, this may well be something the RW unit is prone to. I also have to note that for this particular plane, I had much more fun using the vintage avionics. I love and appreciate modern avionics, but... nostalgia and all that. For multiple reasons, I think this will become my go-to plane when I want to revert to the spirit of my early flying days.

Scott

Scott, what KSUN do you use? Never found a good one.

Thanks

dd

It's crazy to me that people are now avoiding addons because the timing of an engine start is just a tiny bit off from real life.

I'm just shocked.

Maybe some of you need to get back into a real plane.

10 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

I'm just shocked.

How long have you been Flight Simming? I'd have thought you'd have got over folk by now. 🙄

14 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

It's crazy to me that people are now avoiding addons because the timing of an engine start is just a tiny bit off from real life.

I'm just shocked.

Maybe some of you need to get back into a real plane.

Isn’t it ironic that we’ve reached the level of realism where anything less than reality is unacceptable. 😂

2 minutes ago, Ron Attwood said:

How long have you been Flight Simming? I'd have thought you'd have got over folk by now. 🙄

This is a newer thing. We have addons so advanced that people are complaining that it's not 1:1 of real life! For 50 USD mind you.

All the while we sit in our comfy office chairs, have unrealistic hardware, very unrealistic ATC, and we look at tiny screens that don't resemble a cockpit at all. Maybe very few have a home cockpit. Still all of this is nothing like real flying.

We're closer than we've ever been for in depth GA addons and people are refusing to purchase because something isn't exactly like real life....it's hilarious.

Maybe I need break from simming. A permanent one.

16 minutes ago, ryanbatc said:

Maybe I need break from simming. A permanent one.

Nah.

A. It’s a little bit cheaper than flying.

B. You’d miss it terribly.

C. The rest of us need some of this type of perspective from time to time. 😂👍